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Reading this thread was kinda a wild ride. At one stage Oreo seems to be saying they need 500+ nations to deal with GGO because the lower tiers don't matter and the whales are OP. Then they argue that Midgard (a low to mid tier sphere) is a match for their sphere (a upper to whale tier sphere).

Description: Guided Munition System is a national project that allows power plants to be a targettable category when firing missiles. Cost: $30,000,000, 2,000 steel, 2,000 aluminum. Requires Telecommunications Satellite --- Simple - but expensive - buff to missiles.

I think he meant Rose for #1 :galaxybrain:. Also if you're not the same alliance in game that's just how most bots work they'll do alliance per alliance stats, feel free to combine or whatever I don't think anyone is stopping you.

Are any of us really in a major alliance?

I mean the forums are a place of discussion and arguing at each other until someone gives up or they both die. Even if you aren't high gov FA or a leader. If you post on the forums (especially a post regarding something controversial), then you gotta be ready to take on the heat and fire back shots. That's just my thoughts. Just trying to play damage control at this rate. But at the end of the day, you have a sphere that can take on any sphere 1v1 and win without any problems whatsoever. When even GGO can't take them on alone, you know it's OP. Also thanks to Eclipse for boosting my reputation, who knew all I had to do was call them out to farm it.

This is what makes me split on whether this is a good idea or not, everyone would do this towards the beginning of wars in order to better themselves which would then make RNG for wars even more of a weighted factor than it already is. If your missiles miss and they hit your power plants, welp, enjoy sweet death. IDK, interesting idea that really gets the blood pumping on a Monday afternoon.

quite later than I intended but still later DJ Firewolf — What are your thoughts on the recent diplomatic changes? WANA — I think HW disbanded so as to put pressure on Celestial to also disband. Frankly, I am not super happy right now. DJ Firewolf — That is awesome to hear especially from you over in syndicate WANA — They hit us under economic pretenses and then try and force us to drop allies. DJ Firewolf — WANA —That leaves a bad taste in my mouth. DJ Firewolf — Good, find a way to deal with it WANA — I quite like my allies, so them doing this is shitty. We will. Frankly, their entire plot is blatantly craven. DJ Firewolf — I can get where you're coming from but they also have a point, they're trying to drive more towards multi polarity, like they have been for the past couple years, especially the ones outside of ex Hollywood WANA — They tried to drive towards multi-polar by making themselves into the biggest hegemony since NPO? This is realpolitik at it's finest. They don't give a shit about the meta, frankly. All they care about is molding the political sphere into something that benefits them. DJ Firewolf — Last I recall, you guys at syndicate were the ones that were next to npo not them WANA — They're opportunists. That's a historical misinterpretation. Also, I will note, GG literally did not split. They're opportunists. DJ Firewolf — That should be a good thing for certain things they do. All they did was make a complete whale bloc beside Oblivion Probably to also poke at you guys further on what you guys should do WANA — Sure DJ Firewolf — It's thinking hard buddy, there's a long road up ahead and it's going to be bumpy as !@#$ WANA — They knew that if they stayed together they'd be next in line to get rolled. DJ Firewolf — And you ain't going to have the slim amount of allies and as well friends and very few spheres like there used to be to back down to WANA — Hmm? DJ Firewolf — I'm referring to how alliances were split up as big as they were before with a few to several big alliances in one bloc split into very few spheres WANA — I’m interested to see if any of the new spheres expand further. DJ Firewolf — Do it yourself num num WANA — Join TKRsphere? DJ Firewolf — You are not recreating quack. Why are you even considering that? Why are you considering going backwards?! WANA — I’m not sure what it is you’re asking me to do. DJ Firewolf — I'm saying the best thing for you to do is find a way on sorting out celestial WANA — How so? DJ Firewolf — Personally if ggo wants to be together, keep Rose and syndicate together to still counteract that along with I believe you still have R&R. That would be your biggest assets remaining together alongside your current prots WANA — I hear you. DJ Firewolf — As much as I really despise you two together, especially how Rose treats me, I would still think that would be the best option out while cutting everyone else WANA — Makes sense, I don't know the relationship you and Rose have. DJ Firewolf — I'm too toxic for their taste apparently. Even when I offer honest criticism that I don't mean any harm with or even a light-hearted joke that has no dirty or dark humor in it meant to just poke shit at someone WANA — Interesting DJ Firewolf — I'm sorry dude but you got me laughing to hard WANA — Yeah? DJ Firewolf — Your seethe WANA — In RON? It wasn’t seething I am not Partisan. I’m never going to be Partisan. DJ Firewolf — In here WANA — Hmm? DJ Firewolf — Oh nothing WANA — You know a thing or two about people treating you shitty. DJ Firewolf — Just consider a ggo counter WANA — That’s fair

Because 1) TEST is a different alliance in game, despite being under Eclipse's banner 2) bot makers are lazy, and can't be arsed to keep track of alliance offshoot number 97 You can just merge the AAs and you'll be shown under Eclipse's stats, lol

Y'all can't be serious. GGO has less than 100 members. You're currently beating them in a war without using the full size of your sphere. What the !@#$ are you smoking? It's like y'all saw that t$ admitted it's paranoia around GG and you took that as an invitation to dive in and show them what real paranoia looks like.

Especially if you're Rose who hasn't shown any competence in a hot while.

The justification : stop believing in minispheres with GGO around. Yw.

There's no way people will agree to this on its face. Tweak: Project makes power plants hittable only if you don't choose a target.

That would be true if I believe Sphinx himself didn't tell me otherwise. They are a part of Eclipse, unless that has changed over the last few months. Similar to eS and tS.

Truth is, no one cares about mini spheres or "balancing" unless they are the ones with the power to broker it

We should set up a formal quarterly alliance swap, guardian for rose; cool?

Guess a no response means an admission of defeat.

I think we both can agree that minispheres is an almost impossible idea since it requires everyone to bend to the rules of it. And alliances don't want to be at the bottom. And even before I joined guardian I don't think GG were big proponents of it at all. As for me crying out about the gap, you got it wrong friend. I may think it's a cowards move personally since there is no sphere that can take y'all on 1v1, but I'm gonna play devils advocate and applaud this move since I think this RoseXEclipse villain arc will make politics very interesting and more fun unlike these past few months. As for GGO not having a challenging war GW25 was a challenging war not only for GGO but for the whole of HW. Yes we did hit them while they were somewhat demilled but 1. considering how big of a upper tier they had, it would have been almost impossible to win had they been milled. The spy war wasn't easy as well since it took everyone to win it, and TI getting ignored by Celestial. 2. Celestial had all the info they needed to not only prepare for the war, but to prepare a counter blitz on HW. They had the info detailing when we were gonna hit them, and how we were gonna hit them. As for how they didn't act upon it, don't ask me. As for y'all, Clock had the power to take on HW back when y'all had HoF and Aurora, what happened there? got some cold feet?

I mean I used to care. And yes, I was naive to think that, because I still fail to see balanced wars and GGO certainly isn't a pioneer on that matter either. The only people who pull out fights they can "lose" is HoF, nobody else has any right to complain about "minispheres" not being a thing. Certainly not you, you never will. You can cry all you want, but there is a huge strength gap between GGO and TEst and TEst was in fact never in a position to 1v1 Grumpy, let alone GGO. But let's say i'm still waiting for GGO's first challenging offensive war too then (... unless you call hitting unmilitarized opponents challenging maybe ...) 🙏

Previous poster might very well be spot on but using 'y'all' twice makes you sound like Bush Jr. We don't have hidden WMD's!

Friend, we never truly have had minispheres. TKR-T$ time, all "minispheres" joined together to dogpile them. Then we had EMC 2.0 forming a sphere with absolute upper tier control vs Oasis-Rose. Then we have had Ro$e and now we have Reclipse and Oasis 3.0 Going by this logic, we have always have had a supersphere at one time or another which a minisphere would not be able to defeat. In such a situation, it almost becomes necessary for these smaller people to consolidate. As long as power imbalances exist, a true minisphere world can never be formed. As long as one side has even a bit more power, the other side will be forced to gain more power. And gaining power via more bodies is faster, easier and cheaper than going the route of rigorous training. The concept of minispheres is like Communism. Great on paper, horrible in execution. Except that each time all these minispheres would chain via sekrit treaties, inevitably creating a big sphere. I haven't seen any alliance show competence save a few in the past 5 years.

tfw you're a test member and you go check out the discord of your new found allies Oh yeah, this is an unholy alliance, and I'm liking it

This is just false. For someone who isn't in Cata you sure "know alot". Every war we've been in with Cata we've both decided to be for it. It was fairly easy to communicate with each other and agree as well as we had similar views on most things. Nobody was dragged into anything otherwise the wars would of never happened. @His Holy Decagon Would you like to confirm this?

Hilarious part of this post is that Cataclysm had to basically drag Eclipse into any war that wasn’t a curbstomp.

Unpopular Opinion: No One Deserves Anything

If Rose and Eclipse shouldn't be together because that would be too powerfull, which sphere does deserve the position of most powerful? Seems to me that besides HoF and Aargh perhaps, all aa's try to be safe in spheres and treaties.

As pointed out now, I find the justification for forming this sphere to be lacking. HW no longer exists... and given the current wars they haven't gotten away with what they did either.

Midgard from the top of my head, they're pretty huge.

Midguard fairly easily, give us a fight that is, but they likely won't win with current tiering Edit: But as we have shown, anything is possible in love and war ❤️

Which ones? Name them, I'm intrigued.

Just say your reading comprehension isn't the best. First off, I'm actually mid gov in Weebunism, your first mistake there. Second, we're signing Rose to match your upper tier, and it's not even a bipolar world, as there are other blocs that can easily give us a fight with or without blitz advantage. Third, cope and seethe, you no longer can win every war you wage, as you'll find it pretty infuriating that there are actual competent alliances challenging you now. You sound like a salt mine, and I'm all here for it.

I love you too Also I didn't know that a little MA head from weeb has enough rep that you stop responding to me.

Where was your nonsense when we were picking fights with larger spheres? Clock was also the reason why the biggest two spheres signed a public MDP until we were done with our shenanigans. You preaching minispheres now whilst keeping your mouth shut before reeks of hypocrisy of the highest order. If you were so concerned with your blabbering, why didn't you speak up before? A shame really, I thought you had a shred of common sense.

Breaking news, alliance leader gets caught for hypocrisy, oh no, anyways. We weren't the ones who made you disappear for those months, nor were we the ones who put you in your current position. I find it frankly embarrassing that one of the formerly most vocal players decided to dedicate themselves to permanent ally and devotee of Rose when you and your alliance could be trying for so much more. I did my part to light the fire and burn paper already. It seems like your only idea of chaos is living in an upside down logic world where only you and your allies are able to take a collective dump on the rest of the game. If that was your goal, I hope you're proud of yourself. Except that this is the closest we have ever come to minispheres by far. Just as we came this close to greatness certain people decided to go in the complete opposite direction. All this does is give the people who made this sphere an excuse to justify something which, I daresay, at least some of them knew was an indication that something has gone horribly wrong.

God damn it, I forgot to say this on the first page: Finally Rose and Camelot are reunited!

My man be living in a fantasy world where people look to me for FA decisions instead of pulling lots for who gets to deal with me being angry at everything and venting for 45 minutes because I'm on record repeatedly as hating literally everything about this games politics. Y'all wanna make my dreams come true, just cancel all your treaties. I been dreaming of that since I yoinked pantheons bank, figured the swirling vortex of aimless chaos would be fun to watch. But nobody wants to do it and then asks me why I haven't made it happen yet like anybody sane listens to a lunatic who wants to light the world on fire. Do it yourself, you're the ones took my matches and Jerry can away.

We're not mad, just disappointed.

Whether people like it or not, is there a mechanism whereby we could code and test it to get a real feel for it? Lots of good points in the thread, but I'd love to see your past idea of having a rolling supply of tweaks getting used on the test server.

As much as one wants, minispheres is something that could never really take place. 100% of the game wants to win wars. And winning a war requires not only competence but also numbers, the latter being proven time and again to be more important than the former. It makes complete sense to make a sphere which is strong. No one wants a weak sphere. And making a big sphere with good tiering and lots of members is the best way to make a strong sphere. It would make no sense to willingly keep a sphere weak. Not to mention, minispheres was a scam to begin with. It was a lie propagated by the elite few to keep the masses down, to disorient them and keep them disunited in their fight against the bourgeoisie.

Whenever I think of one country "raiding" another country, I think of them seizing control of land...So why not add the ability to also take land when you win a raid war? Maybe like 0.25% of the adversary's total land if you get an IT.