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The war so far v2- updated stats


Avruch
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Eh, I wouldn't applaud them as much as you'd think. They are supporting an aggressive war on an ally, whether they entered to defend an ally or not. To make it even worse, their BK treaty is non chaining, which makes their entry optional. Pretty much on par with the paper they have with an ally that was noCBed.

Non chaining does not equal optional

There is a difference between an MnDoAP and ODoAP

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Non chaining does not equal optional

There is a difference between an MnDoAP and ODoAP

You're right, in the case where an ally in attacked initially or whether they were chained in from another treaty/attacked aggressively. The differences between them do not apply in this case. 

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PvczX3n.jpg?1

 

“ Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination. â€

–The First Ideal of the Windrunners,

 

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CKD gets credit for helping. The status of a treaty doesn't really matter imo

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"If we have no choice but to fight, than I'd rather fight for the good guys. I'd rather burn on the side of justice and morals, than greed and gluttony. Justice must be upheld and order must be given to a broken world. Rose must survive because without Rose than evil shall reign. Rose needs warriors, will you aid the empire?"

 

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CKD gets credit for helping. The status of a treaty doesn't really matter imo

 

Are you advocating some treaties are worth 3/5's of other treaties?

Edited by Robert E Lee
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From what I gathered from my side of the war, the upper tier of IQ was vastly outnumbered by the upper tier of Syndisphere. If you look at Pantheon and t$ for example:  and see how their upper tier handled, only very few of them entered into a defensive war despite being on the defense.

 

It looks like mistakes from last war were made again, not properly managing strikes on the important targets but settling for easier picks which is where getting countered really screws you over.

 

Nonetheless, while impossible to source via code, I would like to see what percentage of the blitz was successful according to victories. While I won the wars I fought I was out damaged because of consistent nuke strikes. Not arguing against the data, it clearly failed, but I would still like to see the outcome of the wars.

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22:26 +Kadin: too far man

22:26 +Kadin: too far

22:26 Lordofpuns[boC]: that's the point of incest Kadin

22:26 Lordofpuns[boC]: to go farther

22:27 Bet: or father

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Good thing we never allied with Lord A Arron

I wish we knew that earlier around December-January... actually, maybe earlier, can't quite remember. We were allies against the threat of raiders alongside the Night's Watch! We had something there! And the it came crashing down when Lordaeron ended it and attacked both of us, the Night's Watch and TFP. It was very sad times for us.

Edited by Quichwe10
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I'm not sure how we went from NPO not carrying their weight to CKD, but I respect CKD trying to help out their allies. I doesn't matter the context of the war. Their ally needed help and they gave it, despite no doubt being fully aware of the misalignment of tiers and ranging. Compared to BK, Zodiac et al backstabbing their allies it's nice to see an alliance simply defend their friends

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Jl0McAJ.gif

Mans two modes of existence can be thought of as his light and dark side. He is either the Protector or the Ravager. The Immovable Object or the Unstoppable Force.

 

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BK lists it as an MDoAP

 

We list it as an MnDoAP

 

It depends on your interpretation of the original scripture.

 

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From what I gathered from my side of the war, the upper tier of IQ was vastly outnumbered by the upper tier of Syndisphere. If you look at Pantheon and t$ for example:  and see how their upper tier handled, only very few of them entered into a defensive war despite being on the defense.

 

It looks like mistakes from last war were made again, not properly managing strikes on the important targets but settling for easier picks which is where getting countered really screws you over.

 

Nonetheless, while impossible to source via code, I would like to see what percentage of the blitz was successful according to victories. While I won the wars I fought I was out damaged because of consistent nuke strikes. Not arguing against the data, it clearly failed, but I would still like to see the outcome of the wars.

From what I gathered from my side of the war, the upper tier of IQ was vastly outnumbered by the upper tier of Syndisphere. If you look at Pantheon and t$ for example:  and see how their upper tier handled, only very few of them entered into a defensive war despite being on the defense.

 

It looks like mistakes from last war were made again, not properly managing strikes on the important targets but settling for easier picks which is where getting countered really screws you over.

 

Nonetheless, while impossible to source via code, I would like to see what percentage of the blitz was successful according to victories. While I won the wars I fought I was out damaged because of consistent nuke strikes. Not arguing against the data, it clearly failed, but I would still like to see the outcome of the wars.

Mistakes from the preceding 5 or so wars haven't been learned you mean? People just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over with the main one being sending too many attackers at one or two alliances leaving themselves overextended and wide open to counters.

 

Plus we still have clowns who think inflicting infra damage on day one or two is a priority.

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From what I gathered from my side of the war, the upper tier of IQ was vastly outnumbered by the upper tier of Syndisphere. If you look at Pantheon and t$ for example:  and see how their upper tier handled, only very few of them entered into a defensive war despite being on the defense.

 

It looks like mistakes from last war were made again, not properly managing strikes on the important targets but settling for easier picks which is where getting countered really screws you over.

 

 

Someone needs to give you a gov role.

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-delet-

Edited by Lord of Puns

22:26 +Kadin: too far man

22:26 +Kadin: too far

22:26 Lordofpuns[boC]: that's the point of incest Kadin

22:26 Lordofpuns[boC]: to go farther

22:27 Bet: or father

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BK lists it as an MDoAP

 

We list it as an MnDoAP

 

It depends on your interpretation of the original scripture.

 

Interesting.  In the end, we all have an internal codex for how we interpret treaties.  I tend to view all the aggressive side's treaty activations as oA's basically, but not sure that's typical and this game really does punish people for putting in non-chaining clauses it seems. 

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Mistakes from the preceding 5 or so wars haven't been learned you mean? People just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over with the main one being sending too many attackers at one or two alliances leaving themselves overextended and wide open to counters.

 

Plus we still have clowns who think inflicting infra damage on day one or two is a priority.

Well considering half the fighters roughly were ex-OO or tS side last time. I'm not sure they're exactly repeating mistakes if they have never done them before :P

[11:52 PM] Prefontaine: But Keegoz is actually bad. [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: He's my favorite bad leader though.

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Well considering half the fighters roughly were ex-OO or tS side last time. I'm not sure they're exactly repeating mistakes if they have never done them before :P

 

Right? It means they saw the effects of all the mistakes from the winning side, but STILL MADE THEM! :P

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Eh, I wouldn't applaud them as much as you'd think. They are supporting an aggressive war on an ally, whether they entered to defend an ally or not. To make it even worse, their BK treaty is non chaining, which makes their entry optional. Pretty much on par with the paper they have with an ally that was noCBed. 

So what you saying is if an ally of yours was attacked that you had a Mutual Defense Pact in your treaty, you would not defend them? Even if that Alliance was in another, completely different Aggressive war happening at the same time? Please explain before my respect for you drops even further than it normally does because you are just the shit poster from TKR no one actually likes around here.

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So what you saying is if an ally of yours was attacked that you had a Mutual Defense Pact in your treaty, you would not defend them? Even if that Alliance was in another, completely different Aggressive war happening at the same time? Please explain before my respect for you drops even further than it normally does because you are just the shit poster from TKR no one actually likes around here.

 

Whoa, kinda rude!

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So what you saying is if an ally of yours was attacked that you had a Mutual Defense Pact in your treaty, you would not defend them? Even if that Alliance was in another, completely different Aggressive war happening at the same time? Please explain before my respect for you drops even further than it normally does because you are just the shit poster from TKR no one actually likes around here.

His point was CKD had a non-chaining MDoAP with BK.

 

BK attacked Rose, CKD's ODoAP ally, then Pantheon attacked BK, in defense of Rose, then CKD attacked Pantheon in Defense of BK.

 

So CKD were effectively contributing to the fight against their own ally (Rose), based on a treaty that was non-chaining and therefore they weren't obligated to enter.

 

Personally I don't care, his point was that the legality and morality of the situation was far more grey. 

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XLL3z4T.gif

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His point was CKD had a non-chaining MDoAP with BK.

 

BK attacked Rose, CKD's ODoAP ally, then Pantheon attacked BK, in defense of Rose, then CKD attacked Pantheon in Defense of BK.

 

So CKD were effectively contributing to the fight against their own ally (Rose), based on a treaty that was non-chaining and therefore they weren't obligated to enter.

 

Personally I don't care, his point was that the legality and morality of the situation was far more grey. 

LOL Like TKR would avoid that type of situation. Like any alliance would avoid that confrontation when they hold a Mutual Defense Pact in their treaty. To not defend would be a shitty ally.

 

Very cool that Rose has no qualms about it. EDIT: I thought Rose attacked BK?

Edited by The King in Yellow
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That appears to be the case yes. Perhaps the game changes since previous wars has contributed to all this as I remember back when tS was fighting wars with a disadvantage at the top with, nations in alliances like Rose mostly going untouched even, they still would pull out the wins. Certainly seems to me that NPO overkilled on the staying low mechanic they wished to exploit, and bumping it up to 12ish cities would have been better. 

Yeah, the numbers became even or in our favour at city counts closer to the top tier. So they might have had 50 nations at the top in a bracket where they outnumbered us, while now we have about 200 up top in a bracket where we outnumber them.

 

However we were able to expand our area of control into their top at least partially for most wars. In Silent War their top was completely taken out and in the previous wars we came close and could have done it but it wasn't worth it keeping hundreds of nations militarized just to take out a few last nations. I don't think IQ has done that so far this war, in fact I think it's been the opposite.

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