Agent W Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) If you don't want the community to comment, take it to private. You always come to the forums to spin that "Oh, tS is amazing and tS did nothing wrong and it's all on the other guy." Then the second someone disagrees with you, you immediately say "you don't know what you're talking about" you do this countless times. I'd link for you, but I don't feel like looking over the countless threads vs Alpha when you did this. So my point is: either take this pointless ass conversation elsewhere or don't get hurt when people call you out on your BS- because there's a lot of it. I can see this point. It's reasonable, but your side was going above just "not trusting" SK. Several members actively trolled them up and down the forums. Eumir was saying several times that they were going to roll SK(first example came to mind, there was another). But the point is Gandalf being gov didn't matter then, and doesn't now. You both stayed allied because you "respected and liked SK" but if the issue didn't matter enough to drop them then, why does it matter so much now? You were content with having Gandalf when SK was on your side but not when SK is against you. Now they're "actively" out to get you. Imagine being so misinformed. There was a number of us in tS who would very much have liked to have dropped and rolled SK for their dumb !@#$ery, but we got overruled, and the decision was made to keep the treaty and work with them, because despite that error, they had generally been ok allies. Then, a month ago, SK decided that they didn't want to keep any of their Syndisphere treaties, and go and join a sphere that has been traditionally hostile to us and attempted to destroy us on numerous occassions. The people who wanted to roll SK back then still wanted to roll them now, but gov has never approved of going right after ex-allies, and thus there was no plan to attack or be aggressive towards SK. Cut to five days ago, and VE/Rose attack our allies, it becomes obvious to us that SK wouldn't be far behind, so gov planned a preemptive strike on them, in order for us to go in with the advantage. There was no grand conspiracy to hit SK, there never was until SK's allies hit ours, and if SK's allies hadn't done some dumb shit, we would've left SK to go off and play in their own little corner. Edited September 15, 2016 by Agent W Quote Former Imperial Officer of Internal Affairs and Emperor of the New Pacific Order, Founder of the Syndicate, Current Chief Global Strategist of the Syndicate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Imagine being so misinformed. There was a number of us in tS who would very much have liked to have dropped and rolled SK for their dumb !@#$ery, but we got overruled, and the decision was made to keep the treaty and work with them, because despite that error, they had generally been ok allies. Then, a month ago, SK decided that they didn't want to keep any of their Syndisphere treaties, and go and join a sphere that has been traditionally hostile to us and attempted to destroy us on numerous occassions. The people who wanted to roll SK back then still wanted to roll them now, but gov has never approved of going right after ex-allies, and thus there was no plan to attack or be aggressive towards SK. Cut to five days ago, and VE/Rose attack our allies, it becomes obvious to us that SK wouldn't be far behind, so gov planned a preemptive strike on them, in order for us to go in with the advantage. There was no grand conspiracy to hit SK, there never was until SK's allies hit ours, and if SK's allies hadn't done some dumb shit, we would've left SK to go off and play in their own little corner. Can confirm. Quote One must imagine Sisyphus happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I can see this point. It's reasonable, but your side was going above just "not trusting" SK. Several members actively trolled them up and down the forums. Eumir was saying several times that they were going to roll SK(first example came to mind, there was another). But the point is Gandalf being gov didn't matter then, and doesn't now. You both stayed allied because you "respected and liked SK" but if the issue didn't matter enough to drop them then, why does it matter so much now? You were content with having Gandalf when SK was on your side but not when SK is against you. Now they're "actively" out to get you. Trust me. If I had a gov spot at the time, I would've pushed hard to drop them once I learned they "only suspended" Gandalf. Fortunately, they left once I got into a gov spot. So that was easy on me. Guess SK just doesn't want to fix that whole leaker issue they tend to have here and there. Sad thing is, at one point, I liked them more than any other alliance. The alliance, the players, the hard-to-read scrolls, etc. All solid. Then I see that a lot of the players I liked left, and then we get into this mess. Even Val had the audacity to change the text of the scrolls! 1 Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) Even Val had the audacity to change the text of the scrolls!Tbf I really like Vald's personal touch to the unintelligible scroll. Any alliance that roleplays hand-written, script scrolls should take note. I agree with 100% of everything else you said. I was even one of the people who advocated for staying tied to them (and don't even hate Gandalf because I enjoyed working with him while in SK, but do think SK was too lenient on him) I liked them so much. Genuinely like a lot of the people still there, too. Lately though I am very disappoint. Edited September 15, 2016 by Wilhelm the Demented Quote One must imagine Sisyphus happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callum Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 (edited) Can we all take a second to calm down, remember the good old days. laugh at any NA nations, because they have -100% food production. but then notice that the rest of the worlds about to follow suite? It'll be fun. Lately though I am very disappoint. From a former SK'er that's pretty disheartening to hear. We put our members first. asked them on what they believe the best course is, and for better or for worse. this was the path we all chose. I'd of hoped you of all people could respect that, regardless of how foolish it may seem. Edited September 15, 2016 by Callum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ogaden Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Do they now? We always have fun, win or lose 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 From a former SK'er that's pretty disheartening to hear. We put our members first. asked them on what they believe the best course is, and for better or for worse. this was the path we all chose. I'd of hoped you of all people could respect that, regardless of how foolish it may seem. I respect and completely understand the decision, don't get me wrong. That doesn't mean I have to approve of it, however. It just sucks advocating for you guys in private against many vocal critics after multiple wars, just to end up on this end of a conflict with y'all. I'd be more okay with this if we were actually losing, in a twisted sort of way. 1 Quote One must imagine Sisyphus happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 If you don't want the community to comment, take it to private. You always come to the forums to spin that "Oh, tS is amazing and tS did nothing wrong and it's all on the other guy." Then the second someone disagrees with you, you immediately say "you don't know what you're talking about" you do this countless times. I'd link for you, but I don't feel like looking over the countless threads vs Alpha when you did this. So my point is: either take this pointless ass conversation elsewhere or don't get hurt when people call you out on your BS- because there's a lot of it. I can see this point. It's reasonable, but your side was going above just "not trusting" SK. Several members actively trolled them up and down the forums. Eumir was saying several times that they were going to roll SK(first example came to mind, there was another). But the point is Gandalf being gov didn't matter then, and doesn't now. You both stayed allied because you "respected and liked SK" but if the issue didn't matter enough to drop them then, why does it matter so much now? You were content with having Gandalf when SK was on your side but not when SK is against you. Now they're "actively" out to get you. You are free to comment. You are not entitled to a reply. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordRahl2 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 We always have fun, win or lose Your mercenaries that is different. TEST however is a bit different and the piece of his logic that I dispute is not the "having fun" part. I am sure they are. Quote -signature removed for rules violation- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastor Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 You are free to comment. You are not entitled to a reply. Don't think I ever said you had to reply, I just said don't get upset when I reply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Don't think I ever said you had to reply, I just said don't get upset when I reply. Don't tell him how to live his life. Quote One must imagine Sisyphus happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Don't think I ever said you had to reply, I just said don't get upset when I reply. It's not about getting upset. It's about correcting a factual inaccuracy. No more, no less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yosodog Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 It's not a tS DoW without 20 pages and we're only on 14 so far. Pick up the pace, people. 1 Quote [22:37:51] <&Yosodog> Problem is, everyone is too busy deciding which top gun character they are that no decision has been made BK in a nutshell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roquentin Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Let's assume this guy was actually somehow able to control our entire sphere, just for sake of argument. Even though anyone can make any number of comments without making a single DoW. Maybe he meant he was only going to roll your alliance, because he was concerned you would try to push a bipolar war, and shame on everyone else for thinking it might have mattered to them? Anyways before this gets too cyclical... I'll take the criticisms about what our sphere might have done from people who know it, and don't have a vested interest in having protection from an inevitable conflict they assume is coming for them. So cheers. I mean, several of your allies have weighed in and said what their desires were. It wasn't on your time table and your own response when you were told about the dynamic that had people worried was "I'd have a harder time supporting that if they hadn't been fed a diet of dogshit by that grouping". It's quite tiring being made out to be irrationally paranoid. It seems like you just don't like it not being on your side's timetable. A decent number of people have said they'd have done the same thing in our position, so the condescension is really getting old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatkitteh Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 I mean, several of your allies have weighed in and said what their desires were. It wasn't on your time table and your own response when you were told about the dynamic that had people worried was "I'd have a harder time supporting that if they hadn't been fed a diet of dogshit by that grouping". It's quite tiring being made out to be irrationally paranoid. It seems like you just don't like it not being on your side's timetable. A decent number of people have said they'd have done the same thing in our position, so the condescension is really getting old. I would attack anyways FOR STEVE Quote :sheepy: :sheepy: Greatkitteh was here.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefontaine Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Your mercenaries that is different. TEST however is a bit different and the piece of his logic that I dispute is not the "having fun" part. I am sure they are. I tuned out of this thread for a while and started having my own conversations with sock puppets. What about TEst now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatkitteh Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 I tuned out of this thread for a while and started having my own conversations with sock puppets. What about TEst now? TEST is new GPA! Quote :sheepy: :sheepy: Greatkitteh was here.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan the Red Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) The reason that Orbis clumped into two spheres is the same reason why 3 or more spheres will not work in the future. Its a basic theory of IR that when security is the central concern of actors that they will seek to maximize their personal security. The way to do this is to gather the maximum number of allies, preferably good ones - but barring that any will do. And this is a war game - so it will happen. After so many wars curbstomping the people who reckless sign treaties with all possible sides like if there was no tomorrow, I would have hoped that people got the point that "security != number of treaties". The more you increase the size of the blob, the harder you get hit. This is why I welcomed the 3rd Sphere thing. I thought it meant Rose and others had finally figured out that a small number of efficient allies would work better for them than a big blob. Even a paperless approach has proven to work better than saturating the treaty web. And this is also why I'm dissapointed to know the "3rd Sphere" move was just a shameful attempt at divide an conquer. Edited September 16, 2016 by Ivan the Red Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatkitteh Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 After so many wars curbstomping the people who reckless sign treaties with all possible sides like if there was no tomorrow, I would have hoped that people got the point that "security != number of treaties". This is why I welcomed the 3rd Sphere thing. I thought it meant Rose and others had finally figured out that a small number of efficient allies would work better for them than a big blob. Even a paperless approach has proven to work better than saturating the treaty web. And this is also why I'm dissapointed to know the "3rd Sphere" move was just a shameful attempt at divide an conquer. Not there fault TS warred every single "3rd sphere" attempt Quote :sheepy: :sheepy: Greatkitteh was here.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan the Red Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) Not there fault TS warred every single "3rd sphere" attempt That claim is false. There has been only one instance of t$ going into agression, and it was after NPO bound itselfself to ParaCovenant through UPN. Edited September 16, 2016 by Ivan the Red Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatkitteh Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 That claim is false. There has been only one instance of t$ going into agression, and it was after NPO bound itselfself to ParaCovenant through UPN. Paragon - TS prempts once and backstabbed VE Conevant - Tried to attack UPN; got it's cover blown out NPO sphere (NPO had a treaty with TKR and Former TS ally SK; it was a sphere) - Attacked member and pisses of NPO, then uses that to invade NPO "Paperless club" - Vanguard, Arrgh, Roz Wei, etc. all got attacked for filmsy reasons. Quote :sheepy: :sheepy: Greatkitteh was here.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Paragon - TS prempts once and backstabbed VE Conevant - Tried to attack UPN; got it's cover blown out NPO sphere (NPO had a treaty with TKR and Former TS ally SK; it was a sphere) - Attacked member and pisses of NPO, then uses that to invade NPO "Paperless club" - Vanguard, Arrgh, Roz Wei, etc. all got attacked for filmsy reasons. Lolwhat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatkitteh Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) Lolwhat FOR STEVE... Edited September 16, 2016 by greatkitteh Quote :sheepy: :sheepy: Greatkitteh was here.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor Jerry Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 FOR STEVE... FOR YOUR MOM... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Thrax Posted September 16, 2016 Author Share Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) I mean, several of your allies have weighed in and said what their desires were. It wasn't on your time table and your own response when you were told about the dynamic that had people worried was "I'd have a harder time supporting that if they hadn't been fed a diet of dogshit by that grouping". I would have hard a harder time supporting it, yep. Still doesn't necessarily mean I did. Here's a better snippet of that conversation. You'll note my comment was a reference to Keegoz's hypothetical, not necessarily an affirmation of it. Keegoz - 09/09/2016I've more or less got the impression that BK/TKR/Mensa are waiting to re-group and then flip a coin as to whether they hit Rose/VE/SK or NPO/TC Manthrax - 09/09/2016That would be a pretty hard thing to support if they hadn't been on an all-dogshit diet from those parties for the past... year plus? Keegoz - 09/09/2016Who else they gonna hit? They have shown in the past that they get bored and will eventually hit someone Which is fair, I mean I get bored too Anyone else who I didn't list is on your side so unless you guys intend to have some sort of implosion Manthrax - 09/09/2016Shrug. You're not using your imagination. Not every war's gotta be a global, for one. Also quoting me out of context is a good example of that dogshit. Edited September 16, 2016 by Manthrax Quote Slaughter the shits of the world. They poison the air you breathe. ~ William S. Burroughs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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