Paris Terror Attacks

[Dolores Abernathy]

So let's not wipe out European cultures, eh? Any attempt that we try to defend our culture these days is swamped with a plethora of cries of "RACIST" "BIGOT" "BE MORE TOLERANT."

There's nothing wrong with being upset over this event, it's understandable. But once you start touting that your culture is better than another, or once you start lumping perfectly peaceful Muslims/Syrians in with extremists because "omg all muslims r bad" then yes, you should be more tolerant. A small minority shouldn't justify the eradication of millions of Muslims who have done nothing wrong.

[Rozalia]

Calm down there, Hitler. You can't just round everyone up and remove a culture off the face of the earth.

 

Who said anything about removing a culture of the face of the earth? It still exists where some see as their "real" home.

 

There's nothing wrong with being upset over this event, it's understandable. But once you start touting that your culture is better than another, or once you start lumping perfectly peaceful Muslims/Syrians in with extremists because "omg all muslims r bad" then yes, you should be more tolerant. A small minority shouldn't justify the eradication of millions of Muslims who have done nothing wrong.

 

Why shouldn't a person say their culture is better? They seem to think theirs is and yet you're not attacking them. 

 

Eradication of millions? You're trying too hard. Calls from people like you of Nazism is one of the reasons why it's even gotten to this point.

[Vosunda]

 

Who said anything about removing a culture of the face of the earth? It still exists where some see as their "real" home.

 

 

Why shouldn't a person say their culture is better? They seem to think theirs is and yet you're not attacking them. 

 

Eradication of millions? You're trying too hard. Calls from people like you of Nazism is one of the reasons why it's even gotten to this point.

 

I support the killing of no one, I support a peaceful repatriation of those who were not born in Europe, and an integration of the remaining people into the values, culture and traditions of their host country. Multiculturalism has been a failure.

[Bilal the Great]

How much more people needs to die until everybody understands the danger of religion. 1000? 1,000,000? 1,000,0000,000?

[LordRahl2]

Roz is not all wrong. The NF will get a bump from this. Sadely.

[Crust]

I think it's dangerous to assume that the terrorist attacks are because of muslim extremists right of the bat. That's the exact kinda thing that happened when Breivik committed those heinous terrorist attacks in Norway.

 

Sadly this whole thing is just gonna add more fuel to the rising flame of extremism (from both the far-right and the extreme islamic groups) that's grasping for more power in Europe.

[LordRahl2]

I think it's dangerous to assume that the terrorist attacks are because of muslim extremists right of the bat. That's the exact kinda thing that happened when Breivik committed those heinous terrorist attacks in Norway.

 

 

From a professional standpoint, it is highly probable that this was ISIS. Location, coordination, complexity, presence of the head of state, all these point to a well planned and rehearsed operation. So the probability of a lone wolf or some sort of small nationalist cell falls to basically zero.

 

So its not really an assumption to say that it was ISIS - who are reasonably described as Muslim extremists.

[Crust]

From a professional standpoint, it is highly probable that this was ISIS. Location, coordination, complexity, presence of the head of state, all these point to a well planned and rehearsed operation. So the probability of a lone wolf or some sort of small nationalist cell falls to basically zero.

 

So its not really an assumption to say that it was ISIS - who are reasonably described as Muslim extremists.

 

That's literally one of the things a lot of journalists claimed when the shooting took place in Utöya, it's best not to speculate on things like that without more information at hand.

 

Either way, who ever did it, it's extremely tragic and horrific.

[LordRahl2]

That's literally one of the things a lot of journalists claimed when the shooting took place in Utöya, it's best not to speculate on things like that without more information at hand.

 

I have no doubt that a lot of journalists did claim that.  I did not say journalist.  I said professional.

[Quasar]

[Edsel]

There are a lot of ignorant comments in this forum. First of all, how could Syrian war refugee recover from war in their own country? Syria is a war-zone partially controlled by a dictator who uses weapons against his own people and partially controlled by a radical Islamist group who enforces Sharia law, forces all women to where a Burka, and kills many innocent civilians. Would you want to live in Syria? People don't get to choose where they are born. Secondly, there is no Muslim invasion of Europe. Muslims have lived in The Balkans since the Ottoman Empire and in Spain before the Catholics. There are many Muslims immigrating to Europe from Asia and Africa but, they are not trying to "invade". They are moving to Europe to live a better life. Would you want to live in Northern Nigeria, Algeria, Iraq, Turkey, Indonesia, Pakistan, or Bangladesh? None of these people choose to be born in these countries; therefore, they should be allowed to live where they please. Third, these people do not commit these mass murders because they are Muslims. They did these things because they are ignorant, hateful, right-wing extremist. They could have been Christian or non-religious and done the same thing. The statistic that 30% of Muslims are radical is ridiculous. Statistics like that only have meaning if you know how the people who conducted the survey defined "radical". The makers of the survey could have defined radical as believing in creationism, praying 5 times per day, or practicing Ramadan. The statistic that 30% of Muslims are radical is most definitely a bullsh*t static.

[Kenneth]

 The senseless loss of life is both staggering and disgusting. I wish the best for the  people of France, and I hope these terrorists are held accountable for their actions.

[Thalmor]

That's literally one of the things a lot of journalists claimed when the shooting took place in Utöya, it's best not to speculate on things like that without more information at hand.

 

Either way, who ever did it, it's extremely tragic and horrific.

 

There's already been reports of attackers yelling ''allahu akbar'' and ''it's for Syria''

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/11995246/Paris-shooting-What-we-know-so-far.html

 

 

Calm down there, Hitler. You can't just round everyone up and remove a culture off the face of the earth.

 

I think the Spanish did a good job wiping out Mesoamerican culture. I think the Catholic Church wiped out paganism in Eastern Europe pretty thoroughly.

 

Also, Muslim culture is way worse than European culture. In places such as Saudi Arabia or Iran, you have tons of savage practices going on (especially against women). These refugees and immigrants go over to Europe(by the millions, mind you) and bring that culture with them. Not only that, but that culture is ingrained in their interpretation of their religious holy text, so good luck getting them to change their mind.

Edited November 14, 2015 by Thalmor

[Rozalia]

There are a lot of ignorant comments in this forum. First of all, how could Syrian war refugee recover from war in their own country? Syria is a war-zone partially controlled by a dictator who uses weapons against his own people and partially controlled by a radical Islamist group who enforces Sharia law, forces all women to where a Burka, and kills many innocent civilians. Would you want to live in Syria? People don't get to choose where they are born. Secondly, there is no Muslim invasion of Europe. Muslims have lived in The Balkans since the Ottoman Empire and in Spain before the Catholics. There are many Muslims immigrating to Europe from Asia and Africa but, they are not trying to "invade". They are moving to Europe to live a better life. Would you want to live in Northern Nigeria, Algeria, Iraq, Turkey, Indonesia, Pakistan, or Bangladesh? None of these people choose to be born in these countries; therefore, they should be allowed to live where they please. Third, these people do not commit these mass murders because they are Muslims. They did these things because they are ignorant, hateful, right-wing extremist. They could have been Christian or non-religious and done the same thing. The statistic that 30% of Muslims are radical is ridiculous. Statistics like that only have meaning if you know how the people who conducted the survey defined "radical". The makers of the survey could have defined radical as believing in creationism, praying 5 times per day, or practicing Ramadan. The statistic that 30% of Muslims are radical is most definitely a bullsh*t static.

 

First of all there is something called fighting for your country against foreign invaders. Second using the Ottoman Empire as some sort of positive example of Muslims is just wow. Third Muslims were in Spain before the Catholics? Not sure if you are being merely ignorant or duplicitous there by trying to get across a falsity as true, but the Visgoths they defeated to occupy Spain were Christians. Forth... everyone who kills people like this is a "right-wing extremist"? What poppycock, come now. 

 

I believe almost virtually every single sentence there of your's could be challenged for it's errors. Don't call others ignorant when in your attempt to pass yourself off as holy than thou you commit such errors. 

Edited November 14, 2015 by Rozalia

[Ekejen Luish]

In desperate times, comedy is needed.
 
Knock knock.
Who's there?
Yodel-a-hee.
Yodel-a-hee who?
You can yodel?
 

Edited November 14, 2015 by Dr Cave Johnson

[Vassili Dovgan]

I wonder what Ibrahim is doing right now...

[Ekejen Luish]

One of the nicest people I ever knew was muslim.

[Doktor Avalanche]

Sufis are cool.

Then again I know Satanists who are more Christian than the Christians I know.

I know Pagans who are more devout than Buddhist Monks at seeking enlightenment.

The world is full of conundrums and drastic changes, almost like Chaos Herself is actually in charge most of the time.

[Lu Xun]

I always wonder a little when people post stuff like this in a remote and tiny piece of the Internet. None of the people or anyone connected to them are likely to read the response, so what is actually the intended object of these phrases?

Social grooming, an attempt to show how conscientious one is and how one is a team player. It's an excellent example of groupthink.

 

===

 

That said, I did know a frog based in Paris and while we're no longer on terms I hope he's okay. 150/a city of 2.24 million people, so roughly 1/14,933 died, a fairly high death rate for a relatively small city.

 

The sad thing is, the "West" deserves it, i.e, by neither destroying Assad nor allowing him to retake control over his country, ISIS became a resurgent and popular force, but France, by itself, does not. It was involved in Libya, true, but it was not one of the major players in the Syria crisis. The West in general has an intimate relationship with Islamic terrorism, because secular Arab nationalism was dangerous to Israel and a potential Soviet ally, Islamic radicals were feted, and as is well known, Al Qaeda was a US-supported (and supported by China, Arab states, Muslim states) group when it was a convenient way to screw with the Soviet Union.

 

In general, Islamic fundamentalism is like a hot potato the great powers use to screw with one another, whether it be against the US in Iraq or the 9/11 attacks, the Soviets in Afghanistan, or the Syrians by supporting Islamic fundamentalism. Since all of the great powers (EU states, China, the United States, Russia) have a problem with Islamic fundamentalism, perhaps it's good time to finally stop playing this bloody and immoral game and eliminate the radicals once and for all?

 

It'll be interesting, of course, to see how the French react afterwards. People need boots on the ground to get rid of ISIS, which can honestly be declared an enemy to civilization.

[Doktor Avalanche]

Am I agreeing with Inst?

Yeah, Hell froze over.

All except the deserved it part. Innocents never deserve death from any sides.

[Dimitri Valko]

The sad thing is, the "West" deserves it...

 

Not a single country deserves the massacre of innocent civilians.

[Bilal the Great]

158 deads now.

 

You know, Quran really did says it's okay to kill non-muslims.

[Lu Xun]

My point is more that if you play with fire you're going to get burnt. France, as an individual nation, did not actively or significantly support terrorists who were conveniently fighting their political rivals at the time. The West, however, as a whole, supports ISIS insofar as it attacks its enemies (Assad); it's involved in a complex civil war where the enemy of your enemy is also your enemy. In general, if you do something stupid, you deserve the blowback. If it involves the death of innocents, well, real life is not a video game and mistakes will hurt.

 

And if you're talking innocent civilians, well, it's a trite platitude. The West kills innocent civilians, sometimes intentionally, sometimes accidentally. If you're going to obsess over the sanctity of life, stop using or supporting military means as a mode of achieving political change; if the Arab Spring had failed and Arab authoritarians like Gaddafi were still in power, Libya would not be mostly in the hands of Islamists now, the Muslim Brotherhood would not have taken power in Egypt, then been deposed by a violent military coup, and ISIS would not be exporting suicide warfare to Europe.

[Dimitri Valko]

My point is more that if you play with fire you're going to get burnt. France, as an individual nation, did not actively or significantly support terrorists who were conveniently fighting their political rivals at the time. The West, however, as a whole, supports ISIS insofar as it attacks its enemies (Assad); it's involved in a complex civil war where the enemy of your enemy is also your enemy. In general, if you do something stupid, you deserve the blowback. If it involves the death of innocents, well, real life is not a video game and mistakes will hurt.

 

And if you're talking innocent civilians, well, it's a trite platitude. The West kills innocent civilians, sometimes intentionally, sometimes accidentally. If you're going to obsess over the sanctity of life, stop using or supporting military means as a mode of achieving political change; if the Arab Spring had failed and Arab authoritarians like Gaddafi were still in power, Libya would not be mostly in the hands of Islamists now, the Muslim Brotherhood would not have taken power in Egypt, then been deposed by a violent military coup, and ISIS would not be exporting suicide warfare to Europe.

 

The government screwed up, it doesn't mean their people should get the backlash.

[Lu Xun]

In general, when governments screw up, it's the citizenry that suffers. Consider Japan's regional tour of Asia, which resulted in Hiroshima and Nagasaki getting nuked, as well as Tokyo getting firebombed. Soviet economic inefficiency inflicted severe hardship onto the Soviet people, and Stalin's mistakes in the run-up to WW2 resulted in far more Soviet casualties than they should have sustained. Fukushima is another example, lax government oversight allowed a reactor to go critical and contaminate a significant area of Japan, a land-poor and densely-populated country, for decades.

 

That said, I don't support or condone these terrorist attacks, nor do I celebrate at the violation of civilians' right to life. On the other hand... we do look into more treacherous principles if we consider the structure of a democracy. France is a democracy. French citizens vote... so they accept the legitimacy of government actions and the responsibility for the actions of their government.

 

However, as I've said before, France doesn't deserve it. They have curbed on Islamic expression, because they are a strongly secular state, but they haven't done anything to the Ummah; if the Islamic radicals think about it, the French made a significant contribution to the overthrown of Gadaffi and his replacement by Islamists with their Rafales and the Charles De Gaulle. What happened to France is more the fault of the United States, which helped succour and aid the Arab Spring, eventually culminating in the current war in Syria. If France is part of the West, and is supporting the Western coalition, it only takes an extremely indirect responsibility; if the Islamic militants could, they would rather make their problem America's problem instead of Europe's problem, Europe simply has the misfortune of being much closer to the Middle East.