Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 You also didn't quote the whole thing. You LIED to your allies. You told them you would be backing down. You lied and withheld information that could bring them into a war. Was it strategically sound? Sure. Does it arguably go against what the treaty says? Yes. Does it also go against the spirit of the treaty? Yes. Is it a shitty thing to do to your allies? Yes. As if it wasnt shitty for SK to plot if using Rose to roll VE and then roll Rose immediately after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filthy Fifths Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 My cock is much bigger than yooouurrss. "In an honest service there is thin commons, low wages, and hard labor; in this, plenty and satiety, pleasure and ease, liberty and power; and who would not balance creditor on this side, when all the hazard that is run for it, at worst, is only a sour look or two at choking. No, a merry life and a short one, shall be my motto." - Bartholomew "Black Bart" Roberts Green Enforcement Agency will rise again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tali Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) As if it wasnt shitty for SK to plot if using Rose to roll VE and then roll Rose immediately after that. Again, SK didn't have a treaty with Rose. Rose had no reason to trust SK in the first place, so why did they trust SK to work with them? Edited October 18, 2015 by Olivier Mira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boony Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 As if it wasnt shitty for SK to plot if using Rose to roll VE and then roll Rose immediately after that. It's fine. Just admit it was a shitty and dishonourable for UPN to do, and no arguments even need to happen. I don't care about your justification for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 It's fine. Just admit it was a shitty and dishonourable for UPN to do, and no arguments even need to happen. I don't care about your justification for it. When you are behaving without honor. Then what right do you have to talk about honour. If you are so honourable. Then plotting to hit Tc wouldnt have happen at the first place. Is so shameful to complain all day long about others when is time for you to face karma for your past action Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Just stop talking about honour and pretending to be on a morally high ground when you guys of all ppl should be the last to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) You also didn't quote the whole thing. You LIED to your allies. You told them you would be backing down. You lied and withheld information that could bring them into a war. Was it strategically sound? Sure. Does it arguably go against what the treaty says? Yes. Does it also go against the spirit of the treaty? Yes. Is it a shitty thing to do to your allies? Yes. Yes I didn't quote the whole thing, because it's something that I already went over multiple times (in the same way I ignored Partisan going over the same stuff we already discussed.) Like I said, had I been there, it would not of happened -- does it excuse anything? No. Does it ultimately make a massive difference? No. And I have admitted that if everything that was said is true, then it was in poor taste on our behalf. I know you need to keep pushing the same things over and over again to fit your narrative, but can we please stop going around in circles and discussing the same shit over and over again? It's getting tiring. That's why I am not constantly repeating myself. Not because I intended in leaving something out. My argument was addressing your claim that it was somehow immoral of us to attack SK. Edited October 18, 2015 by Saru Second in Command of UPN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurdanak Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 My cock is much bigger than yooouurrss.Congrats, FF - you're already posting with more quality than 90% of the P&W forums right now. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boony Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 When you are behaving without honor. Then what right do you have to talk about honour. If you are so honourable. Then plotting to hit Tc wouldnt have happen at the first place. Is so shameful to complain all day long about others when is time for you to face karma for your past action I don't understand how plotting to hit an alliance in a game about war (and politics) is dishonourable. But I mean, I guess you consent to my previous post. Thanks bud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tali Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) When you are behaving without honor. Then what right do you have to talk about honour. If you are so honourable. Then plotting to hit Tc wouldnt have happen at the first place. Is so shameful to complain all day long about others when is time for you to face karma for your past actionWhat do you know about honour? When UPN lied to Mensa about backing down, that is a dishonourable action, and i will continue to see UPN and tC as dishonourable group. Don't get me wrong theirs a few in tC that i like and get along with, but damn you group claim to be honrouable eventhough everyone knows what the real reason for this war is and it isn't about the tS's previous "actions" a while ago. Edited October 18, 2015 by Olivier Mira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastor Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I don't know the ins and outs of their agreement, and how the two feel about it. But from my understanding the two were never close, and both knew that the treaty was weak. My point is that trying to say that UPN is somehow dishonourable for attacking an ally of an ally, given all the things considered is silly. The two were, and up until this war, remained very close. I can confirm that from my time in DEIC. SK saved DEIC's ass from Rose more times then you can count on one hand, not to mention they saved Cobalt as well and only because DEIC asked them too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Congrats, FF - you're already posting with more quality than 90% of the P&W forums right now. How can you expect them to post with quality when their intention was only to complain non stop on how unjustified it was to hit them and go round and round beating the bushes claiming others as ppl that is without honour whereas they pretended to be on a moral high ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayayay Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 What do you know about honour? When UPN lied to Mensa about backing down, that is a dishonourable action, and i will continue to see UPN and tC as dishonourable group. Don't get me wrong theirs a few in tC that i like and get along with, but damn you group claim to be honrouable eventhough everyone knows what the real reason for this war is and it isn't about the tS's previous "actions" a while ago. tbh, UPN was going to back down. Something changed and I don't know what but we ended up attacking the day after deciding it from what I've heard. Orbis Wars | CSI: UPN | B I G O O F | PW Expert Has Nerve To Tell You How To Run Your Own Goddamn Alliance | Occupy Wall Street | Sheepy Sings TheNG - My favorite part is when Steve suggests DEIC might have done something remotely successful, then gets massively shit on for proposing such a stupid idea. On 1/4/2016 at 6:37 PM, Sheepy said: This was !@#$ing gold. 10/10 possibly my favorite post on these forums yet. Sheepy said: I'm retarded, you win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) What do you know about honour? When UPN lied to Mensa about backing down, that is a dishonourable action, and i will continue to see UPN and tC as dishonourable group. Don't get me wrong theirs a few in tC that i like and get along with, but damn you group claim to be honrouable eventhough everyone knows what the real reason for this war is and it isn't about the tS's previous "actions" a while ago. I see you need to continue pushing that narrative again. Yes, you guys have repeated it for the 100th time now, and for the 100th time we have admitted, that it was done in poor taste. Mainly down to miscommunication and a lapse of judgement of one of our higher government members. We have already acknowledged the mistake, and I have said it would of been handled differently if we had the chance to do it again. But in the grand scheme of things, this is irrelevant, and just an attempt to try and throw shit at the wall in the hopes it sticks. It's something that's entirely between us and Mensa, and we have already spoken to them about it. As for being dishonourable, if you are going to apply such moral judgement onto us, then please remain morally consistent and don't ignore it when your friends do it. As for our reason for the war... It very much is to do with the fact that they plotted against us before, and that we didn't feel like much had changed. The two were, and up until this war, remained very close. I can confirm that from my time in DEIC. SK saved DEIC's ass from Rose more times then you can count on one hand, not to mention they saved Cobalt as well and only because DEIC asked them too. I'm going to go on the things said by the leaders of the two alliances involved, aswell as my own observations of the two, than go with the opinion of Kastor. Edited October 18, 2015 by Saru Second in Command of UPN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I don't understand how plotting to hit an alliance in a game about war (and politics) is dishonourable. But I mean, I guess you consent to my previous post. Thanks bud! So how us it that Tc plot to hit you be so dishonourable like what you guys are crying so much about? After all is just a plot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tali Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 If you are going to apply such moral judgement onto us, then please remain morally consistent and don't ignore it when your friends do it. As for our reason for the war... It very much is to do with the fact that they plotted against us before, and that we didn't feel like much had changed. Keep telling yourself that, but everyone knows damn well that isnt the real reason. Just admit its about keeping power for !@#$ sake. But meh, keep on. We all know you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Keep telling yourself that, but everyone knows damn well that isnt the real reason. Just admit its about keeping power for !@#$ sake. But meh, keep on. We all know you will. Nope. Not everyone believe their reason to hit you is because of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tali Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 Nope. Not everyone believe their reason to hit you is because of power. No, there has been wars about something besides power, but this one is. Just admit it, you'll feel better for telling the truth for once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayayay Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I'm going to go on the things said by the leaders of the two alliances involved, aswell as my own observations of the two, than go with the opinion of Kastor. Orbis Wars | CSI: UPN | B I G O O F | PW Expert Has Nerve To Tell You How To Run Your Own Goddamn Alliance | Occupy Wall Street | Sheepy Sings TheNG - My favorite part is when Steve suggests DEIC might have done something remotely successful, then gets massively shit on for proposing such a stupid idea. On 1/4/2016 at 6:37 PM, Sheepy said: This was !@#$ing gold. 10/10 possibly my favorite post on these forums yet. Sheepy said: I'm retarded, you win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) No, there has been wars about something besides power, but this one is. Just admit it, you'll feel better for telling the truth for once. If it was solely about power and opportunism, and nothing to do with tS's past actions towards us aswell as our assessment of their threat to us. Then why didn't we just attack them when they were the most vulnerable and engaged with Rose? As well as all of their allies also being engaged with other alliances? It's really not that controversial to say that we declared because we saw them as a threat in the future, and from the information that we had available to us believed that they had us in their cross hairs in the long term. You can debate the validity of our assessment all you want, but to question our reasoning is just silly. We really have no reason to lie. Was the war to do with power/security? Sure, most wars are. Was it to do solely with power? Nope, and that's just a fact. Edited October 18, 2015 by Saru 1 Second in Command of UPN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 No, there has been wars about something besides power, but this one is. Just admit it, you'll feel better for telling the truth for once. What truth do you want?.BTW i am not from any of the 3 alliance in TC. I just a bystander in this war. And bothside came up with their stories and reason. And i find Tc version more credible and trustworthy. Unlike those given by Ts and gang. Nothing more than complains by sore losers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatnate Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 If it was solely about power and opportunism, and nothing to do with tS's past actions towards us aswell as our assessment of their threat to us. Then why didn't we just attack them when they were the most vulnerable and engaged with Rose? As well as all of their allies also being engaged with other alliances? Because that would've helped Rose. Can't leave anyone not tied to UPN in a good position for too long, might be a vague threat to power. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Mustang Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 How can you expect them to post with quality when their intention was only to complain non stop on how unjustified it was to hit them and go round and round beating the bushes claiming others as ppl that is without honour whereas they pretended to be on a moral high ground. He means you too buddy boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 He means you too buddy boy. And you as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted October 18, 2015 Share Posted October 18, 2015 I see you need to continue pushing that narrative again. Yes, you guys have repeated it for the 100th time now, and for the 100th time we have admitted, that it was done in poor taste. Mainly down to miscommunication and a lapse of judgement of one of our higher government members. We have already acknowledged the mistake, and I have said it would of been handled differently if we had the chance to do it again. But in the grand scheme of things, this is irrelevant, and just an attempt to try and throw shit at the wall in the hopes it sticks. It's something that's entirely between us and Mensa, and we have already spoken to them about it. As for being dishonourable, if you are going to apply such moral judgement onto us, then please remain morally consistent and don't ignore it when your friends do it. As for our reason for the war... It very much is to do with the fact that they plotted against us before, and that we didn't feel like much had changed. I'm going to go on the things said by the leaders of the two alliances involved, aswell as my own observations of the two, than go with the opinion of Kastor. It is not irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, for it lays bare the nature of the way you drive politics, despite your claims to the contrary. It's amusing that while you were unwilling to let go off tS' mistakes, you now expect us to entirely disregard your bloc's blatant screwing over of various allies. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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