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Erev

Let Alliances Embargo

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Permanent embargoes are better but agreed to this. 

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Also could block notifications when people in an alliance you’ve embargoed already places individual ones on you. Or let people mark a check box not to be notified of embargoes from listed alliances.

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14 hours ago, Noctis Anarch Caelum said:

Also could block notifications when people in an alliance you’ve embargoed already places individual ones on you. Or let people mark a check box not to be notified of embargoes from listed alliances.

Yup. At most perhaps a direct notification or message when the alliance unembargoes you saying 'this single list of people still have national embargoes placed on you'.

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So, is this suggestion still a thing?

It would make trading and development of prices much more interesting if alliances could embargo entire other alliances.

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or yall can actually try to engage with your respective members instead of treating them as pawns in a power fantasy

rawr

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5 hours ago, katashimon13 said:

or yall can actually try to engage with your respective members instead of treating them as pawns in a power fantasy

rawr

Same applies for taxes I guess. In the end we are all pawns.

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I fully agree. This is so easy to implement, I don't get why this hasn't been done yet

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1 hour ago, The USA said:

I fully agree. This is so easy to implement, I don't get why this hasn't been done yet

Because Alex thinks it's reasonable or possible for an alliance gov to get all of their members to setup individual embargos, and to just kick them if they refuse.

Alex doesn't play his own game, certainly not in any alliance or position that would teach him how misguided and myopic that viewpoint is, so that's the reason we get.

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2 hours ago, Akuryo said:

Because Alex thinks it's reasonable or possible for an alliance gov to get all of their members to setup individual embargos, and to just kick them if they refuse.

Alex doesn't play his own game, certainly not in any alliance or position that would teach him how misguided and myopic that viewpoint is, so that's the reason we get.

Exactly it is much simpler to just give alliances the power to embargo.

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On 4/19/2020 at 3:46 AM, Tamasith said:

So, is this suggestion still a thing?

It would make trading and development of prices much more interesting if alliances could embargo entire other alliances.

Exactly

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Posted (edited)

we should let the leaders also control builds

and change colors for people

and change policies

hell lets just let them fight wars too

the IA sector is for engagement... use it.... or get one

rawr

Edited by katashimon13
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1 hour ago, katashimon13 said:

we should let the leaders also control builds

and change colors for people

and change policies

hell lets just let them fight wars too

the IA sector is for engagement... use it.... or get one

rawr

This is a ridiculous argument. Nations in the real world have the power to sanction. Alliances are counterparts to nations in the real world. Therefore, alliances should have the power to embargo. You can say all you want about how alliances should be telling people to embargo, but it is just simply much easier for an alliance just to embargo another alliance or nation. It isn't that difficult to code.

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@Alex

This is what you said last time you opposed the idea:

  • You don't need alliance leaders to be able to force embargoes on your members, just have the alliance leaders instruct their members who to embargo.
  • If you can't get your members to cooperate, kick them out of the alliance.
  • I don't like the idea of taking away more sovereignty of individual players and putting it in the hands of the relatively few nations that control alliance governments.

Here are my arguments against your points.

Quote

You don't need alliance leaders to be able to force embargoes on your members, just have the alliance leaders instruct their members who to embargo.

By that logic, we should get rid of alliance taxes and have everyone voluntarily drop money into the alliance bank themselves. The fact is that it is much easier for an alliance leader to simply declare an alliance-wide embargo, just like setting an alliance tax. It isn't that complicated of a feature to add in.

Quote

If you can't get your members to cooperate, kick them out of the alliance.

Except that it is a million times easier for an alliance leader to embargo another alliance than look through 100 members and see whether or not they embargoed a particular nation or alliance.

Quote

I don't like the idea of taking away more sovereignty of individual players and putting it in the hands of the relatively few nations that control alliance governments.

I don't get how this argument makes any logical sense. When a nation joins an alliance, they are agreeing to give up some sovereignty to receive benefits from being part of an alliance. After all, if nations can give up all of their money by joining an alliance with a 100/100 tax rate, then I don't think it is that big of a deal to give up some sovereignty when alliance leaders can set an embargo. If a nation doesn't like it, they can quit the alliance. 

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I think as a fair middle ground, nations should embargo nations, and alliances embargo alliances.

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Posted (edited)

Pointless. An alliance shouldn’t be able to force his members to participate in alliance-wide embargoes. Every nation of an alliance can do it individually if the leadership ask them to and if they want.

Not sure what you’re trying to implement here.

Edited by Pascal

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1 hour ago, Pascal said:

An alliance shouldn’t be able to force his members to participate in alliance-wide embargoes.

Alliances can already force members to pay 100/100 of their income, and can sign treaties which prevent members from attacking. 

Why do embargoes suddenly cross the line for you and encroach too much on individual freedoms? (Especially when OP suggested that players should be able to opt out)

1 hour ago, Pascal said:

Not sure what you’re trying to implement here.

A way to simplify the process of mass embargoing. I try not to embargo anyone, but I'd imagine it's very cumbersome to maintain a list of alliances to embargo, and getting every member adding/removing embargos to adhere to that. 

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On 4/29/2020 at 2:07 AM, Pascal said:

Pointless. An alliance shouldn’t be able to force his members to participate in alliance-wide embargoes. Every nation of an alliance can do it individually if the leadership ask them to and if they want.

Not sure what you’re trying to implement here.

Alliances are able to force their members pay taxes yet they should not be allowed to set embargos against other alliances?

The individual freedom is that you can leave an alliance any time you want if you don't agree with that alliance's policies. This already applies for foreign and fiscal policies so why not for trading policies, too?

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wat if its not supposed to be easy to embargo entire swaths of the game have yall ever thought of that?

again.... engage and retain members/rulers

embargoing is a 1 time thing  per person it shouldnt be that difficult

hit them up the same time u swap builds/policies mmr/spies etc etc etc etc

for all the failed control freaks : https://store.steampowered.com/tags/en/Management/

rawr

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I don't think we want alliances going back to the Goon model of individually spamming embargoes. Tariffs are a much more nuanced idea.

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On 4/28/2020 at 4:18 PM, The USA said:

This is a ridiculous argument. Nations in the real world have the power to sanction. Alliances are counterparts to nations in the real world. Therefore, alliances should have the power to embargo. You can say all you want about how alliances should be telling people to embargo, but it is just simply much easier for an alliance just to embargo another alliance or nation. It isn't that difficult to code.

No nations are the counter part to nations in the real world LOL. Alliances are like nato. 

This suggestion came up before several times and the answers was a resounding no. Alliances shouldn’t control every aspect of their members. They need to use  diplomacy.

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Posted (edited)

Alliances are more similar to federal countries than international organizations. The ability to leverage sanctions against other countries and their states should be easy and built in.

Again, you can mass Embargo people but its annoying to monitor and spams an alliance page at minimum a hundred times for a mass member aa.

Edited by Epi

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