Of Dead Alliances

[Buorhann]

On 6/20/2023 at 5:59 AM, WarriorSoul said:

Finally, I do feel like picking this fight with UPN specifically is kinda lol considering they’ve got a 15+ year legacy they want to uphold, which is a rarity in any game, let alone nation sims. Perhaps that goes to your stubbornness point, but folks are unlikely to throw in the towel because “oh shit, folks are mad we haven’t merged yet”.

I'm starting to see "legacy" being thrown around more often here.

Do people understand how legacies are defined?  Just look at their history.  It's not a great legacy.  It started off great early PNW, but when it fell - it fell hard.  There's lots of OOC drama, some stupid shit, bad management, and some serious stagnation.  To the outside eye, there's lots more negatives than positives (I can't comment on their internals comparatively).  If you want to uphold your name for that kind of legacy, no one can stop you but to me, it's not a good point to bring up.

Keeping it together for the community I can understand, but anything beyond that...  some of these alliances just need to go.  They're just meat shields for other people's wars.

And UPN isn't the only alliance that falls under this.

 

Any player could run a 1man alliance, keep it for many years, then go "I'm keeping it for the legacy".  Ugh.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Buorhann

[Raphael]

6 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

See my post above, this is also incorrect, take off the rose colored glasses bud, maybe you think so because you are currently at 5 cities and you only interact with little crap nations, but the level of play in game within the major spheres is at or very close to the highest it has ever been.   And it is still a community with alliances that have an identity and are proud of it, see my alliance for a quick and easy reminder, or the one you are currently in. 

I agree with this post as well, lots of false-negativity about how the game has fallen off. I have my own share of critiques when it comes to this game and community, but the people who are feeling like the world has lost something are also the people who have disengaged themselves the most from the community. It becomes negativity to dare ask these people to come back into shared spaces. 

1 hour ago, Buorhann said:

I'm starting to see "legacy" being thrown around more often here.

Do people understand how legacies are defined?  Just look at their history.  It's not a great legacy.  It started off great early PNW, but when it fell - it fell hard.  There's lots of OOC drama, some stupid shit, bad management, and some serious stagnation.  To the outside eye, there's lots more negatives than positives (I can't comment on their internals comparatively).  If you want to uphold your name for that kind of legacy, no one can stop you but to me, it's not a good point to bring up.

Keeping it together for the community I can understand, but anything beyond that...  some of these alliances just need to go.  They're just meat shields for other people's wars.

And UPN isn't the only alliance that falls under this.

 

Any player could run a 1man alliance, keep it for many years, then go "I'm keeping it for the legacy".  Ugh.

This is more or less what I was trying to say, and about more than just UPN. While I recognize that age lends some gravitas to any group, it really doesn't define a legacy. UPN's history, in my mind, was as a group that had momentum in the early game of PnW but got beat out by competing powers over time. Then they tied themselves down to NPO and lost their individuality from there. Haven't seen them do or act in years, and I think when they fought the Johnsons it was revealed they're running a very weird off-meta MMR which just shows you how out of touch some insular groups can become.

The game's meta is so easy to understand and plan for, even if you don't feel like learning it just copy/paste what t$/Rose are doing with their nations and you'll have success. That's where the jokes and the "yelling" and the general sense of inferiority come from. Yet you can see in the responses I've gotten from these UPN people talking about their playstyle being judged, it's a victim complex. They'd rather be bad out of spite and pride.

[WarriorSoul]

3 hours ago, Buorhann said:

I'm starting to see "legacy" being thrown around more often here.

Do people understand how legacies are defined?  Just look at their history.  It's not a great legacy.  It started off great early PNW, but when it fell - it fell hard.  There's lots of OOC drama, some stupid shit, bad management, and some serious stagnation.  To the outside eye, there's lots more negatives than positives (I can't comment on their internals comparatively).  If you want to uphold your name for that kind of legacy, no one can stop you but to me, it's not a good point to bring up.

Keeping it together for the community I can understand, but anything beyond that...  some of these alliances just need to go.  They're just meat shields for other people's wars.

And UPN isn't the only alliance that falls under this.

 

Any player could run a 1man alliance, keep it for many years, then go "I'm keeping it for the legacy".  Ugh.

I'm not really referring to in-game achievements as a legacy - it is remarkable when a community of any type keeps it together for a decade and a half. Like many, I've made and lost entire groups of real life friends in far less time than that. When I talk about legacy in this case, I am referring to what I mentioned in the second point of my post which was

Quote

For many, I would even suggest a majority, the community element of the game is far more important than the politicking that goes on.

Building a lasting community with people you like that stands the test of time is its own kind of legacy, irrespective of wins and losses.

[Kevanovia]

2 hours ago, WarriorSoul said:

Building a lasting community with people you like that stands the test of time is its own kind of legacy, irrespective of wins and losses.

You can have the community without having the in-game AA 🤷‍♂️ If you’re gonna do an in-game AA, at least play the game. And if you’re not, don’t whine that others are ‘toxic’ as an attempt to justify objectively sucking at the game. (‘You’ isn’t directed at anyone specific) It’s ***Politics*** and War, there is going to be shade thrown. If there wasn’t, then the “politics” of the game would be a lot like how these shlubs are playing and would likely lead to the death of the game 🤷‍♂️ 

Spice can be nice.

[Altheus]

@ Roberts. 

Chances are that you're criticizing certain alliances because you don't like them in the context of the game and want to hurt them. In which case, enjoy! Hard to have a game called Politics & War without someone indulging in the darkest corners of both politics & war. Moreover, without villainous deeds the game would go stale for everyone. However, in the event that you do genuinely think the alliances in question are a problem...

If an alliance doesn't fulfill a purpose it starts withering away. Sometimes that purpose is obvious, but other times it's not, at least not from the outside. At it's simplest an alliance just could just be a bunch of real friends who want to play a game together and who are we to say otherwise? In UPN's case there is no great mystery. We started back in 2007 and have enjoyed living through the highs and lows of various games whilst picking up plenty of friends along the way. It's a story that doesn't always require being on top because aiming for the top and failing is usually as entertaining as actually being on top. It's only about legacy in the sense that after 16 years we've got a lot of stories to tell.

But we're more interested in UPN's future stories, including how you can embellish it by attacking us. Seriously, wars and slanging matches are great way to add interest all round. I had great fun during our time in the Haunted Mansion bloc. The bloc was a flop, but writing the announcements was awesome (of which the Ghostbusters War defeat was the best, cheers to Kev!) 

Ultimately if you think an alliance is being boring and not contributing then pull one of the levers available to you to try and hasten their demise. Consider it their test. And if that doesn't work then maybe, just maybe, take that as a sign they're enjoying themselves too

 

[Raphael]

4 hours ago, Altheus said:

Chances are that you're criticizing certain alliances because you don't like them in the context of the game and want to hurt them.

UPN was actually the first alliance to reach out and protect my original AA in PnW and I appreciate you guys. You often make my list because I remember the positive legacy your group possesses.

The thing people often miss with a good "legacy" is that it doesn't have to be over or be the defining piece of your story. UPN has great tiering and 50+ members, Cora is a great person with good activity, you've been in UPN since before some players here were born. Even with Matt2004 dragging you down with his Britishness, I believe UPN can be great again.

Purple has always been for lovers, and I hope you guys make a big turnaround in Q3 2023.

[Diocletian]

On 6/22/2023 at 7:47 AM, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

See my post above, this is also incorrect, take off the rose colored glasses bud, maybe you think so because you are currently at 5 cities and you only interact with little crap nations, but the level of play in game within the major spheres is at or very close to the highest it has ever been.   And it is still a community with alliances that have an identity and are proud of it, see my alliance for a quick and easy reminder, or the one you are currently in. 

Hell, we used to be in the same alliance way back when, see VE. old age has made you even grumpier than I remember you back then, fitting alliance pick by the way lol. I'm obviously a reroll, but yes, 5 cities is so far treating me well. Reclaiming loot from people who have long since left the game is an important mission in and of itself. To the topic at hand though, the quality of players from even 2019 when I last played on my original account til now is far inferior. It seems a generally less involved and enthusiastic crowd.  I'm not saying *all* alliances have lost that identity, there will always be exceptions of course, but it's far less common now. 

Edited June 23, 2023 by Diocletian

[Kevanovia]

3 hours ago, Roberts said:

UPN was actually the first alliance to reach out and protect my original AA in PnW and I appreciate you guys. You often make my list because I remember the positive legacy your group possesses.

The thing people often miss with a good "legacy" is that it doesn't have to be over or be the defining piece of your story. UPN has great tiering and 50+ members, Cora is a great person with good activity, you've been in UPN since before some players here were born. Even with Matt2004 dragging you down with his Britishness, I believe UPN can be great again.

Purple has always been for lovers, and I hope you guys make a big turnaround in Q3 2023.

Of course Alt has been in UPN for a long time…he made it

[matt2004]

7 hours ago, Roberts said:

Even with Matt2004 dragging you down with his Britishness, I believe UPN can be great again.

 

I'd like to formally announce that I am running for President/General Secretary/Primarch/Consul Prime Minister of UPN, against the British incumbant, with the single manifesto commitment of making our already disproportionately European alliance British again.

[Raphael]

12 hours ago, Matt2004 said:

I'd like to formally announce that I am running for President/General Secretary/Primarch/Consul Prime Minister of UPN, against the British incumbant, with the single manifesto commitment of making our already disproportionately European alliance British again.

Daily reminder to continue our Vic3 game

[Vanek26]

On 6/22/2023 at 5:30 PM, WarriorSoul said:

I'm not really referring to in-game achievements as a legacy - it is remarkable when a community of any type keeps it together for a decade and a half. Like many, I've made and lost entire groups of real life friends in far less time than that. When I talk about legacy in this case, I am referring to what I mentioned in the second point of my post which was

Building a lasting community with people you like that stands the test of time is its own kind of legacy, irrespective of wins and losses.

Who would be dumb enough to hang out with the same group of idiots for 15+ years? 

[Malakai]

On 6/19/2023 at 2:59 PM, Roberts said:

These are just my personal thoughts on a topic that is a bit controversial.

 

I've felt recently that there are quite a few alliances in existence that don't participate in the wider community, don't really initiate or even contribute to politics, and generally only ever fight defensive wars when their inactivity or incompetence becomes the center of someone else's war of boredom. The reason I write this is because I feel that there has become an oversaturation of these alliances and we seemingly are living in a time of change for Orbis, so maybe this writing will prompt action.

The problem with these groups is usually not their inactivity as they log in often enough to function, sometimes just barely, as an alliance. The problem also does not lie with their incompetence, as the meta and politics are both relatively easy to learn and navigate. The issue is that stubborn pride is like a glacier: Locking up fresh water, inaccessible to the world. These alliances are host to several active players usually working hard to keep the wider group afloat, locked away from the community, and usually stuck in lower government positions long enough to drive them inactive.

Cora from UPN is a good example of a potentially great player in an alliance fallen from greatness long ago, and now can only be described as insular on their best day. UPN, The Immortals and Mortals, Dark Brotherhood, TCM, USN, and Gods of Orbis -- just to name a few from the top 50 -- have over 400 nations between them. 

That's almost 10% of all active nations, locked up like a glacier in insular communities that generally don't drive or even participate in politics. Food for thought.

You forgot to mention TKR.

[BigMorf]

4 hours ago, Malakai said:

You forgot to mention TKR.

We've been doing pretty damn good since you left! 

Makes you think. 

Thanks for the birthday present though! Gonna frame this one and put it on my wall. 

[Who Me]

Well hell there Roberts, Arrgh plays the game their way but you want to deny that option to others that you don't play the way you think they should? Classy...

[Yuki]

I'm new to the game (kinda) so what does participation look like? Are you talking about roleplay?

[Avatar Patrick]

11 hours ago, Yuki said:

I'm new to the game (kinda) so what does participation look like? Are you talking about roleplay?

RP doesn't play a huge role in the meta of this game. Some nations choose to do it but it's not essential by any means. Participation looks a bit different depending on your alliance and what their goals are but in general just be active and follow alliance orders and stuff. Eventually, you'll get noticed and have even more opportunities