ShiningLioness Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Buorhann said: You and I will disagree on this then. ODN had over 30+ members at the time we hit. They were decently built on military and they were within the range of actually being a threat to some valuable nations on our side. After seeing Atlas, WildFire, and... hell, I can't remember the others off the top of my head, jump in - I called the shot to remove any potential threat ODN could've been. Sure, they could've been completely innocent in this, but at that point and time - I wasn't going to risk it. If I had the opportunity to make that decision again, I'd have done it much earlier and without hesitation. I'd still do it, no matter the war. If you're a protectorate of an alliance we're at war with, you're going to get hit. I don't care who it is. I've learned over every single war since I've played that Protectorates are good AAs to use to help tip the scales in a war. This is also why I hate Protectorate treaties. I feel that they're the most worthless treaties in the game. If you cannot protect yourself, why make an AA? When I formed TGH, I was told several times to get a Protector and I said "Hell no", and we didn't. It might've been a good move if you'd hit anyone but ODN. :smug: E: omg, there's no smug emoticon? Lame. Edited April 20, 2018 by ShiningLioness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Scarfalot Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 1 minute ago, Buorhann said: This is also why I hate Protectorate treaties. I feel that they're the most worthless treaties in the game. If you cannot protect yourself, why make an AA? When I formed TGH, I was told several times to get a Protector and I said "Hell no", and we didn't. To be fair, TGH is in a much, much stronger position than an alliance of similar age with actual new players in it, and is more than capable of standing on its own. I mean c'mon, a top 15 alliance usually does the protecting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, Sir Scarfalot said: To be fair, TGH is in a much, much stronger position than an alliance of similar age with actual new players in it, and is more than capable of standing on its own. I mean c'mon, a top 15 alliance usually does the protecting. True, I won't deny that fact. We do have experienced players who are familiar with adapting to war mechanics, and we do have people who are influential in the political side of things. Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShiningLioness Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 7 minutes ago, Buorhann said: True, I won't deny that fact. We do have experienced players who are familiar with adapting to war mechanics, and we do have people who are influential in the political side of things. Not only that, but when we started out all our nations were literally one day old. We'd been considering updating the treaty with NPO to an MDP but hadn't got round to it yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Settra Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 55 minutes ago, ShiningLioness said: Not only that, but when we started out all our nations were literally one day old. We'd been considering updating the treaty with NPO to an MDP but hadn't got round to it yet. Seems like a good reason to hit you then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godwinson Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 Lol it would be interesting to see what this results in for both sides Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 On 4/18/2018 at 11:18 PM, Settra said: So then why isn't NPO protecting ODN? Because NPO has done what it is supposed to have done. ODN made a choice to stay in and there for nullified NPOs obligation. A protectorate really is a one way treaty in favor of the Protector. If the protectorate chooses to be aggressive it usually nullifies the treaty. If someone hits the protectorate then NPO has to defend. In this situation it can be argued strongly that ODN has made a choice against its protectors advice and therefor stands alone. NPO is under no obligation offer any help but I'm sure once peace is obtained will probably help with the rebuild. Ive known of Roq for a very long time hes a smart guy and loyal to his allies. On 4/19/2018 at 6:36 AM, Phino said: ODN should go paperless, being protectorate of someone else is showing you are weak ...and we all know ODN is not weak. So..cut all treaties now and start becoming an independent and strong alliance FAN version two? I have never been a fan of ODN in other realms, if this was how I saw them in other places then perhaps my opinion would be different. Here though I applaud you OS for doing what you and yours believe to be right consequences be damned. In other realms Ill see you eventually and hope that you have this same attitude. On 4/19/2018 at 8:22 AM, DragonK said: IoM activeates it's treaty in defesnse of TGH from ODN aggression. Arrgh! Funny thing about that white speck on top of chicken shit, its chicken shit too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Settra Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 3 minutes ago, Bud said: Because NPO has done what it is supposed to have done. It didn't defend ODN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Settra said: It didn't defend ODN. ODN is its own alliance it has chosen to stay at war even though its protector has given it the opportunity to exit. NPO can not be forced to defend when ODN makes this choice. Are you thick or just really trying too hard. Edited April 20, 2018 by Bud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvia Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, Buorhann said: This is also why I hate Protectorate treaties. I feel that they're the most worthless treaties in the game. If you cannot protect yourself, why make an AA? When I formed TGH, I was told several times to get a Protector and I said "Hell no", and we didn't. Personally I agree with you on this one point - if an alliance can not make the arrangements to protect oneself as soon as possible, find another alliance to join as a group. However the types of individuals who start alliances tend to do so because they want at least some level of being able to make their own decisions. Otherwise joining some larger alliance makes sense. So, if another group turns around and says do X or else, the last thing an independent minded group is going to do is X. Sometimes it just fires them up to do the opposite. In this particular case ( i. e. with ODN) in the short term you win because eventualky you will beat them down. In the long term they either become more inspired to join/stick with your enemy or quit. Perhaps you do not care, okay, but it does not change the fact that it is against your interests long term. Maybe a few might decide to join the more powerful side. If you want THAT type, enjoy. Edited April 20, 2018 by Sylvia Quote https://memecreator.org/static/images/memes/4526736.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 I'm not looking to unite all of Orbis. I already helped form one of the more powerful spheres in this game before. What I'm doing now is different. I'm perfectly ok with making enemies and/or developing new grudges. Gotta make irrelevant Alliances do something here now. Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Settra Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 3 hours ago, Bud said: ODN is its own alliance it has chosen to stay at war even though its protector has given it the opportunity to exit. NPO can not be forced to defend when ODN makes this choice. Are you thick or just really trying too hard. NPO didn't defend ODN when we first hit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 36 minutes ago, Settra said: NPO didn't defend ODN when we first hit them. well if that's the case NPO was wrong or ODN told them not too. I thought you were talking presently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OsRavan Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 54 minutes ago, Settra said: NPO didn't defend ODN when we first hit them. 17 minutes ago, Bud said: well if that's the case NPO was wrong or ODN told them not too. I thought you were talking presently. We have zero complaints with NPOs conduct to us in this war. When we were first hit, NPO was *already* at war with TGH. As TGH themselves have indicated they got involved for the (misguided and easily dispelled) reason of thinking we would be attacking them *for* NPO. Which, by the bye, is not something NPO asked us to do and is not how our treaty works. So if NPO didn't 'declare war' to defend us, that seems a weird and pointless formality. NPO has been in communication with us every step of the way, and has been nothing but helpful and supportive. The last thing we would want anyway, would be for our own desires to be forcing dozens of other alliances to stay in a war. So i'm all for everyone else peacing out. Just like we were not part of IQs war, they are not part of ours. I wouldn't want their plans to be derailed due to ours. Besides! They were distracting TGH. We want *ALL* of TGH for ourselves. None of these outsiders hogging their slots from us! We're very possessive that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bud Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 2 minutes ago, OsRavan said: We have zero complaints with NPOs conduct to us in this war. When we were first hit, NPO was *already* at war with TGH. As TGH themselves have indicated they got involved for the (misguided and easily dispelled) reason of thinking we would be attacking them *for* NPO. Which, by the bye, is not something NPO asked us to do and is not how our treaty works. So if NPO didn't 'declare war' to defend us, that seems a weird and pointless formality. NPO has been in communication with us every step of the way, and has been nothing but helpful and supportive. The last thing we would want anyway, would be for our own desires to be forcing dozens of other alliances to stay in a war. So i'm all for everyone else peacing out. Just like we were not part of IQs war, they are not part of ours. I wouldn't want their plans to be derailed due to ours. Besides! They were distracting TGH. We want *ALL* of TGH for ourselves. None of these outsiders hogging their slots from us! We're very possessive that way. If this is how it went then once again I ask Settra are you thick or just trying to hard. If NPO was already at war with TGH then what else could they do? How do you declare in defense of someone when your already at war with those whom you must defend your protectorate from. Wow that is confusing and I wrote it. Wasn't bagging anyone simply stating an observation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Settra Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 2 hours ago, Bud said: If this is how it went then once again I ask Settra are you thick or just trying to hard. If NPO was already at war with TGH then what else could they do? How do you declare in defense of someone when your already at war with those whom you must defend your protectorate from. Wow that is confusing and I wrote it. Wasn't bagging anyone simply stating an observation. I mean the argument has been made that NB didn't really hit IQ with 8 wars, I believe NPO only declared 8 wars with ~130 members. Gee Gee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShiningLioness Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Buorhann said: I'm not looking to unite all of Orbis. I already helped form one of the more powerful spheres in this game before. What I'm doing now is different. I'm perfectly ok with making enemies and/or developing new grudges. Gotta make irrelevant Alliances do something here now. Ouch. The old "you're irrelevant" accusation. That hurt me real bad, dude. Right in the hubris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchy Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 31 minutes ago, ShiningLioness said: Ouch. The old "you're irrelevant" accusation. That hurt me real bad, dude. Right in the hubris. I don't think it was intended as an insult rather than a statement of reality. Bigger and older alliances than yours exist that could easily be considered the same. I'm not sure what you guys expected to come out of this. A part of me wants to applaud you for showing some backbone, even if its a fairly large deviation from your original stance of "We won't even fight back", but its hard to ignore the futility of your plan, outside of winning some (not so easy) PR points with people not paying much attention (in which case, bravo btw, it worked). Ultimately your attempts to deal damage to us in some sort of retribution have failed. The idea you'll come anywhere close to the 10:1 ratio in damage you wagered in the OP is highly unlikely at this point, as the only people you can target (and aren't even targeting to your fullest potential currently), are smaller and have less infra to grind through, and you are losing to them. You have 4 people who are inactive for more than a week, another 6 in beige, and the rest are either ZMed or about to be. Anyway, thanks for the targets?? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OsRavan Posted April 21, 2018 Author Share Posted April 21, 2018 42 minutes ago, Sketchy said: I don't think it was intended as an insult rather than a statement of reality. Bigger and older alliances than yours exist that could easily be considered the same. I'm not sure what you guys expected to come out of this. A part of me wants to applaud you for showing some backbone, even if its a fairly large deviation from your original stance of "We won't even fight back", but its hard to ignore the futility of your plan, outside of winning some (not so easy) PR points with people not paying much attention (in which case, bravo btw, it worked). Ultimately your attempts to deal damage to us in some sort of retribution have failed. The idea you'll come anywhere close to the 10:1 ratio in damage you wagered in the OP is highly unlikely at this point, as the only people you can target (and aren't even targeting to your fullest potential currently), are smaller and have less infra to grind through, and you are losing to them. You have 4 people who are inactive for more than a week, another 6 in beige, and the rest are either ZMed or about to be. Anyway, thanks for the targets?? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ::eye roll:: you really need to stop with the 'wouldnt even fight back." Seriously, I cant imagine your purposely misconstruing that reflects positively on you. Yes yes you get some 'pr points' from purposely mis-nterpreting my words if that actually matters to you. And I suppose if I am honest, I find it vaguely annoying lol. Which is maybe why you are doing it ::grins::. But you do realize we were never 'not fighting back' and the comment was CLEARLY referencing your catching us by surprise in the first round? Wouldn't it be so much better for the game if, when someone in good spirits and good humor compliments your attack and how they wont even be able to hit back that round as a result of your skill..... that you just accept that in good spirits instead of trying to turn it into something its not? In any event we are already far exceeding the 10:1 ratio of damage so far... so thanks? If this is so good for you, then stop complaining and griping and enjoy ::amused::. WE are happy and enjoying fighting you all. We are satisfied with the damage we are doing. We dont need you to be 'looking out for us' or telling us whats 'really' in our best interest. If this is so easy and enjoyable for you, why not stop with the complaints, the insults, the unwanted advice, etc and just get into the battlefield and enjoy yourselves? That's what we are doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sketchy Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, OsRavan said: ::eye roll:: you really need to stop with the 'wouldnt even fight back." Seriously, I cant imagine your purposely misconstruing that reflects positively on you. Yes yes you get some 'pr points' from purposely mis-nterpreting my words if that actually matters to you. And I suppose if I am honest, I find it vaguely annoying lol. Which is maybe why you are doing it ::grins::. But you do realize we were never 'not fighting back' and the comment was CLEARLY referencing your catching us by surprise in the first round? Wouldn't it be so much better for the game if, when someone in good spirits and good humor compliments your attack and how they wont even be able to hit back that round as a result of your skill..... that you just accept that in good spirits instead of trying to turn it into something its not? In any event we are already far exceeding the 10:1 ratio of damage so far... so thanks? If this is so good for you, then stop complaining and griping and enjoy ::amused::. WE are happy and enjoying fighting you all. We are satisfied with the damage we are doing. We dont need you to be 'looking out for us' or telling us whats 'really' in our best interest. If this is so easy and enjoyable for you, why not stop with the complaints, the insults, the unwanted advice, etc and just get into the battlefield and enjoy yourselves? That's what we are doing. Maybe because that's not how it read lmfao. It isn't as clear as you claim it is. I suppose I'll just take your word for it. I wasn't complaining, nor was I really "giving advice". You and I have never spoken before, just trying to figure out what your about. Unfortunately, I'm out of range, so I won't be able to join the fight. Everyone is too small for me these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OsRavan Posted April 21, 2018 Author Share Posted April 21, 2018 The small fries get to have all the fun ::Grins::. I think im lucky enough that i'm *just* big enough due to my cities that with a few ships I can reach up and grab some targets that nukes will still mess up. Course I suppose that means all your big guys will pound on me heh. But yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pubstomper Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 44 minutes ago, OsRavan said: The small fries get to have all the fun ::Grins::. I think im lucky enough that i'm *just* big enough due to my cities that with a few ships I can reach up and grab some targets that nukes will still mess up. Course I suppose that means all your big guys will pound on me heh. But yeah. "Dear Leader ShiningLioness of New Pelorin detonated a nuclear weapon upon your nation of Chemistry. The attack destroyed 715.00 infrastructure in the city of Sulfur as well as a stadium and a steel mill." This is the greatest stat we pad. It's a damn shame you guys are already giving up on conventional warfare, you only hit me with 3 guys when I had a single days worth of planes right after peace was announced in the larger war - still losing your wars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostWorld Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 Good luck ODN. May the best savage win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcKnox Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 https://politicsandwar.com/nation/id=68052 Newly released footage of ODN's foreign policy: 2 Quote Praise Dio. Every !@#$ing day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted April 22, 2018 Share Posted April 22, 2018 That fat 2400 Infra cities. Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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