The Great Debate on Atheism

[Peter Quill]

I can only assume how well this thread will end.

/sarcasm

I hate these kinds of threads. Can't I just be a theist in peace, and leave atheists to their peace as well?

https://politicsandwar.com/forums/index.php?/topic/10486-can-we-just-all-stop-fighting-over-religion/

^ This basically.

Us atheists don't need to debate, we already know we're right.

Great debate skills you have there. /sarcasm

[Moreau]

lol atheist logic is so stupid

[Stormrideron]

Can't we just accept the fact that God is fake? It is just a mythical creation for low life human beings to fear and follow while giving the kings and leaders excuses to do whatever "god" tells them to and because they can.

[Rozalia]

@Roz where do you see a dead person come back to this life again return from the womb of a woman?

Life is one way, not a cycle of seasons.

Did we already exist in different age of period of the past?

 

What is a body but a shell for the spirit? Those who fail to ascend to the spiritual realm are cursed to wander hell (Earth) again and again. The Demiurge thus uses tools like religion (including atheism) to keep people as ignorant as he is so they can never leave hell.

[Fox Fire]

Theism in a classical sense is extremely unlikely. The roots of religions, according to experts, appears to have evolved as a social construct out of our own intellect, and branched off as a revivalist type movement in the wake of charismatic, intelligent people. ^[1][2] The primary conflict between theism and atheism is probably the fact that science has a method for confirming its assertions as fact through experimentation and is always subject to change based on new evidence. Religion has no such method for confirming anything about its own assertions.  

So let's skip a wall of text about science vs scripture and get right to the point. Going back to the beginning of time, the big bang, theists will argue that something must have come before the big bang. I agree. The big bang is clearly a reaction, but was it a God that initiated this? No. Not any God in any traditional sense could have logically created the universe. 

All of our knowledge is based on interpretations of a limited perception. Further more, if everything in the universe began as a singularity ^[3], that means that every imaginable concept your limited human consciousness could possibly comprehend is bound within this singularity. Any God beyond, unbound or individual from this singularity is logically beyond it's countless concepts if it can exist outside of it's singular form. Not a single thing you could think of could possibly be used to explain God. The closest you could ever come to explaining God is to sum up the entirety of existence, and even then, you would have no knowledge of God. Only your own existence.

Our conscious experience is the conscious experience of the universe itself. We can conclude that from the idea that the universe is a singular thing. Anything outside of it (if anything at all) is beyond comprehension or concept. Good and Evil become non-existent as even possibly being concepts at the point of a singularity. They fundamentally "do not exist". There is no "you". "You" are physically and fundamentally a part of your environment. Being conscious doesn't change that solid fact.

So what did come before the big bang? Well the leading theories for the source of the big bang in modern times are:

• A black hole multi verse, meaning every black hole is a universe and our universe is the inverse of a black hole inside of another universe. The math adds up and black holes are the only place where a singularity can be found in space.
• Mass quantum fluctuations of vacuum gravity literally caused the universe to pop into existence, all by itself. After all, we know that this is what essentially keeps the universe going. The universe could not exist without it. ^[4][5]

^​Thus, no God is required to initiate our own existence. Nor is a traditional concept of deity logically possible. But regardless of any way we look at our reality, our existence remains, and always will be, illogical. "What came fist, the chicken or the egg?" We can place the archetype of existence at any point we desire, but the only reason we even attempt to do this is because our egos exist in a very brief and linear manner. The way we perceive nature makes us assume that existence is linear, but you can never use logic to explain existence, because the phenomena itself is completely illogical. When eastern philosophies such as Taoism speak of "transcendence", this is what they are referring to. The ability to see beyond concepts and labels.

Thus do I conclude that the "nature" or "existence" is a paradox. There was never a beginning. There will never be an end. I argue that this nature is self justifying as one might with a God. Nothing needed create it. It's far greater than the human mind could possibly comprehend and just as capable as any God of being self justified, if not more so, based on scientific theory.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Fox Fire

[Abu Haddad]

I have a story. it is true

I live near a river but then the bridge collapsed in spring.

then as i waited a tree fell and cut into planks and made me a bridge

and then i crossed

[durmij]

I have a story. it is true

I live near a river but then the bridge collapsed in spring.

then as i waited a tree fell and cut into planks and made me a bridge

and then i crossed

You need help. Not from a god, but from a psychiatrist.

[Captain_Vietnam]

You need help. Not from a god, but from a psychiatrist.

http://psychologydebunked.com/

[Abu Haddad]

You need help. Not from a god, but from a psychiatrist.

there i win.

[Fox Fire]

I have a story. it is true

I live near a river but then the bridge collapsed in spring.

then as i waited a tree fell and cut into planks and made me a bridge

and then i crossed

Is this your argument for theism? 

[Abu Haddad]

Is this your argument for theism? 

it is not, it is my argument against atheism 

Edited March 7, 2016 by Abu Haddad

[Fox Fire]

it is not, it is my argument against atheism 

Well congrats. You've definitely lost.

[Abu Haddad]

so is my story a lie or a not lie?

[Fox Fire]

so is my story a lie or a not lie?

It's irrelevant is what it is.

[Abu Haddad]

why is it irrelevant. it is part of the debate of Imam Abu Hanifah rahimuhullah

so answer me directly is it a lie or not?

[Fox Fire]

why is it irrelevant. it is part of the debate of Imam Abu Hanifah rahimuhullah

so answer me directly is it a lie or not?

There is no way of validating such a story thus such an answer cannot be given. However, considering that no tree has ever been recorded as cutting itself into planks, and that such an act is physically impossible, we can assume it's a lie. 

I hope you have a point here.

[Abu Haddad]

 physically impossible, we can assume it's a lie. 

 

There i win.

The same way a bridge cannot create itself, the universe cannot have created itself it is physically impossible and we can assume it is a lie

next!!

[Fox Fire]

There i win.

The same way a bridge cannot create itself, the universe cannot have created itself it is physically impossible and we can assume it is a lie

next!!

But it's not. I just explained to you how it very much, is physically possible. So physically possible, that it's happening right now, in front of your face. You're watching the whole thing.

[Lannan13]

You owe me and Lannan13 royalties because we did this first and much better.

Indeed. The sad part is that I could beat him in a debate on this matter and I'm a theist. 

[Lannan13]

Dear Rozalia God cannot be evil and ignorant. If God wanted to be worshipped he would have made humanity worship him using his good powers.

If every human who has ever lived asked for what he wanted from Allah. It will be but a drop in the ocean for him.

Allah does not need our worship. If every human whoever lived didn't do a single good dead then Allah would have neither gained nor lost anything.

Every day 7000 Angels appear in heaven and do constant tawaaf around the equivalent of the kaabah in Janat. Then these Angels disspear at the end of the day.

Therefore God does not need our worship but we need to worship him and him only or suffer eternity in Jahanam

Under this case you are arguing that God cannot be all powerful, because God is everything and under your argument you are limiting his abilities and hence arguing that he doesn't exist. 

Fine, I vote that Abu won.

lol, is this a joke?

[Lannan13]

I have a story. it is true

I live near a river but then the bridge collapsed in spring.

then as i waited a tree fell and cut into planks and made me a bridge

and then i crossed

That's nature, your point is irrelivant. 

[Lannan13]

there i win.

You haven't made a solid sound argument for God this entire thread. If anything, you win penny for me feeling sorry for your faulty thinking. 

Edited March 7, 2016 by Lannan13

[Lannan13]

so is my story a lie or a not lie?

The BOP is on you, so we don't have to answer that question. You have to prove it was the truth.

[Lannan13]

There i win.

The same way a bridge cannot create itself, the universe cannot have created itself it is physically impossible and we can assume it is a lie

next!!

Then who made God? 

 

Your argument is that everything is created and if everything is created then God too in it of himself had also have been created. 

[Captain_Vietnam]

Then who made God? 

 

Your argument is that everything is created and if everything is created then God too in it of himself had also have been created. 

why do you have ayn rand who was athiest and say your christian?