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Prefontaine

TEst Declaration of War

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Why do you have ships friend? 

I used them to blockade somebody a little while back. Now I keep them around and patch up the holes with copious amounts of money on a semi-weekly basis. Why? Is it important?

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Quite frankly it appears as though TFP is in a quest to not appear weak to orbis. By not surrendering they can say they fought hard and are strong enough to fend off raids. Unfortunately the reality is by fighting too hard they get weakened enough to the point where they are unable to fight off raids

Actually we would be happy to accept a peace offer but unlike others we want peace with honour, not dishonour. We are also setting an example to the rest of Orbis who are sitting back and letting TEst do what they like. Its easy to appear strong and talk big when it is three against one and you only select members with at least 14 cities. Join a small alliance and see how YOU get on.

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Its easy to appear strong and talk big when it is three against one and you only select members with at least 14 cities. Join a small alliance and see how YOU get on.

 

Downdeclare only goes so far.  Also, a ridiculous proportion of us are former leaders, mostly from comparatively small alliances. In fact, until fairly recently (a few months ago, with a large gain about a month ago from merging with Sparta) TEst had few members.  We still have about a quarter fewer members than TFP, incidentally.  The only reason we're currently #1 (and about to slip to #2) is because Sheepy made military such a ridiculous portion of score and most people's militaries have died or, more recently, decommed.

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For anyone actually interested, I believe the only term given was to change their flag for a month. I think we may have even offered to donate the credits for it.

 

That's the honor you're fighting for? I mean, it's not like we asked for an essay on Dioism.

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For anyone actually interested, I believe the only term given was to change their flag for a month. I think we may have even offered to donate the credits for it.

 

That's the honor you're fighting for? I mean, it's not like we asked for an essay on Dioism.

 

What makes your offer strange is that you get absolutely nothing from it. No gain at all. You just try to ridicule another alliance. Copying from the wiki:

the members of TEst unanimously decided to attack TFP not only because of their neutrality, but also primarily because they wanted more fun"

 

So, ridiculing another alliance is just part of your fun. That says a lot about your mentality.

 

I think that if you saw that your opponent had no respect about you, you would make the same choice.

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What makes your offer strange is that you get absolutely nothing from it. No gain at all. You just try to ridicule another alliance. Copying from the wiki:

the members of TEst unanimously decided to attack TFP not only because of their neutrality, but also primarily because they wanted more fun"

 

So, ridiculing another alliance is just part of your fun. That says a lot about your mentality.

 

I think that if you saw that your opponent had no respect about you, you would make the same choice.

 

Mocking and burning neutrals is good fun, it should always be aspired to. It's a reward by itself. There's no reason to be coy here, neutral alliances are nothing but loot and target practice for the rest of us. If you don't like it, you can choose to stop being neutral or choose to fight but only one of those options could potentially end the ridicule. Frankly, you're not going to be able to evade being made fun of through war and otherwise as long as you're a neutral alliance.

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.  We still have about a quarter fewer members than TFP, incidentally.  The only reason we're currently #1 (and about to slip to #2) is because Sheepy made military such a ridiculous portion of score and most people's militaries have died or, more recently, decommed.

You might have a quarter fewer but your points were double and the amount of members within your range amounted to about 15. The only reason we were no.8 was for the same reason as youu, Sh -- I mean Alex's increase in military points.

 

 I think we may have even offered to donate the credits for it.

 

 

Not true

 

 Frankly, you're not going to be able to evade being made fun of through war and otherwise as long as you're a neutral alliance.

I have already addressed this earlier. We are not neutral. We are pacifist unless attacked and are well used to being attacked. Have you heard any of us complaining about you attacking us? Ask Arrgh, Mensa or TKR if we have ever complained. We are up for it. What rank we are doesn't bother us. We are not pixel huggers. 

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No point in trying to explain the same thing again and again Cromwell. It's too hard for some people to actually understand the difference between neutrals and pacifists.

The funny thing is that if an alliance does NOT decide to raid other alliances (for fun), they are the bad guys and the ones that have to be made fun of. :P 

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I have already addressed this earlier. We are not neutral. We are pacifist unless attacked and are well used to being attacked. Have you heard any of us complaining about you attacking us? Ask Arrgh, Mensa or TKR if we have ever complained. We are up for it. What rank we are doesn't bother us. We are not pixel huggers. 

 

So, you're neutral with illusions of being otherwise. Good to know. You don't start wars, you don't make friends, you don't have alliances. As far as anyone outside of your alliance is concerned, that makes you neutral. You can keep arguing against that if you'd like but until you stop acting like a neutral alliance it will do you no good whatsoever. I have never attacked you though I sure wanted/want to and I applaud those who have. I haven't claimed that you have complained about fighting either, my post was in reference to your alliance member complaining about other alliances having fun at your expense and what is seemingly his claim that "having fun" isn't a good enough reason to attack/ridicule someone.

 

The funny thing is that if an alliance does NOT decide to raid other alliances (for fun), they are the bad guys and the ones that have to be made fun of. :P

 

That's exactly right. Suck it, you filthy neutral.

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No point in trying to explain the same thing again and again Cromwell. It's too hard for some people to actually understand the difference between neutrals and pacifists.

Says the person making up his own definition(s) for the word pacifist. Clearly we're the stupid ones in this equation.

 

I think you've also confused yourselves on what honor is. You're going full Alpha for truly laughable reasons. You think you're making valid points. You think your standing up to tyranny. You think you're the plucky hero in this story. Ignorance does not denote honor. Enjoy getting your alliance burnt down hard because you don't have a clue with what you're doing.

 

I'd pity you, but I don't feel remorse towards childish stupidity.

Edited by Prefontaine

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So, you're neutral with illusions of being otherwise. Good to know. You don't start wars, you don't make friends, you don't have alliances. As far as anyone outside of your alliance is concerned, that makes you neutral. You can keep arguing against that if you'd like but until you stop acting like a neutral alliance it will do you no good whatsoever. I have never attacked you though I sure wanted/want to and I applaud those who have. I haven't claimed that you have complained about fighting either, my post was in reference to your alliance member complaining about other alliances having fun at your expense and what is seemingly his claim that "having fun" isn't a good enough reason to attack/ridicule someone.

 

 

That's exactly right. Suck it, you filthy neutral.

 

I know that you have to insult others so that you will feel a little bit more important. I understand. Your life must be quite hard and you have to burst somewhere. :)

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Says the person making up his own definition(s) for the word pacifist. Clearly we're the stupid ones in this equation.

 

I think you've also confused yourselves on what honor is. You're going full Alpha for truly laughable reasons. You think you're making valid points. You think your standing up to tyranny. You think you're the plucky hero in this story. Ignorance does not denote honor. Enjoy getting your alliance burnt down hard because you don't have a clue with what you're doing.

 

I'd pity you, but I don't feel remorse towards childish stupidity.

 

Once more you forget the "fighting" part at our description. And, once more, you say we have no friends, which is also false. You could really spend some time reading our history and alliance description. I find no reason to argue on this. We do not want to raid others. When we are attacked, we defend ourselves, we are not trying to get revenge against our attackers and we always try to befriend them. End of story. You have no valid reason to belittle this policy. Of course, it is awkard for you trying to find excuses for raiding when there are alliances that do not raid. You don't like that because this shows another path which can be followed in this game.

 

I will not say that you are stupid like you did for us, because ad hominem attacks in discussions prove nothing (well, they actually prove you are wrong or you have no arguments). But let me return the word "childish". You are the ones that started a war for fun as you declared. And it's ok being childish here. It's a game. But getting angry at others for such reasons? :)

Edited by Dorgam

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You might have a quarter fewer but your points were double and the amount of members within your range amounted to about 15. The only reason we were no.8 was for the same reason as youu, Sh -- I mean Alex's increase in military points.

 

Not true

 

I have already addressed this earlier. We are not neutral. We are pacifist unless attacked and are well used to being attacked. Have you heard any of us complaining about you attacking us? Ask Arrgh, Mensa or TKR if we have ever complained. We are up for it. What rank we are doesn't bother us. We are not pixel huggers. 

 

Have you ever experienced a full fledgded war that goes longer then a 1 round raid. Like 4 rounds, 5 rounds, and counting? 

You didn't even ask for a white peace or changes on that flag design. Instead, you just threw me a shitty "Its all about pride, man. Nobody wants to be humiliated like GPA was, at least in this alliance." in the face.

Remember as long as you don't want peace, we're at war. 

I wonder what your members will do. Will they leave the alliance, will they quit the game over their stupid pride, are they content with being bombed over months?

You don't need to answer that as time will do.

 

And wtf. What's the difference between GPA and your alliance?  That you fight longer back? 

Ok, then the difference in neutrality and pacifism on Orbis is, that neutrals care about their Pixel and Pacifists like to watch theirs burn.

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Have you ever experienced a full fledgded war that goes longer then a 1 round raid. Like 4 rounds, 5 rounds, and counting? 

You didn't even ask for a white peace or changes on that flag design. Instead, you just threw me a shitty "Its all about pride, man. Nobody wants to be humiliated like GPA was, at least in this alliance." in the face.

Remember as long as you don't want peace, we're at war. 

I wonder what your members will do. Will they leave the alliance, will they quit the game over their stupid pride, are they content with being bombed over months?

You don't need to answer that as time will do.

 

And wtf. What's the difference between GPA and your alliance?  That you fight longer back? 

Ok, then the difference in neutrality and pacifism on Orbis is, that neutrals care about their Pixel and Pacifists like to watch theirs burn.

 

It is really funny to see you getting angry for no actual reason. I cannot really understand what is your problem. We just like our flags.

Regarding our members, the decision was taken after discussions between all of us. I thought that goes without saying. If not, this might mean you work in a less democratic manner. This is acceptable.

 

By the way, do you want any changes on that? http://prnt.sc/cmf1dl I was just wondering how the flag would look if you were pacifists/neutrals too.

 

And since you really do not understand the difference between neutrals and pacifists:

-) Neutral is someone who avoids taking sides.

-) Pacifist is someone who avoids fighting (and as a result avoids taking sides too). However, in this case, if a pacifist gets raided, most of the time he/she will try to solve the matter diplomatically rather than taking a raid as a casus belli. And since we have to fight back in case diplomacy cannot solve the matter peacefully, we are fighting pacifists.

-) A neutral most probably would not feel inclined to use diplomacy first.

 

I hope this was educative. Or, seriously, just google it. Here is some help: https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-neutrality-cowardice-and-pacifism

Edited by Dorgam

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Once more you forget the "fighting" part at our description. And, once more, you say we have no friends, which is also false. You could really spend some time reading our history and alliance description. I find no reason to argue on this. We do not want to raid others. When we are attacked, we defend ourselves, we are not trying to get revenge against our attackers and we always try to befriend them. End of story. You have no valid reason to belittle this policy. Of course, it is awkard for you trying to find excuses for raiding when there are alliances that do not raid. You don't like that because this shows another path which can be followed in this game.

 

I will not say that you are stupid like you did for us, because ad hominem attacks in discussions prove nothing (well, they actually prove you are wrong or you have no arguments). But let me return the word "childish". You are the ones that started a war for fun as you declared. And it's ok being childish here. It's a game. But getting angry at others for such reasons? :)

First, I never said anything about you having no friends, you tell me to read your alliance bio? Try reading the post you're actually replying. Second, I have read your alliance bio, which you're ignoring. You're not trying to make friends out of your enemies. If anything you're ensuring that people who really nothinged your alliance are now turning apathy towards murderous intent. Third, it isn't awkward, we have no reason for fighting you other than we wanted to. You can't seem to grasp simple concepts. Shows a different path? Please you aren't pioneers. You aren't innovators. You're fodder. I'm calling you stupid but you are clearly stupid. You have no clue what you're doing. You have no clue what's going on. And you keep flapping along thinking you have the slightest shred of competence. You lack everything involved with playing this game and make up for it with blustering ignorance. They prove I'm wrong? They prove I have no arguments? All you have proven is a death wish combined with stupidity. I will gladly raid your alliance to dust. Once you're too tiny for us to hit because you're out of our range I'll pay someone smaller to raid you the rest of the way to oblivion.

 

I'm not angry over a game. I'm angry having to share the same thread with someone as overwhelmingly ignorant as yourself.

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It is really funny to see you getting angry for no actual reason. I cannot really understand what is your problem. We just like our flags.

Regarding our members, the decision was taken after discussions between all of us. I thought that goes without saying. If not, this might mean you work in a less democratic manner. This is acceptable.

 

By the way, do you want any changes on that? http://prnt.sc/cmf1dl I was just wondering how the flag would look if you were pacifists/neutrals too.

 

1. I'm not angry, only annoyed over those levels of stupidity. As i said, have fun watching your pixels getting burned. 

2. Flags? You actually have more then one?   The offer was to upload an alliance flag for 1 month. What your individual nations are hoisting isn't of any importance.

3. About the TEst flag. You can try it out if that's your wish. Gid Gud. Win wars. 

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First, I never said anything about you having no friends, you tell me to read your alliance bio? Try reading the post you're actually replying. Second, I have read your alliance bio, which you're ignoring. You're not trying to make friends out of your enemies. If anything you're ensuring that people who really nothinged your alliance are now turning apathy towards murderous intent. Third, it isn't awkward, we have no reason for fighting you other than we wanted to. You can't seem to grasp simple concepts. Shows a different path? Please you aren't pioneers. You aren't innovators. You're fodder. I'm calling you stupid but you are clearly stupid. You have no clue what you're doing. You have no clue what's going on. And you keep flapping along thinking you have the slightest shred of competence. You lack everything involved with playing this game and make up for it with blustering ignorance. They prove I'm wrong? They prove I have no arguments? All you have proven is a death wish combined with stupidity. I will gladly raid your alliance to dust. Once you're too tiny for us to hit because you're out of our range I'll pay someone smaller to raid you the rest of the way to oblivion.

I'm not angry over a game. I'm angry having to share the same thread with someone as overwhelmingly ignorant as yourself.

 

1. You are right and I am sorry about this misunderstanding. This was an answer to Big Brother's comment from Syndicate: "So, you're neutral with illusions of being otherwise. Good to know. You don't start wars, you don't make friends, you don't have alliances."

2. We do try to make friends. But, this is not only up to us. If the other party does not respect you, it is difficult to call it a friend. I hope you see this point.

3. So, to prove that we do not show another path, you bring up as an argument that... we are "fodder" and stupid. Yes, this is a really valid point. Please, for the sake of the debate, try to prove that we do the same with all the others or sticking to our ideas is wrong.

4. Insults, insults, we know nothing, we are stupid. Ok. I know this is internet rage, but if you are supposed to be a diplomat representing an alliance, try to control it. It's not like I actually care about your insults and the fact you make this a personal matter. But, it is really tiring trying to find your arguments that do matter at your answers. I have to use a huge filter to do that!

5. You will gladly raid us till we become dust, because... oh, yes. We like our flag. Or because you got angry? It might be this. And you got angry because?

 

I don't know. Try to think a little bit more clearly. Find your arguments, present them in an organized manner and ask for an answer from us. State what is your problem with us. The fact we didn't like the flag? The fact that we care about the flag?

 

I will gladly answer to anything you want, always avoiding to insult you.

 

P.S. Personally, I really like the flag you designed. It kept icons of pacifism that were covered with blood. To my view, this flag described exactly our story. But since the crushing majority found this term offensive, you cannot say that this is unacceptable. That's how people feel and you cannot change that.

Edited by Dorgam

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1. I'm not angry, only annoyed over those levels of stupidity. As i said, have fun watching your pixels getting burned. 

2. Flags? You actually have more then one?   The offer was to upload an alliance flag for 1 month. What your individual nations are hoisting isn't of any importance.

3. About the TEst flag. You can try it out if that's your wish. Gid Gud. Win wars. 

 

You forgot to answer to this:

 

"And since you really do not understand the difference between neutrals and pacifists:

-) Neutral is someone who avoids taking sides.

-) Pacifist is someone who avoids fighting (and as a result avoids taking sides too). However, in this case, if a pacifist gets raided, most of the time he/she will try to solve the matter diplomatically rather than taking a raid as a casus belli. And since we have to fight back in case diplomacy cannot solve the matter peacefully, we are fighting pacifists.

-) A neutral most probably would not feel inclined to use diplomacy first.

 

I hope this was educative. Or, seriously, just google it. Here is some help: https://www.quora.co...ce-and-pacifism

 

"

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1. You are right

4. we know nothing, we are stupid

I've highlighted the important parts of your post. I'd reply further to you, but I've spent enough time trying to educate you.

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I've highlighted the important parts of your post. I'd reply further to you, but I've spent enough time trying to educate you.

 

Well, thanks for your concern. Although, I have to point out that you are a poor educator, considering your arguments.

In any case, if you do feel like answering to the matters of this discussion that do matter, I will be more than happy to bolster this conversation.

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So what would TFP consider a "honorable peace"?

 

And this is a question that actually moves the conversation forward! :)

 

I will only talk for my point of view. Simple peace terms regarding non-aggresion, or reparations, even keeping the military to specific levels and so on, should be acceptable. All these are just numbers and things that can be fixed and dealed with when the time passes. But terms that have as the ONLY goal to belittle the one who lost and humiliate an alliance for just defending its ideals (which do not seem clear to everybody) is a lot different.

 

In my view, the problem is not that the terms do not provide a "honorable" peace, but that they just provide a "dishonorable" one. A simple peace would be ok. A "honorable" peace would be something like casual terms + formalities/announcements to show mutual respect ("gg guys, I really felt that nuke"). This is not something we ask for. We did not ask for a "honorable" peace. We would be ok with peace terms that would not be dishonorable.

Edited by Dorgam

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I know that you have to insult others so that you will feel a little bit more important. I understand. Your life must be quite hard and you have to burst somewhere. :)

 

No, that was just my sense of humor. Considering that you apparently don't consider fun to be a good enough reason to do something, I didn't really expect you to understand. Looks like you fulfilled my expectations ;)

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