72 hour notice no more?

[Mac]

I wanted to launch this thread because I felt it time to respond to some things.... The great team of Atlas has been through a lot. After taking in Commo's team, and paying all their debts off, they ripped our alliance in half twice. Camelot dropped us two short weeks later claiming the world was ending and nanos and micros didnt matter anymore. We have spent the last two weeks with great people from WAP trying to piece together the dedicated group, a daunting task by both sides to undergo. WAP said they wanted to try and improve us, we tried very hard but when we struggled with issues or weren't online fast enough they would get angry with us, we started to feel after a few days that they were being really harsh. 
 

Our gov was worried that we wouldn’t be welcome and we decided to try and find a new protectorate, one who would be patient and help us with hard tech things that we don’t understand. WAP has dropped us today with no 72 hour notice claiming that we did not try at all to comply with anything they said, while also claiming looking for others protectorates is against the treaty. 

 

WAP deleted our embassy so we have no record of any of the conversations, but we have been working extremely hard. We have raised our revenue by tons, increased our members recruitment and found two government officials we can count on to help fix builds and help our guys get the help they need to learn the game. I honestly thought maybe they were just trying to motivate us but after they cut us we felt like everything was a joke to them and they never wanted to help us learn. 

 

It bothers me as a player, because I wonder why the norms seems to apply to everyone but us, when clearly the people inside my alliance want to be here with us and make things work, and be part of a community. It feels like because I don’t do well with a single issues and its hyper-focused on that this means I am a waste of their time, and that we shouldn’t have any expectations be given 3 days to leave.

 

I remember last year other alliances who didn't give notice were frowned on. 

 

We had a rough time in recent weeks, and are sorry that we let our friends at WAP down and always want to make our allies proud to be a part of our team.

Edited March 24 by Mac

[Tiberius Aurion]

Not giving a 72 hour notice got people in trouble last year. Whatever issues these guys had they deserved at least the bare minimum notice so they don’t get left high and dry all of a sudden. Hopefully someone picks them up and gets them help. This community needs to do more for smaller alliances to grow the player base.

[Fine]

Did your treaty include a clause for a 72 hour notice? If one was not included then WAP is not obligated to give one.

[Uncle Iroh]

Did you read the fine print?

[Tartarus]

28 minutes ago, Fine said:

Did your treaty include a clause for a 72 hour notice? If one was not included then WAP is not obligated to give one.

Thank the lord we have a Syndi authority on the case. PHD's in 72hrs lmfao

Edited March 24 by Tartarus

[BigGtheSlayer]

BigG, the FA head from WAP here. We gave you a 72 hour notice, and said we would continue to help you until you found another protector, but then were continually disrespected and then you flat out told us that you had been dealing in bad faith. We have your embassy archived if you’d like to have a look. Happy to show all the times that you shot yourself in the foot, most recently when your whole server got deleted because you refused to move over to one where you had admin because it was “too much effort”. Trust me mate, you don’t want this more public then it already is, best to let this lie, we’re sick of dealing with you.

[Fine]

16 minutes ago, Tartarus said:

Thank the lord we have a Syndi authority on the case. PHD's in 72hrs lmfao

I'll have you know I've earned a D.Fa on the study of 72 hour notices, 

[Rageproject]

My condolences 

[BigGtheSlayer]

57 minutes ago, Fine said:

Did your treaty include a clause for a 72 hour notice? If one was not included then WAP is not obligated to give one.

No, no it didn’t. Unrelated because we gave them the option anyways, but no, it wasn’t in our treaty agreement.

[EpimetheusTalks]

Does anyone have a serious counter-argument? I haven't heard any in the weeks since I posted it. If anything I understated how bad it is for new players even with the project discounts. You need to merge with your allies or your peers in the lower-tier. As it stands, you would need a 3+ year protectorate to catch-up even if you were very skilled.

Edited March 24 by EpimetheusTalks

[Rageproject]

21 minutes ago, EpimetheusTalks said:

Does anyone have a serious counter-argument? I haven't heard any in the weeks since I posted it. If anything I understated how bad it is for new players even with the project discounts. You need to merge with your allies or your peers in the lower-tier. As it stands, you would need a 3+ year protectorate to catch-up even if you were very skilled.

I don’t disagree with you on much of this. But it is why I feel the game doesn’t put in place the mechanisms to create any sort of balance — like capping out alliance membership numbers, or having a tiering safeguard that enables these mega alliances and nanos to exist and not compete in the same arena.

If an alliance is not Top 50-60 at this point, it’s not exactly relevant. And like Epi points out, the cut off for any relevancy is going to continue to shrink based on sheer exponential growth of the top tier alliances because that’s what the mechanics allow for.

This is all relevant to this topic of Atlas, because here’s an example of a micro that has (sorry Mac) become quickly declining in status in recent months for both internal and external factors. 

[Sketchy]

37 minutes ago, Rageproject said:

I don’t disagree with you on much of this. But it is why I feel the game doesn’t put in place the mechanisms to create any sort of balance — like capping out alliance membership numbers, or having a tiering safeguard that enables these mega alliances and nanos to exist and not compete in the same arena.

If an alliance is not Top 50-60 at this point, it’s not exactly relevant. And like Epi points out, the cut off for any relevancy is going to continue to shrink based on sheer exponential growth of the top tier alliances because that’s what the mechanics allow for.

This is all relevant to this topic of Atlas, because here’s an example of a micro that has (sorry Mac) become quickly declining in status in recent months for both internal and external factors. 

If you capped alliance numbers, alliances would just make multiple alliances. Wouldn't do much. There's not much to be gained by limiting player's freedom of movement.

As always, the solution remains to make the game more engaging and less draining for new players.

[Kendle]

papita sends you good wishes and hopes that a resolution is found at the earliest

Edited March 24 by Kendle

[Benfro]

7 hours ago, EpimetheusTalks said:

Does anyone have a serious counter-argument? I haven't heard any in the weeks since I posted it. If anything I understated how bad it is for new players even with the project discounts. You need to merge with your allies or your peers in the lower-tier. As it stands, you would need a 3+ year protectorate to catch-up even if you were very skilled.

Separate from my usual feelings about your somewhat baseless ramblings, it is really ripe to see you post this here of all places. You (Camelot, of which you are sole decision-making head) dropped the people of Atlas without giving them a long enough opportunity to adjust to your requests. Nobody is claiming they are perfect - see further post below - but you lost all credible argument space on this. We all know you like to puppet anyone who is silly enough to ask for your help ("we will send someone over" isn't how the rest of the civilized world treats prots,), but its rich to see you basically arguing merge or die. Maybe you were drawn here because for once someone was posting a complaint about a different alliance than Camelot.
 

10 hours ago, Mac said:

I wanted to launch this thread because I felt it time to respond to some things.... The great team of Atlas has been through a lot. After taking in Commo's team, and paying all their debts off, they ripped our alliance in half twice. Camelot dropped us two short weeks later claiming the world was ending and nanos and micros didnt matter anymore. We have spent the last two weeks with great people from WAP trying to piece together the dedicated group, a daunting task by both sides to undergo. WAP said they wanted to try and improve us, we tried very hard but when we struggled with issues or weren't online fast enough they would get angry with us, we started to feel after a few days that they were being really harsh.

 

~SNIP~

@Mac a couple of tips, both OOC and IC:
-Bold is a really great tool to use for headers breaking up a long post like this or to create emphasis on a short point. Using it through your entire post makes it difficult to read, let alone understand. But I will say from our limited interaction, this does match your communication style - long, rambling, limited punctuation, and no editing. If you want other people to respect you and bother responding, spending a minute cleaning up your thoughts goes a long way.
-This makes a third separate protectorate that has dropped you in six weeks. It is probably time to look in the mirror and figure out why that is. Sounds like you do not even need to request feedback, as plenty has been provided and ignored already.
-Finding potential partners and allies does mean having to compromise and adjust your preferences. If you fail to do so, often that pushes people away, like Camelot, WAP, and the nice people from Western Republic who de-merged from you. An important point here though: publicly going scorched earth on everyone when a relationship fails accomplishes nothing. You alienate others in a very small community of Orbis. To this point: please stop harassing the members of Western Republic. They have moved on after finding reasonable terms to separate, yet you continue to DM them privately and ping them publicly. Poaching attempts will no longer be ignored. Manage your own alliance with your members and leave those that chose to disassociate from you alone. (I would also suggest applying this advice to Camelot and WAP, because as you can see above, when you overstate your self-importance and publicly attempt to mislead, the other party can come along and correct the record.)
-Good luck in the future, sincerely. Most people would see this as a learning opportunity and try to do better next time. But I remain skeptical this will be the case for you. Leading is hard: Your members are counting on you to make good decisions and put them in the best possible situation. They trust you. I always try not to take such responsibility lightly. You might want to do the same.

[Sketchy]

4 hours ago, Benfro said:

Separate from my usual feelings about your somewhat baseless ramblings, it is really ripe to see you post this here of all places. You (Camelot, of which you are sole decision-making head) dropped the people of Atlas without giving them a long enough opportunity to adjust to your requests. Nobody is claiming they are perfect - see further post below - but you lost all credible argument space on this. We all know you like to puppet anyone who is silly enough to ask for your help ("we will send someone over" isn't how the rest of the civilized world treats prots,), but its rich to see you basically arguing merge or die. Maybe you were drawn here because for once someone was posting a complaint about a different alliance than Camelot.

If only Camelot could emulate TKR.

 

[The Titan]

16 hours ago, BigGtheSlayer said:

, but then were continually disrespected and then you

Why did you continually disrespect them? Smh

[Harry Flashman]

Perhaps if you stopped storming out of well intentioned chats like a hormonal brat, people might be able to give you some help and more importantly, a treaty. This is properly a you problem, and it really takes something to drag me into this place to post; congrats on that and good luck.

[Sweeeeet Ronny D]

You guys all need to emulate the old Grumpy standard of handshake naps.  If you need me, I got your back, if I need you, you got my back.  If you and I dont want to back each other up anymore, then we just call it a day go our separate ways.   Don't let silly paper get in the way of having each others backs.  One trusts most the ones they are willing to NAP with.

Also dont be a jackass, i dont know you, but from some of the feedback i am seeing in here from people i do know, they seem to think you are a jackass. I would recommend you stop doing that if you and your alliance want to be taken seriously.

[Buorhann]

7 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

You guys all need to emulate the old Grumpy standard of handshake naps.  If you need me, I got your back, if I need you, you got my back.  If you and I dont want to back each other up anymore, then we just call it a day go our separate ways.   Don't let silly paper get in the way of having each others backs.  One trusts most the ones they are willing to NAP with.

Also dont be a jackass, i dont know you, but from some of the feedback i am seeing in here from people i do know, they seem to think you are a jackass. I would recommend you stop doing that if you and your alliance want to be taken seriously.

Would you handshake with me?

[Sweeeeet Ronny D]

13 hours ago, Buorhann said:

Would you handshake with me?

We used to have a handshake...

 

Edit, i just looked at your treaties, and holy shit is there anyone you dont shake hands with?  You are a real handshake !@#$ aren't you?  Just giving out handshakes left and right.  There was a time when handshakes were special, and had to be earned, ya know, you take a person out for dinner first get to know em a little, and after a few interactions, maybe you extend that hand.  Not all just wam bam shake my hand.  

All that being said I will handshake with you, but you better wash your hands first.

Edited March 29 by Sweeeeet Ronny D

[Who Me]

31 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

We used to have a handshake...

 

Edit, i just looked at your treaties, and holy shit is there anyone you dont shake hands with?  You are a real handshake !@#$ aren't you?  Just giving out handshakes left and right.  There was a time when handshakes were special, and had to be earned, ya know, you take a person out for dinner first get to know em a little, and after a few interactions, maybe you extend that hand.  Not all just wam bam shake my hand.  

All that being said I will handshake with you, but you better wash your hands first.

You might want to put on a rubber glove before you shake their hand now that you have seen where they have been.

[Buorhann]

6 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

We used to have a handshake...

 

Edit, i just looked at your treaties, and holy shit is there anyone you dont shake hands with?  You are a real handshake !@#$ aren't you?  Just giving out handshakes left and right.  There was a time when handshakes were special, and had to be earned, ya know, you take a person out for dinner first get to know em a little, and after a few interactions, maybe you extend that hand.  Not all just wam bam shake my hand.  

All that being said I will handshake with you, but you better wash your hands first.

Hahahahaha

Letting my FA team have something to do.