BelgiumFury Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 33 minutes ago, Dryad said: i'm pretty sure this doesnt account for tips which kinda falisifies the net value. 132570 is cloaca / birdonwheels5 who has mostly played away games. with the most games played i would assume if we account for tipping then their income should be at a comparable size to blighty and who me. Maybe, but maybe it also doesn't, the thing of essence here is the amount of money generated in-game, by doing something that has very little to do with what the core of the game is about. 36 minutes ago, Alex said: No, they have not been banned. I was just underlining the most interesting cases. Now that I'm reviewing this data again, though, they may be on the chopping block for bans now. I don't see how anyone could play that many baseball games without a bot. The problem is Alex, if I had a bot for baseball, (which I don't) id just let it play a random amount of games between 400-1000 games, and use a random number generator which would decide if I shouldn't play baseball that day. (a 10% chance for example). I think it would be nearly impossible to track and would generate around 14 million (assuming 20K per game, 700 avg, no tipping) on everyday I let my bot run. Ofcourse there would be some costs to repay, but I think we can both see how much money this is to generate from a mechanic that isn't base game (as in, this game is a nation sim, not a baseball sim) and how this can be problematic. It is very automatable, very hard to detect and generates quite a lot of money. To put it in perspective, if baseball did not exist there would be 10% less money in the world, some might call this a drop in the bucket, but I don't think it is. I think baseball is just as dangerous as Keno if not more dangerous. Keno was a money sink on average (I hope at least), this is not a money sink, only a printing press. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 3 minutes ago, Inst said: And if GPWC and GOONS were willing to accept ban evaders, they could easily have a ban evasion account. My concern is more for Galerion and Birdonwheels, who are probably botting (given evidence), and given that Galerion is a member of your coalition, your side would make a massive shitstorm if we were to remove him. If he is botting and i believe he is, then he should be banned that simple. pretty both GPWC and goons would take in ban evaders lol after all there is zero punishment on the alliance for doing so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sphinx Posted January 24, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted January 24, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Alex said: Furthermore, now that we are looking at the data, it seems obvious that at least 3 nations have abused baseball using bots. In the 1,998 days the game has existed, these nations have each played around 1,000,000 games of baseball. That's, on average, ~500 games / day (a lot to do manually.) Realistically, they did not play 500 everyday, and must have had periods of playing more games at one time. But, these baseball teams haven't been around since the beginning of the game. The top revenue generating team (~$14.5 billion in-game) has only been around for 947 days. That's averaging 1,040 games per day. Has someone really dedicated hours every day for the past 3 years to playing baseball? Yes, that was a mistake - billions, not trillions. However, Blighty and Who Me have generated enourmous amounts of money playing baseball and very likely ran bots. Also birdsonwheels5, although they got less money out of it. See my above post. Alex, Who Me is retired, he has plenty of time to spam baseball whilst he looks after his property/IRL commitments. In Who Me's case he's averaged around 585 games a day, something which is entirely achievable, if you spam enough and have time. In the almost 4 years I've known him he's never used, condoned or spoken about botting with the exception of speaking out against them. You're making claims about the character of people without even understanding the context behind them. 14 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said: Cool but lets take away the sides and look at the facts, the three nations Alex underlined should be banned (I believe they are on my side of the war) imo thats clear botting, GOON/GPWC are both very new to the game and in that time frame made 17 billion over and above taxes and such, I am pretty sure GoG before the war would not have made 17 billion from taxes in 17 weeks. the fact is its broken and it has a massive effect on the game and should be removed or the cash removed. Ignoring the fact that your making false accusations. You realise the irony of you saying $17 billion is unbalancing the game when you've won more than $25b on Keno in one go, something which takes next to no time compared to spending hours each day grinding for cash in baseball. If GOONS/GPWC have their cash removed then your last few cities should be removed along with 5k land each since that was obviously broken and unbalancing using your logic you outlined above. I have my problems with NPO/GOONS, but those guys don't have the massive number of whales EMC does, Baseball is a part of their economic program to supplement their growth. Even though it'll help us undeniably by having baseball removed, I DO NOT support such an action when it disproportionally affects one part of the community for the benefit of another. Edited January 24, 2020 by Sphinx 3 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astryl Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 2 minutes ago, Sphinx said: I have my problems with NPO/GOONS, but those guys don't have the massive number of whales EMC does, Baseball is a part of their economic program to supplement their growth. Even though it'll help us undeniably by having baseball removed, I DO NOT support such an action when it disproportionally affects one part of the community for the benefit of another. Sphinx is the reasonable one here? Everyone close up shop, games over. 1 2 Quote Queen of Chaos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Sphinx said: Ignoring the fact that your making false accusations. You realise the irony of you saying $17 billion is unbalancing the game when you've won more than $25b on Keno in one go, something which takes next to no time compared to spending hours each day grinding for cash in baseball. I have my problems with NPO/GOONS, but those guys don't have the massive number of whales EMC does, Baseball is a part of their economic program to supplement their growth. Even though it'll help us undeniably by having baseball removed, I DO NOT support such an action when it disproportionally affects one part of the community for the benefit of another. When you was with BK you also claimed many times I was cheating, with no facts or reason behind it? would that not be making false accusations? yes I won 25 billion and shortly after Alex removed both Dice and Keno, maybe the same should be done for baseball. (Also you have no idea how long i played Keno how much i wasted in time waiting to collect taxes for what I lost, so do not make claims that you think Keno is one hit and win bs) Baseball should not be part of the economic program, it was never meant to have a massive effect on the game, and sure they do not have the number of whales, but they had tCW until they pushed you away, they do not have whales due to refusing to grow past 20 cities, so what's your point? Edited January 24, 2020 by Elijah Mikaelson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Just now, Jazz R Oppenheimer said: Sphinx is the reasonable one here? Everyone close up shop, games over. I mean this thread is so blantly biased against you guys, its honestly a joke Alex even took it seriously. I don't even like Baseball IRL or in game, but its something which is enjoyable for large segments of the game and has limited impact on the grand scheme of things, so it should remain. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asierith Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Just now, Sphinx said: I mean this thread is so blantly biased against you guys, its honestly a joke Alex even took it seriously. I don't even like Baseball IRL or in game, but its something which is enjoyable for large segments of the game and has limited impact on the grand scheme of things, so it should remain. Rebrand to Cricket when? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Just now, Asierith said: Rebrand to Cricket when? I might actually play it if Alex does that. Baseball's rules are just really weird to me, I have no idea WTF is even happening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 1 minute ago, Sphinx said: I mean this thread is so blantly biased against you guys, its honestly a joke Alex even took it seriously. I don't even like Baseball IRL or in game, but its something which is enjoyable for large segments of the game and has limited impact on the grand scheme of things, so it should remain. limited lol impact, you say its bias but its not at all when the three biggest money making nations and spammers of baseball are not even on there side Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Just now, Bjorn Ironside said: limited lol impact, you say its bias but its not at all when the three biggest money making nations and spammers of baseball are not even on there side Like I explained, with Who Me he has plenty of time to achieve those numbers, and to address Blighty. (I don't know anything about the 3rd guy) Quoting Filmore: GPWC/GOONS will pass those 2 very soon anyway, they have plenty of players who only just started compared to players who have had years to do it. Hell when I first started playing Dota 2, I got addicted to it. In the first year I played around 1,500 hours, or a bit under 4.5 hours a day. In addition to playing other games and doing my University work. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asierith Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Just now, Sphinx said: Hell when I first started playing Dota 2, I got addicted to it. In the first year I played around 1,500 hours, or a bit under 4.5 hours a day. In addition to playing other games and doing my University work. How much caffeine and sugar did this require? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 Just now, Asierith said: How much caffeine and sugar did this require? 1,500+ hours of Dota and 2nd year of Undergraduate? Mate my sugar/blood ratio was off the charts. (Not a big caffeine fan) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Sphinx said: Like I explained, with Who Me he has plenty of time to achieve those numbers, and to address Blighty. (I don't know anything about the 3rd guy) Quoting Filmore: GPWC/GOONS will pass those 2 very soon anyway, they have plenty of players who only just started compared to players who have had years to do it. Hell when I first started playing Dota 2, I got addicted to it. In the first year I played around 1,500 hours, or a bit under 4.5 hours a day. In addition to playing other games and doing my University work. the truth is i do not care how many games people play, how long they sit there spamming, the fact they have SPAWNED in billions from baseball make it game changing, I believe the very reason Alex removed both Keno and dice, that i am willing to be people spent far more on playing keno to what they won to baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dalmasca Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 9 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said: (Also you have no idea how long i played Keno how much i wasted in time waiting to collect taxes for what I lost, so do not make claims that you think Keno is one hit and win bs) Ironic how you tried to argue that the time you invested in Keno is proportional to how much you got out of it and the end being a fair result, all the while being upset over baseball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micchan Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, Sphinx said: I have my problems with NPO/GOONS, but those guys don't have the massive number of whales EMC does NPO has 70 nations at 20 cities, their GDP with low infra is way higher than TCW/Fark who are full of whales with high infra, they are not anymore in the GOONS situation with many low tiers, it is the biggest conventional alliance for both military and economy (once they rebuild) in the history of the game, and I don't even count the pigs who are there just to boost their economy /off topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Dalmasca said: Ironic how you tried to argue that the time you invested in Keno is proportional to how much you got out of it and the end being a fair result, all the while being upset over baseball Never said Keno was fair, it should have been removed way sooner than it was, it was game breaking, and guess what it was removed? I think baseball should be removed. and not upset, just think its broken and should be removed. or fixed, if people really enjoy playing baseball, then whats stopping them if Alex removed the money part of it, have like baseball money that can only be used on baseball? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HARPER.txt Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 11 minutes ago, Sphinx said: I don't even like Baseball IRL or in game / has limited impact on the grand scheme of things, so it should remain. 17 minutes ago, Jazz R Oppenheimer said: Sphinx is the reasonable one here? Everyone close up shop, games over. Sphinx is the scheme, Carry on nothing to see here, but yeh jfc you said something that wasn't pure bs painted gold for once very good job, very good job ? aside from the cricket bit, no just no. Quote -SAXON- -Warband Leader of the Nordic Sea Raiders- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dalmasca Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said: Never said Keno was fair, it should have been removed way sooner than it was, it was game breaking, and guess what it was removed? So you recognize that the game wasn't fair. Tell me, was your epiphany before or after you made $25 billion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor Ice Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) Regardless of what the original intention of baseball was, it appears to play a significant role in the strategy of the game today. There is a large community that plays baseball, it has spawned it's own little (read: large) economy, it generates site-traffic/ad revenue, and it generates activity. Baseball also acts as a fail-safe for blockades and bill-lock that could otherwise prevent a beaten opponent from recovery. Given the disparity in the amounts earned via baseball, it is clear that baseball currently is benefiting one side of this massive war significantly more than the other side. As such, this suggestion is likely motivated by political reasons rather than pure intentions about the original intent of baseball in P&W. This is supported by by OP's post history and the OP's continued reference to particular alliances in one coalition. I understand this motivation - it would be advantageous for baseball to be nerfed for a particular coalition. However, this war will not last forever. The disparity in the advantage afforded by baseball isn't likely due to inherent differences in activity or effort, but rather differences in economics and tier positioning. There may come a time, in a future war, where baseball permits another coalition to continue to fight despite large disadvantages. In the spirit of this suggestion box, I advocate that baseball remain as method to persist during difficult wars. Removing baseball has the potential to further reduce our player base by removing any options they have when completely annihilated on all other fronts. Edited January 25, 2020 by Emperor Ice typo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micchan Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said: Never said Keno was fair, it should have been removed way sooner than it was, it was game breaking, and guess what it was removed? I think baseball should be removed. and not upset, just think its broken and should be removed. or fixed, if people really enjoy playing baseball, then whats stopping them if Alex removed the money part of it, have like baseball money that can only be used on baseball? What about giving me some money you won at keno? That's my money 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Dalmasca said: So you recognize that the game wasn't fair. Tell me, was your epiphany before or after you made $25 billion? I had about 12b out in loans before winning 25b and then spent 17 billion on land for memes, then loaned out more cash, so i guess it did not change much. but yes i said way before i won 25 billion that it should have been removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Critters Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) Reduce the number of games allowed per day to 100. Give the people who actually play baseball as it was designed an equal footing with all the bot/script/large button/whatever mod, players. Edited January 25, 2020 by Critters 1 Quote The Redneck Caliphate of Forrest's Critters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galerion Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Alex said: Yes, that was a mistake - billions, not trillions. However, Blighty and Who Me have generated enourmous amounts of money playing baseball and very likely ran bots. Also birdsonwheels5, although they got less money out of it. See my above post. Just because me and "Who Me" have large amounts of pc time to throw at games like this is no reason to jump to the conclusion of bot use, as I have stated before the only aid I have in playing baseball is a mouse that has forward and back buttons. In order to play a lot of home games there has to be someone doing even more away game, there were 2 people in particular that did the majority of all away games for long time pre-nerf and one of which you have since banned for using bots. That said if a person is logged in with 2+ different web browsers it is easy enough to crank out away games at speed, as you can hit away in succession on all of them and they will all go through cutting down the waiting time for the pages to load. Edited January 25, 2020 by Galerion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Elijah Mikaelson Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, Emperor Ice said: Regardless of what the original intention of baseball was, it appears to play a significant role in the strategy of the game today. There is a large community that plays baseball, it has spawned it's own little (read: large) economy, it generates site-traffic/ad revenue, and it generates activity. Baseball also acts as a fail-safe for blockades and bill-lock that could otherwise prevent a beaten opponent from recovery. Given the disparity in the amounts earned via baseball, it is clear that baseball currently is benefiting one side of this massive war significantly more than the other side. As such, this suggestion is likely motivated by political reasons rather than pure intentions about the original intent of baseball in P&W. This is supported by by OP's post history and the OP's continued reference to particular alliances in one coalition. I understand this motivation - it would be advantageous for baseball to be nerfed for a particular coalition. However, this war will not last forever. The disparity in the advantage afforded by baseball isn't likely due to inherent differences in activity or effort, but rather differences in economics and tier positioning. There may come a time, in a future war, where baseball permits another coalition to continue to fight despite large disadvantages. In the spirit of this suggestion box, I advocate that baseball remain as method to persist during difficult wars. Removing baseball has the potential to further reduce our player base by removing any options they have when completely annihilated on all other fronts. First of all I do respect this post and yeah maybe you are right, BK/NPO openly admitted to wanting to force me out of the game so there could be some bias in my reasoning, but if someone i hated cheated and i reported them would I only be doing it due to me hating them or due to them cheating? My point is no matter what side of the fence you like to stand, this baseball game that was not meant to have any impact on the main game has a massive impact, I wonder how many of those clicks generate ad revenue/site-traffic that effects the profit of the site?, As i said let baseball remain but remove the cash that effects the main game and have baseball cash, if you all enjoy baseball that much then why not play it unless you admit and agree the cash made from baseball has a huge effect on the game and is the only reason people spam it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dalmasca Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said: My point is no matter what side of the fence you like to stand, this baseball game that was not meant to have any impact on the main game has a massive impact, I wonder how many of those clicks generate ad revenue/site-traffic that effects the profit of the site?, As i said let baseball remain but remove the cash that effects the main game and have baseball cash, if you all enjoy baseball that much then why not play it unless you admit and agree the cash made from baseball has a huge effect on the game and is the only reason people spam it? You seem to be in the minority of people who think baseball has a "massive impact". It also really does seem as if the issue only matters to you since you choose not to spend the time to replicate the results. The point of the matter is that although baseball can be used to generate mass amounts of cash, at the end of the day everyone is given the same capability. Whether they choose to partake in the tedious activity is of their own choice be it for career/life reasons or they have better things to do. Does it have a huge impact on the game, perhaps, but is it fair for all, yes. Does having an untouchable city 38 nation in your alliance have a massive impact on the game, ofcourse it does, but that doesnt mean its not fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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