For you islamophobes

[Rozalia]

You lied.

• It was memorised by all the companions of the Prophet (saw) during His life time.
• They recited the Quran from memory every single day during the life time of the Prophet (saw) and continued doing so afterwards.
• They wrote it down during the life time of the Prophet (saw).
• And they later compiled all the pages of the Quran, that were written down during the life time of the Prophet (saw), 20 years after his death and there was no disagreement whatsoever.

 

Didn't they all have different parts of it? How could they memorise the whole thing if they didn't have access to all it? I'm pretty sure from what I recall that the Quran was actually brought about because with the scriptures so spread about and open to interpretation there were many heretics rising up. 

[Abu Haddad]

Didn't they all have different parts of it? How could they memorise the whole thing if they didn't have access to all it? I'm pretty sure from what I recall that the Quran was actually brought about because with the scriptures so spread about and open to interpretation there were many heretics rising up. 

The quran existed only in page form. So they only had single pages not a complete book.

After the prophets death it was compiled into its current form.

Ever since revelation the quran hasn't changed once

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

Didn't they all have different parts of it? How could they memorise the whole thing if they didn't have access to all it? I'm pretty sure from what I recall that the Quran was actually brought about because with the scriptures so spread about and open to interpretation there were many heretics rising up. 

 

They did not need a fully written compilation of the Quran in order to memorise it because the Prophet (saw) would repeatedly recite the Quran to his companion until they memorised it and they would go on to continuously recite entire chapters by heart each day. Many of them memorised the Quran in it's entriety during the life time of the Prophet (saw).

 

A.T. Welch, a non-Muslim orientalist: “For Muslims the Quran is much more than scripture or sacred literature in the usual Western sense.  Its primary significance for the vast majority through the centuries has been in its oral form, the form in which it first appeared, as the “recitation†chanted by Muhammad to his followers over a period of about twenty years… The revelations were memorized by some of Muhammad’s followers during his lifetime, and the oral tradition that was thus established has had a continuous history ever since, in some ways independent of, and superior to, the written Quran… Through the centuries the oral tradition of the entire Quran has been maintained by the professional reciters (qurraa).  Until recently, the significance of the recited Quran has seldom been fully appreciated in the West.â€

 

The Quran is the only book, religious or secular, that has been memorized completely by millions of people.

 

Leading orientalist Kenneth Cragg :“…this phenomenon of Quranic recital means that the text has traversed the centuries in an unbroken living sequence of devotion.  It cannot, therefore, be handled as an antiquarian thing, nor as a historical document out of a distant past.  The fact of hifdh (Quranic memorization) has made the Quran a present possession through all the lapse of Muslim time and given it a human currency in every generation, never allowing its relegation to a bare authority for reference alone.â€

[Fox Fire]

They did not need a fully written compilation of the Quran in order to memorise it because the Prophet (saw) would repeatedly recite the Quran to his companion until they memorised it and they would go on to continuously recite entire chapters by heart each day. Many of them memorised the Quran in it's entriety during the life time of the Prophet (saw).

 

A.T. Welch, a non-Muslim orientalist: “For Muslims the Quran is much more than scripture or sacred literature in the usual Western sense.  Its primary significance for the vast majority through the centuries has been in its oral form, the form in which it first appeared, as the “recitation†chanted by Muhammad to his followers over a period of about twenty years… The revelations were memorized by some of Muhammad’s followers during his lifetime, and the oral tradition that was thus established has had a continuous history ever since, in some ways independent of, and superior to, the written Quran… Through the centuries the oral tradition of the entire Quran has been maintained by the professional reciters (qurraa).  Until recently, the significance of the recited Quran has seldom been fully appreciated in the West.â€

 

The Quran is the only book, religious or secular, that has been memorized completely by millions of people.

 

Leading orientalist Kenneth Cragg :“…this phenomenon of Quranic recital means that the text has traversed the centuries in an unbroken living sequence of devotion.  It cannot, therefore, be handled as an antiquarian thing, nor as a historical document out of a distant past.  The fact of hifdh (Quranic memorization) has made the Quran a present possession through all the lapse of Muslim time and given it a human currency in every generation, never allowing its relegation to a bare authority for reference alone.â€

ROFL. I can recite (my bible) the Tao Te Ching, which is hundreds of years older than your Quran. Does that make my religion special? 

Can I join your club now? I promise that my gayness is outweighed by my sheer enlightenment.

[Aerys Targaryen]

The article you shared was written by scientifically illiterate person. I checked a few links from that website, cannot find actual science there. I'm quoting one example below,

 

 

For example, the amount of oxygen in the air is perfect; if it is less, humans will not be able to breathe; if it is more, fires could start everywhere. Also the distance of the earth from the sun is perfect; if it is less, we will burn from the heat of the sun; if it is more, we will freeze. Potentially deadly radiation is kept at bay by the terrestrial atmosphere. Carbon dioxide and water vapor help warm the surface, but there is no runaway effect because both are perfectly recycled in various ways. On earth, complex life forms exist consisting of human, vegetable and animal life, from microscopic bacteria to huge elephants, and from minute viruses to giant trees. Although the earth possesses a dense core surrounded by an outer crust and an atmosphere, it has this unique difference - life. During the twentieth century, it has become clear that life exists on earth only because conditions are perfect. Moreover, the chemical and biochemical environments are in perfect balance, to ensure not only the existence of living things but also their continuity.

 

No one with proper understanding of basic science will write something like this. If we had more oxygen, it will oxidize atoms like C (to form CO2 or CO), N (to form N2O, NO2), Fe (to form Fe2O3, FeO) etc.., and the reaction will stop as the oxygen concentration will come back to normal. If we had high concentration of 'O' in our atmosphere, all life form would've been naturally selected to live in that condition. The main criteria for life are water and compounds based on carbon.

 

In the past, earth experienced run aways with CO2/H2O concentrations, they happen in cosmic time scales.

 

We have several theories to explain the complexities of life and they are quite successful and well established as well.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

And lets clear some things, thermodynamics is not totally applicable in quantum level. And all you were talking about is entropy, which is not the sole determining factor for an event to be favourable or not-favourable. Take simple events like 'crystallization' for example, atoms/ions/segments go from highly disordered to highly ordered structure, it happens. Holding on to 'just' second law of thermodynamics will not predict which is favourable and which is not, that is the reason we have Gibbs free energy and Helmoltz free energy. You should take a look at the whole thermodynamics, instead of extracting a tiny part and trying to reason with it. Or as Fox pointed out, you are probably copying it from some source, I suggest you check/understand what you are copying before using it for an argument.

 

Your understanding of the concept of 'infinity' is poor. What is ironic is that, you cited David Hilbert is your second reference. David Hilbert used various levels of infinities, there are some infinities that are bigger than other infinities. In your example, if you have infinite number of balls in an infinitely large container, and if you take 2 balls from that container, you will still have an infinitely large number of balls, but the infinity after removing the two balls will be less than the infinity before removing it. Probably you are copying it from somewhere, I really doubt whether the original author read any of the references cited there.

 

Also, the meaning of infinity is different in science, maths, theology.

 

In Science, any number bigger than a measurable quantity is called as an infinity. Much like (x/y), where y approaches zero.

In Maths, there are concepts of absolute infinities, infinities of various levels/sizes.

In Theology, infinity simply means 'un-ending', a feeling stone age human would feel looking at the sky.

 

Scientists have proven that after the big bang there was smoke.

 

No, no one proved anything like that. Big bang is not an explosion, it is just a rapid expansion of space, time, matter (and possibly other things present within it, like dark matter...).

 

Humans are made from DNA right.
but what is DNA made from.
in the quran it says that man is made from clay and water.
Scientists today have shown that you can make DNA using atomic clay and water

 

Clay is a silicate compound and it cannot give rise to DNA/RNA, please check your source before posting here.

 

What is an infinite regress of causes? (I'll give you an ice cream analogy.)

 

1) Say I want to purchase an ice cream and that I am at the head of a queue that stretches behind me for infinity.

 

2) Before I am allowed to purchase the Ice cream I have to ask the person behind me permission to do so.

 

3) Then the person behind me has to ask the person behind him/her for permission. 

 

4) And then that person has to ask the other person who is behind them to give me permission.

 

5) And this goes on for infinity.... will I ever be able to purchase my ice cream? The answer is simply no.

 

Similarly if the cause of the universe (God) was caused by something else, we have to ask what caused that other cause? And, what caused that other cause that caused that other cause, that caused that other cause which then caused our universe to come into existence? etc etc for infinity... and this is what's known as the "absurdity of the infinite regress of causes", if this was the case will our universe have ever been created? The answer again is no. So the cause of our universe must have always existed i.e it must not have had a cause.

 

It is nice you realize that your argument leads to infinite regression. If an argument leads to infinite regression, it means one of the two things,

1. Infinity is true,
2. Your assumption that there is a creator is wrong in the first place.

Now I'm not going to act smart and jump into conclusions like you just did about infinity, there are a lot of extremely talented mathematicians working on set theory (and other such techniques) to come to conclusions along with scientists working in the field of physics, chemistry.., What I can say for sure is, more people fear Science/Mathematics than people fear islam (islamophobic being fear of islam)

Edited October 26, 2015 by Aerys Targaryen

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

A lot to respond to, so I will just make a quick comment on this, and may offer a more detailed response later.

No, no one proved anything like that. Big bang is not an explosion, it is just a rapid expansion of space, time, matter (and possibly other things present within it, like dark matter...).

 

He is referring to this verse:

 

Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly." (Quran 41:11)

 

In the beginning the universe was nothing but a mass of smoke and only later did planets, stars and galaxies begin to form from it.

 

"The science of modern cosmology, observational and theoretical, clearly indicates that, at one point in time, the whole universe was nothing but a cloud of ‘smoke’ (i.e. an opaque highly dense and hot gaseous composition)." [source: The First Three Minutes, a Modern View of the Origin of the Universe, Weinberg, pp. 94-105.]

Edited October 26, 2015 by Ibrahim

[Fox Fire]

A lot to respond to, so I will just make a quick comment on this, and may offer a more detailed response later.

 

He is referring to this verse:

 

Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly." (Quran 41:11)

 

In the beginning the universe was nothing but a mass of smoke and only later did planets, stars and galaxies begin to form from it.

 

"The science of modern cosmology, observational and theoretical, clearly indicates that, at one point in time, the whole universe was nothing but a cloud of ‘smoke’ (i.e. an opaque highly dense and hot gaseous composition)." [source: The First Three Minutes, a Modern View of the Origin of the Universe, Weinberg, pp. 94-105.]

 

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

A more prolific shit-poster than Metro.

 

Let me know when you have something to say.

[Aerys Targaryen]

A lot to respond to, so I will just make a quick comment on this, and may offer a more detailed response later.

 

He is referring to this verse:

 

Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly." (Quran 41:11)

 

In the beginning the universe was nothing but a mass of smoke and only later did planets, stars and galaxies begin to form from it.

 

"The science of modern cosmology, observational and theoretical, clearly indicates that, at one point in time, the whole universe was nothing but a cloud of ‘smoke’ (i.e. an opaque highly dense and hot gaseous composition)." [source: The First Three Minutes, a Modern View of the Origin of the Universe, Weinberg, pp. 94-105.]

 

Ok, you are stepping into bubble now. Since you are quoting quran, lets play this game your way.

 

Quran (41:9)

 

قل ائنكم لتكÙرون بالذي خلق الارض ÙÙŠ يومين وتجعلون له اندادا ذلك رب العالمين

 

Say, "Do you indeed disbelieve in He who created the earth in two days and attributed to Him equals? That is the Lord of the worlds."

 

 

Quran (41:10)

 

وجعل Ùيها رواسي من Ùوقها وبارك Ùيها وقدر Ùيها اقواتها ÙÙŠ اربعة ايام سواء للسائلين

 

And He placed on the earth firmly set mountains over its surface , and He blessed it and determined therein its [creatures'] sustenance in four days without distinction - for [the information] of those who ask.

 

 

 

Quran (41:11)

 

ثم استوى الى السماء وهي دخان Ùقال لها وللارض ائتيا طوعا او كرها قالتا اتينا طائعين

 

Then He directed himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said "We have come willingly."

 

Quran (41:12)

 

Ùقضاهن سبع سماوات ÙÙŠ يومين واوحى ÙÙŠ كل سماء امرها وزينا السماء الدنيا بمصابيح وحÙظا ذلك تقدير العزيز العليم

 

And He completed them as seven heavens within two days and inspired in each heaven its command. And We adorned the nearest heaven with lamps and as protection. That is the determination of the Exalted in Might, the Knowing.

 

Ok, I just quoted a few suras before and after yours. Lets read them in context, shall we? It says earth is created in two days in (41:9). In (41:10), it says he is placing mountains and making sure everything is sustainable for the creatures, completed in the next 4 days. In (41:11), he then looks at the heaven, found smoke, said to smoke and to earth to come into form either willingly or through compulsion, they said they will come into the requested form willingly. After all these hard work, in (41:12) it says he completed them as 'seven heavens' and installed a set of commands for each of them. It is also stated that the nearest heaven as containing lamps (that is, sun and the moon),  means in quran it is believed that the sky is made up of seven partitions stacked horizontally.

 

Initially I was pretty sure that you were copying the 'science' part from other sources without understanding, now you are copying the 'quran' suras from other sources without even reading it.

[Fox Fire]

Let me know when you have something to say.

What is there to say? You know nothing about cosmology. In the beginning, there was nothing. No particles, no gases, no smoke. Then there was gravity. "Smoke" (gas) doesn't come about until countless other things begin to form, like the 4 universal forces in order for quarks to form particles, to form atoms, to form a basic gas.

You're not going to win an argument about cosmology with me. That was apparent from the moment you started.

[Abu Haddad]

http://www.speed-light.info/miracles_of_quran/

look through it before you say anything please.

I want any christian, jew or hindu to produce anything like it

[Fox Fire]

 

http://www.speed-light.info/miracles_of_quran/

look through it before you say anything please.

I want any christian, jew or hindu to produce anything like it

 

Actually, there are about a billion Christian sites exactly like that. Just like this one, they are a bunch of misinformed, baseless garbage of taking verses and attempting to relate them to existence. The problem with this is that it does not validate any religious book. Religious writings are designed to explain existence, often from the minds of ancient people. Of course you take a verse and loosly attach it to some aspect. How the !@#$ do you think things like this were written?

http://www.taoism.net/articles/mason/cosmo.htm

^For my religion. That must mean it's true, amirite?

[Abu Haddad]

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/cms/

Done.

this doesn't contain any scientific facts. Just a load of garbage

[Rozalia]

this doesn't contain any scientific facts. Just a load of garbage

 

[Robert Ap Ioan]

this doesn't contain any scientific facts. Just a load of garbage

 

 

http://www.speed-light.info/miracles_of_quran/

 

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/cms/

Done.

 

 

Snap

[Fox Fire]

this doesn't contain any scientific facts. Just a load of garbage

Same with your link.

[Abu Haddad]

that my friends was evidence and you still deny.

Which then, of the favours of your Lord will you twain deny? throughout chapter 55 in the Quran 

It was prophesied in the Quran that disbelievers would deny evidence like you all are right now.

Probably none of you looked through it

[Dimitri Valko]

this doesn't contain any scientific facts. Just a load of garbage

 

That's exactly what your article was, though.

[Abu Haddad]

i could tell it was some sort of conspiracy theory or something like that obvs

because you have no evidence to back christianity

BTW it took me twenty minutes to look through that.

But you all replied instantly

[Dimitri Valko]

because you have no evidence to back christianity

 

That's because Christianity obviously isn't real.

[Fox Fire]

i could tell it was some sort of conspiracy theory or something like that obvs

because you have no evidence to back christianity

BTW it took me twenty minutes to look through that.

But you all replied instantly

And you have no evidence to back Islam. How long are we going to keep repeating the same statements?

[Robert Ap Ioan]

That's because Christianity obviously isn't real.

It's certainly a conspiracy. Harms and I are one and the same, ditto anyone talking about the real Jesus......

Edited October 26, 2015 by Rob Ap Ioan

[Fox Fire]

Indeed, it's all a Zionist plot

#Sharia4America

[Robert Ap Ioan]

Ibrahim and Abu Haddad, also known as the Orbis version of Morcambe and Wise.

[Moreau]

I dont know who you are or what you want

But what have you done to Moreau?