New pollution-reducing improvements

[Andrezj Kolarov]

So there's only 3 recycling centers and 1 subway per city that can reduce pollution, I think there should be more for nations with bigger cities. I propose Landfills, which could offset 30 pollution each, and you could have 5 per city, they would be cheap to buy and maintain too.

[Guinevere]

So there's only 3 recycling centers and 1 subway per city that can reduce pollution, I think there should be more for nations with bigger cities. I propose Landfills, which could offset 30 pollution each, and you could have 5 per city, they would be cheap to buy and maintain too.

That or add upgrades to improvements that already exist. 

[Lilac Veritas]

Seems a bit pointless to me, as pollution translates directly into disease and we already have hospitals.

For example, my nation is on South Africa (Bauxite/Oil/Uranium). With max pollution reduction, but completely maxed resources there's only 49 excess pollution. This is 2.45% disease, or just enough to be eliminated by 1 hospital.

All my nation will ever need is 3 recycling centres, 1 subway, and 2 hospitals. 

[Guinevere]

Seems a bit pointless to me, as pollution translates directly into disease and we already have hospitals.

For example, my nation is on South Africa (Bauxite/Oil/Uranium). With max pollution reduction, but completely maxed resources there's only 49 excess pollution. This is 2.45% disease, or just enough to be eliminated by 1 hospital.

All my nation will ever need is 3 recycling centres, 1 subway, and 2 hospitals. 

It's not pointless because having 0 pollution in a city raises your income, as well as having 0% disease and crime rates.

[Thalmor]

Recycling Centers + Hospitals = No people dying

 

We don't really need anything else for pollution/disease

[Andrezj Kolarov]

Recycling Centers + Hospitals = No people dying

 

We don't really need anything else for pollution/disease

After your cities get big enough 5 hospitals won't be enough, especially when you consider how ridiculously expensive land becomes after 2000 - meaning most nations tank the disease rate from pop density onto hospitals too.

[Thalmor]

After your cities get big enough 5 hospitals won't be enough, especially when you consider how ridiculously expensive land becomes after 2000 - meaning most nations tank the disease rate from pop density onto hospitals too.

 

I just checked Ace, the most populated nation so far, and he doesn't seem to have that issue.

[Guinevere]

I just checked Ace, the most populated nation so far, and he doesn't seem to have that issue.

I just checked your first city and you clearly don't know how to build worth dick, being you have 2000 land when you should have at least 3000 at that infra level, not to mention random coal plant in addition to a nuclear power plant.

[Samdoo]

Lets visit the Calculating City Population of the knowledge and tutorial and lets see how we address disease

 

 ((( 0.01 * Base Population Density^2 ) -25 ) / 100 ) + (Base Population / 100000) - (Hospital Disease) + (Pollution Index * 0.05)

 

Wow. look at that land is how the formula addresses population density which matters to disease. The improvements that flat remove pollution are actually designed for smaller nations so they can have more pollution in their nation and not have it negatively effect the nation as majorly. 

 

Larger nations being forced to buy land to further decrease disease (which doesn't become an issue) is helpful in lowering the cost of food as nations have to build land, making farms more efficient and creates more nations making food at a higher rate. This allows smaller nations with less land to not have to waste improvement slots on food. 

 

Your premise for helping large nations is flawed and would hurt the game, This improvement isn't at all needed and would hurt the game. 

[Azaghul]

Pollution serving as a soft cap on how many raw resource / manufacturing improvements a huge city can have without having excess disease is a good thing.  And it's so high that it's almost impossible to hit with nation sizes right now.  If they do in the future... well that helps to create more of a market for big nations to buy resources from little nations.

[Lilac Veritas]

To reply to various people.

1. Having zero pollution is pointless if you already have 0 disease. Pollution IS just added to disease at a rate of 0.05% per 1 unit of pollution. 70 pollution (recycling centre) = 3.5% disease, 45 pollution (subway) = 2.25%, hopsital is 2.5% (or 50 pollution).

 

2. The premise that land becomes too expensive and 5 hospitals isn't enough is absolutely insane. ITS -12.5 DISEASE REDUCTION. As I established in my previous response, you can remove all disease from pollution that basically any nation will produce per city with max pollution reduction (255 or 12.75%) + 2 hospital (another 100 or 25%). This leaves us with 3 hopsitals, taking up just 3 more slots or 150 infra, or 15000 before city age (however city age is not used in base pop. density). This is -7.5% disease reduction. Taking the part of the formula that relates gets us..

 ((( 0.01 * Base Population Density^2 ) -25 ) / 100 ) + (Base Population / 100000) = Disease from population density

 

Now all my calculators weren't being consistent with this (Wolfram Alpha gave me 278.338 for some reason) so I determined it experimentally using a simulator.

Full details of the simulation:

North America, 4850 infra, 2500 land

Max resources, manufacturing, 2 police stations, 5 hospitals, 3 recycling centres, 1 subway, max commerce with ITC, max military, wind power x 20 (You've got nothing else to put the slots to), 6 free slots (useless)

Pop Density = 194.01, Disease = 0%, Population = 485,025 people

Pollution = 81, Disease from pollution = 4.05%

Revenue = 1.016 million per city (before military upkeep)

So the hospitals have 8.7% to use on reducing pop. density disease. At 4900 infra, you have 0.04% disease. It is essentially pointless to build past 4450 as you run out of improvements. The Infra costs are sky high at this point (4500 to 4600 is 13,269,767.69). You need a lot of cities to build anywhere near this high.

Population density is not a problem until around 5k infra, where it costs 15.6 million (with no reductions) to buy a mere 100 infra. Then you can buy 500 land for a small ~6.2 million and have no worries until 5.4k infra. 500 more land costs 8.9 million, which is no small amount but small compared to infra costs and the fact you are now making 1.145 million per city before resource sales and military upkeep. 3.5k land and you are safe until 5850 infra. 

 

You are in the extreme upper teir. Everyone has long since stopped playing politics and war. The seas have risen and humanity has all but fallen. Your cities cost over half a billion in total infrastructure and land costs. You have 6200 infra and 4000 land. As you see that the next 500 land costs $15,865,400.00 you cry out, why oh why didn't they introduce landfills and more disease reducing improvements. After all, you are running on wind power and still have 26 free slots.

Q.E.D.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Lilac Veritas

[Sketchy]

Pointless and not needed.

 

/thread

[Thalmor]

I just checked your first city and you clearly don't know how to build worth dick, being you have 2000 land when you should have at least 3000 at that infra level, not to mention random coal plant in addition to a nuclear power plant.

 

I dunno who you are to talk, considering you don't even have a nation.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Thalmor

[Andrezj Kolarov]

Pointless and not needed.

 

/thread

It will be needed once the top-tier nations start going over 5000 infra a city and have no new ways to reduce disease (beyond land which becomes way too expensive).

 

Also your avatar is offensive, go back to middle-school please.

[Sketchy]

Lilac posted a very informative list of reasons why your wrong.

 

And if your offended by my profile picture, maybe your the one who should "go back to middle school". You are clearly too sensitive to be living in the adult world.

 

People who cannot accept they are wrong are bad enough, pretending to be a victim to further your argument? Cmon man.

[Baumgilad]

If some people want to have a new way to reduce pollution (whether or not it's really necessary), I can't see why it shouldn't be introduced into the game.  People enjoy building and customizing cities their own way.

[Peacity Peace]

Lilac posted a very informative list of reasons why your wrong.

 

And if your offended by my profile picture, maybe your the one who should "go back to middle school". You are clearly too sensitive to be living in the adult world.

 

People who cannot accept they are wrong are bad enough, pretending to be a victim to further your argument? Cmon man.

 

As someone who believes butts that look good are offensive, i'm offended. If you do not remove it, i will be forced to tell my mother. Then we will see who's mature, dumb poo poo butt.

[Peacity Peace]

If some people want to have a new way to reduce pollution (whether or not it's really necessary), I can't see why it shouldn't be introduced into the game.  People enjoy building and customizing cities their own way.

 

As someone who doesn't know much, i know this. Any game that has a trading based economy needs to really evaluate ideas before they implement it. Because helping 100 people could screw over 10000.

[Sketchy]

As someone who believes butts that look good are offensive, i'm offended. If you do not remove it, i will be forced to tell my mother. Then we will see who's mature, dumb poo poo butt.

 

Idk wut your talking about mang, I traveled back in time and took a photo of your moms butt for my picture. Ask to see her ass if you don't believe me, she'll still have Yolo & Swag tattooed on her cheeks.

[Peacity Peace]

Idk wut your talking about mang, I traveled back in time and took a photo of your moms butt for my picture. Ask to see her ass if you don't believe me, she'll still have Yolo & Swag tattooed on her cheeks.

 

That awesome moment when my mom YOLO SWAG'd before YOLO SWAG was a thing. 

[Sketchy]

That awesome moment when my mom YOLO SWAG'd before YOLO SWAG was a thing. 

She's a dank lady m9. 

[Peacity Peace]

She's a dank lady m9.