WWII Sh@tposting

[Jefferson Davis III]

Huh, and here I thought the World Wars were won by the larger side, not the ones with a better K/D ratio

Actually it wasn't won by the side with more troops, In the pacific in WW2, the Japanese a 20 million man army and a big navy. And the germans had a 15 million man army plus navy and air force. The US beat the japanese because they were able to produce not just weapons, but very high quality weapons that were built to last and take a beating, and germany began losing the war because they lost so many men and tanks in russia during the winters of 41 and 42 because everything froze, but the russians were equipted for those temperatures, and their equipment worked. plus the russians also developed the T-34 which was mechanically superior to the german tanks and had sloped armor, making it lighter, faster, and stronger. but in late 1940, the russian were the ones losing because tho they had 20 million troops and a million tanks, their taanks were left overs from WW1 and they ddn't even have enough rifles for all their troops, what they would do is send in troops with guns into a battle, and when the battle was over and the wounded retrieve, they would send thousands of men onto the battlefield to pick up bullets, shells, and guns, whether they were russian or german weapons, plus the russians were very poorly trained, they were just farmers with uniforms, while the germans were the first to provide real military training. Up until 1933, military training consisted of learning how to march, learning how to solute, and how to carry your equipment, many men didn't even know how to use the rifles they were issued, they had to learn by watching those who did know. but the americans had also begun training their troops better, and when america entered the war, tides began to turn. by 1943, the americans superior weapons and tactics pushed the germans back. here are the numbers of the entire war. Axis casualties, total 12 million, allied casualties, 61 million, most were earlier in the war from 1939-1942 by 1943, allies had to find better ways of fighting, there is only one example from the western front where the battle was won by numbers, and that was D-day. every battle afterwards was based on tactics, training, and equipment.

[Ayayay]

-snip-

Man, are you for real? The Soviets had about 5 million soldiers to the Germans 3.3 million in '41 on the Eastern Front. By 1944 it was 6.8 million to 3.1 million. The Soviets also are responsible for destroying about 3/4ths of the Germans military. The Western Front was even worse for the Germans by '45  The Allied armies were over 5 million men strong compared to the Germans 1.5 million during the year-long campaign.

 

In the Pacific you seem to have forgotten about the Chinese factions and, believe it or not, China did have soldiers. But, let's ignore China completely because we can. By 1943 the United States navy was larger than the Japanese. In fact, after the crushing defeat at Midway, the US slowed down carrier construction as they had eliminated Japans ability to expand their influence in the Pacific. Then, we dropped two atomic bombs and the Soviets declared war on them. FIN 

 

 

there is only one example from the western front where the battle was won by numbers, and that was D-day. every battle afterwards was based on tactics, training, and equipment.

Battle of the Bulge 

Operation Dragoon

Battle for Brest

Colmar Pocket

Battle of Overloon

Battle of Aachen

Liberation of Paris

etc.

Edited December 7, 2014 by underlordgc

[Jefferson Davis III]

Man, are you for real? The Soviets had about 5 million soldiers to the Germans 3.3 million in '41 on the Eastern Front. By 1944 it was 6.8 million to 3.1 million. The Soviets also are responsible for destroying about 3/4ths of the Germans military. The Western Front was even worse for the Germans by '45  The Allied armies were over 5 million men strong compared to the Germans 1.5 million during the year-long campaign.

 

In the Pacific you seem to have forgotten about the Chinese factions and, believe it or not, China did have soldiers. But, let's ignore China completely because we can. By 1943 the United States navy was larger than the Japanese. In fact, after the crushing defeat at Midway, the US slowed down carrier construction as they had eliminated Japans ability to expand their influence in the Pacific. Then, we dropped two atomic bombs and the Soviets declared war on them. FIN 

 

 

Battle of the Bulge 

Operation Dragoon

Battle for Brest

Colmar Pocket

Battle of Overloon

Battle of Aachen

Liberation of Paris

etc.

Actually, battle of the bulge, there were very few allied forces in that area, must were south in italy, back in britain, in Belgum, or secureing france, thats why the germans attacked there, and the germans had way more men at the time of the battle's beginning, it wasn't untl patten and bradly were able to reinforce the bulge that the germans began to lose. And yeah the russians had a big army, but most of it was spread out throut the nation, and they declared war on japan in 43, not 45. and germany had 7 million casualties, and your saying that they only had a 6 million man army, they were taking children as young as 12 and men as old as 75, nearly 60% of all german men fought in the war or played a supportive role. Only 10 million americans served at any one time, germany had a good chance of winning, had the germans not tried to take stalin grad and actually taken moscow, the russia would have never fought and then all german forces could have been concentrated towards the west, russia didn't start winning until april of 42, it took the german army only 3 months to reach moscow, and only by luck and severe whether did they pull through, and the chinese, they lost 20 million people to the japanese, they were crushed, they almost surrendered had not america entered the war, because chinese soldiers were still armed with muskets and world war 1 era bombs, they didn't even have an air force, the flying tigers had to do that which was an american force. The japanese had the greatest fight planes until the production of the f-4 corsair and the mustang, the japanese had the biggest battleship ever built, the yamato, and they had 3 of them, they are still the largest battleships to have ever been built to this day. We got lucky, because at midway, if the japanese had decided to attack the carriers instead of the island, then they could have won, instead, they kept switching back and forth because they kept getting mixed intel reports, if they had just picked one target and stuck to it, they would have one, plus we lost the uss yorktown in that battle as well. and the liberation of paris was easy because the germans pulled out entirely because they did not want to damage the beutiful building and history, the germans left the city and took up positions miles away from it, it is the only city that was given without a fight. paris took little damage from the war.

[Ayayay]

What? Let me break things down for you

 

the germans had way more men at the time of the battle's beginning, it wasn't untl patten and bradly were able to reinforce the bulge that the germans began to lose

1. That's exactly what I'm saying
 
2. The Soviet-Japanese War of 1945 began on August 9, 1945
3. When did I say the Germans had only a 6 million man army?

they were taking children as young as 12 and men as old as 75, nearly 60% of all german men fought in the war or played a supportive role

4.  Because they other ones died
 

and the chinese, they lost 20 million people to the japanese, they were crushed, they almost surrendered had not america entered the war

5. Japans advance into China stalled in 1938
 

Only 10 million americans served at any one time

6. Again, navy
 

germany had a good chance of winning, had the germans not tried to take stalin grad and actually taken moscow, the russia would have never fought and then all german forces could have been concentrated towards the west

7. But they didn't
 

it took the german army only 3 months to reach moscow

by luck and severe whether did they pull through

8. Except they didn't, they died outside the gates
9. General Winter had fought in many wars before

japanese had the biggest battleship ever built, the yamato, and they had 3 of them, they are still the largest battleships to have ever been built to this day

10. Battleships became obsolete during that war. Carriers are far more efficient at power projection. The US navy proved it.
 

if the japanese had decided to attack the carriers instead of the island, then they could have won

we lost the uss yorktown in that battle as well

11. But they didn't
 12. The USA built 65 Carriers in '43 alone. The loss is meaningless.

 

 liberation of paris was easy because the germans pulled out entirely because they did not want to damage the beutiful building and history, the germans left the city and took up positions miles away from it, it is the only city that was given without a fight.

 

paris took little damage from the war

13. lolwut?
14. It may not have taken as much damage as other major cities, but it certainly took quite a bit 

 

 chinese soldiers were still armed with muskets

15. 

Edited December 8, 2014 by underlordgc

[Jefferson Davis III]

Ok, first off, we are getting way off the original topic. But I will continue this very good conversation. The numbers are yours and I am responding.

3. You stated that the germans had 1.5 million troops on the western front and 3 million on the eastern front.

4. yes they reached towards the end of the war, but 14 year olds could get a supportive role in the army as early as 42' mainly as couriers.

5. Yes the japanese advance stalled in 38' but they had invaded china in 1929!!! japan had been plowing through them for 9 years.

6. actually no, the ten million was total. the navy encompased 5 million. the marines had 1 million. the regular army had 3 million, and the army air corp, medical corp, and maintenance corp, included another 1 million. ( give or take a few thousand.

7. true, but the german defeat in the east was not the fault of their military, it was bad tactics of hitler. their military was suppurb.

8. this one is my bad, I meant to say that the russians barely pulled through. i didn't mean that the germans actually pulled through, this one is my bad.

10. Aircraft carriers were proved to be very useful, but their full potential wasn't realized until the very end of the war, and battleships were still useful, thats why the U.S. didn't retire its last battleship until 1992, 47 years after the war that made them obsolite. The provide huge artillery capabilities, and the yamato also carried 7 aircraft because it was so big, it could launch 7 fighters right away. also, it had 150 anti-aircraft guns, making it a death trap for aircraft when in a good formation. very few planes could make it through the gauntlet.

15. The chinese in 1929-1945 were extremely poor, communism had just come to power there, and they were trying to become stable, they didn't have the money to pay for modern weapons for their army like they do today.

 

and lastly, do not reply to this on this post. If you want to continue this, please message me, otherwise we might both be flagged.

[Ayayay]

3. I said on a specific front for a specific year
4. Yes, because they didn't have the population to support it otherwise
5. The Second Sino-Japanese war started in '37, which, when discussing China and WW2, is what people refer to.
6. Maybe I should have been more specific, "Again, navy [ships]," better?
7. Yes, blame it all on Hitler
10. So the reason why the USA built far more carriers than battleships was because they knew in a few years that they would realize that carriers are better than battleships?
10b. Wow, a whole 7 fighters? I bet they had the United States Navy running scared!
15. Do you know what the words "Citation needed" mean?

 

and lastly, do not reply to this on this post. If you want to continue this, please message me, otherwise we might both be flagged.

Awww, how precious. Thinking you can tell me what to do 

Edited December 9, 2014 by underlordgc

[Jefferson Davis III]

ok lets keep it rolling.

3. can agree on.

4. They did have 35 million people in germany alone, plus all the countries they conquered. (Austria, Hungary, Norway, Sweden, Check Republic, Romania, Greece, Belgium, Lithuania, Half of Poland at first then all of poland, Slovakia, Egypt, and don't forget the Italians who were unofficially annexed in 42, giving all of those troops to germany.

5. To which specific war people refer to is practically irrelevant, since the fighting was continuous.

5b. I also forgot to mention all the other countries Japan conquered, including (Manchuria, Mongolia, Vietnam, Nepal, Malaysia, Thailand, Taiwan, Laos, Cambodia, Burma, the Philippines, New Guinea, and of course large portions of china.

6. Yes, that is better.

7. well it was his idea to change that amry's objective from taking the ukraine oil fields to attacking stalingrad. if he hadn't, well the war might have gone differently.

10. No, you see, those numbers about carriers isn't quite accurate. Those numbers include ships that were converted into carriers, such as merchant vessels, as well it includes something called escort carriers these were vessels designed to carry men and troops, something we still have today used by the marines. Back in WW2, a normal carrier would carry between 50 and 120 planes, depending on what kinds they had on board, they also ha about 750 marines on board to act as security and to be launched to assault a beach or other vessels. but an escort carrier did something different. they were much much smaller and cheaper. An escort carrier still carried about 750 marines, but they only carried about 15 planes, usually scout planes, so that the scout planes didn't waste space on the big carriers. these escorts were used for small missions and were used to provide air support on islands so that big carriers didn't have to stay tied to an island or island chain. the reason more carriers were built than battleships is because a battleship is always big and loaded with material. And these small carriers didn't have to be armored. A battleship would take around 2 years to construct back then, which made no since considering that all but 2 of the battleships at pearl harbor had been refloated and put back in service in just 9 months. of the eight sunk, six were refloated, and 2 more were never sunk, only damaged. On the other hand, a normal carrier would take 8 months to build because the deck was made from would, making it faster to build. and the hull was very thin, making it less expensive. it only took 1-3 months to convert a large cargo ship into a carrier, and it only 9 weeks to build an escort carrier. and if you want to compair production, then why is it that we don't use liberty ships anymore. Production began in 1942, the liberty ship which was a cargo vessel had a 6 inch gun on the stern, a 5 inch gun on the bow, and 8 machine and flak guns spread over this 200 foot ship, in other words, a floating coffin for its sailors because it's defenses were nothing for how large they were. It only took three days to turn a pile of scrap metal into a brand new liberty ship. over 1,700 were built through out the war. and that is just liberty ships, there were many classes of ships. The USA built 9,000 ships during the war, over 100,000 aircraft, over 15,000,000 rifles and SMGs, over 8 million pistols, 2 million machine guns. 200,000 tanks. 250,000 artillery and anti-tank guns. 1,500,000 jeeps. 750,000 trucks. 150,000 military motorcycles. over 3 billion cartridges, 20 million helmets. over two million artillery shells, and around 15,000 half tracks. this goes on and on. And most of the tech is obsolete, including the scout planes, torpedo bombers, battleships, single action rifles, bolt action rifles (with the exception of snipers), backpack radios, medium bombers (such as the B-24, B-25, and B-26), rear gunner designs on fighters and on bombers, all prop planes ( today, only two of the three kinds of panes are used, jets and turbo props, even the C-130 that has propellers, it is a turbo prop which is just a big prop engine with a small jet engine underneath it), etc, etc. after 70 years, outdated tech is nothing to be shocked about. But in the 1940s, Battleships were still big dogs. When a battleship is in its formation, it is a floating fortress. The Yamato had an escort fleet of about 30 ships. one small carrier for about 30 planes, about 10 cargo vessels and troop carriers (all of which were armed to the teeth with anti-aircraft guns. about 5 heavy cruisers, 10-15 small destroyers. not to mention the several japanese subs that often went with the fleet, this provided 360 degree protection and gave untold amounts power, the yamato could lob 21 inch shells over 50 miles, these shells were bigger than a person, (an average person, not an average american today). one hit with these things and your ship was done for. and its hull armor was in someplace 4 feet thick solid steel. the only way to sink it was to hit it with an even bigger shell, which didn't exist, or to drop several 500 and 1,000 pound bombs on the deck and super structure. When the yamato was finally sunk, it was charging towards hawaii without its support fleet in a last ditch effort by japanese command to deal a major blow. but the sip was discovered. US carriers sent 200 planes at it, normally this wouldn't even do it, but because it had no support fleet, it's AA ability was reduced, and it only had so many guns ( 160 AA guns actually). And also, the USS Utah was the last us battleship to be decomishoned, it was placed in mothball fleet off the coast of new york to be reinstated incase of a war with a major super power. It was decomishoned just 2 months ago.

[Jefferson Davis III]

It is now going t be put on display as a museum, never to see any action again.

and finally

15. I know what citation means, its just i don't know what you are saying I need it for?

[Fox Fire]

Peak Strength of Armed Forces During WWII

 

U.S.S.R.

12,500,000

United States

12,364,000

Germany

10,000,000

Japan

6,095,000

France

5,000,000

China (Nationalist)

3,800,000

China (Communist)

1,200,000

Britain

4,683,000

Italy

4,500,000

India

2,150,000

Poland

1,000,000

Spain

850,000

Turkey

850,000

Belgium

800,000

Canada

780,000

Australia

680,000

Switzerland

650,000

Rumania

600,000

Philippines

500,000

Yugoslavia

500,000

Netherlands

500,000

Sweden

500,000

Bulgaria

450,000

Hungary

350,000

Finland

250,000

Brazil

200,000

Czechoslovakia

180,000

New Zealand

157,000

Greece

150,000

South Africa

140,000

Thailand

126,500

Iran

120,000

Portugal

110,000

Argentina

100,000

 

http://www.nationalww2museum.org/learn/education/for-students/ww2-history/ww2-by-the-numbers/world-wide-military.html

Edited December 9, 2014 by Fox Fire

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

Huh that's pretty acurate

[Mikhail Gorbachev]

Peak Strength of Armed Forces During WWII

 

China (Nationalist)

3,800,000

China (Communist)

1,200,000

How did the Communists come out on top?

[Fox Fire]

How did the Communists come out on top?

How did Germany take over the entire continent of Europe?

[Ayayay]

4. Yes, because if there is one thing people remember the Third Reich for, it's their army of non-Germans.

4b. Egypt and Sweden were annexed by Germany?

 

5. I have no clue where you got that idea from (or the rest of what you posted tbh) Japan fought China for Manchuria for a few months in 1931-1932. The next war would not start for several more years.

 

6. No Jap soldier set foot in Nepal nor Mongolia

6b. Taiwan, New Guinea, and Manchuria weren't countries. Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, and Burma were colonies but I'll pretend they count.

6c. Japan didn't "conquer" Siam[Thailand], they joined the war on the Axis side after Japan invaded them and signed a cease-fire.

 

7. Okay, let me spell this out for you, I don't care. If we want to play the "What if" game I still think Germany would have lost either way.

 

10. I can't bring myself to read most of that, just a giant wall of text and the formatting makes it nigh impossible. I did read the first few lines and, if you bothered to click the source in my reply earlier, you would have seen that the USA still built far more "regular" carriers than battleships.

 

15. Give me !@#$ing proof. English mother!@#$, do you understand it?

Edited December 10, 2014 by underlordgc

[Pwnius Scrubius]

How did the Communists come out on top?

Nationalists were running out of food. They were selling weapons for food to the commies, as far as I know. Also, the communists were tough guys who lived in the mountains.

One time they had to be attacked several times because of their terrain advantage. And I am gonna assume that the commies had Soviet support.

[Franz Von Dietrich]

Nationalists were running out of food. They were selling weapons for food to the commies, as far as I know. Also, the communists were tough guys who lived in the mountains.

One time they had to be attacked several times because of their terrain advantage. And I am gonna assume that the commies had Soviet support.

If I recall; the Soviet's are "Commies" or also known as Communist.

[elsuper]

Nationalists were running out of food. They were selling weapons for food to the commies, as far as I know. Also, the communists were tough guys who lived in the mountains.

One time they had to be attacked several times because of their terrain advantage. And I am gonna assume that the commies had Soviet support.

 

It should also be noted that Fox Fire's numbers are peak strength at any point during the war. They had a truce while fighting the Japanese, and then resumed after WWII until 1950, plenty of time for those numbers to shift.

[Fox Fire]

Actually it wasn't won by the side with more troops, In the pacific in WW2, the Japanese a 20 million man army and a big navy. And the germans had a 15 million man army plus navy and air force. The US beat the japanese because they were able to produce not just weapons, but very high quality weapons that were built to last and take a beating, and germany began losing the war because they lost so many men and tanks in russia during the winters of 41 and 42 because everything froze, but the russians were equipted for those temperatures, and their equipment worked. plus the russians also developed the T-34 which was mechanically superior to the german tanks and had sloped armor, making it lighter, faster, and stronger. but in late 1940, the russian were the ones losing because tho they had 20 million troops and a million tanks, their taanks were left overs from WW1 and they ddn't even have enough rifles for all their troops, what they would do is send in troops with guns into a battle, and when the battle was over and the wounded retrieve, they would send thousands of men onto the battlefield to pick up bullets, shells, and guns, whether they were russian or german weapons, plus the russians were very poorly trained, they were just farmers with uniforms, while the germans were the first to provide real military training. Up until 1933, military training consisted of learning how to march, learning how to solute, and how to carry your equipment, many men didn't even know how to use the rifles they were issued, they had to learn by watching those who did know. but the americans had also begun training their troops better, and when america entered the war, tides began to turn. by 1943, the americans superior weapons and tactics pushed the germans back. here are the numbers of the entire war. Axis casualties, total 12 million, allied casualties, 61 million, most were earlier in the war from 1939-1942 by 1943, allies had to find better ways of fighting, there is only one example from the western front where the battle was won by numbers, and that was D-day. every battle afterwards was based on tactics, training, and equipment.

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention. You titled this thread perfectly.

Overall, Germany lost because they attacked Russia, which could have been a potential ally. Japan lost because they just had to have Hawaii while they still couldn't even get past Australia.

The Axis lost because they literally attempted to take on the entire planet at once.

Edited December 10, 2014 by Fox Fire

[Kim Jong-Il]

Being the owner of an account with the profile pic of Hitler and being jewish...

 

The Holocaust was totally never a thing, srsly

[Fox Fire]

Being the owner of an account with the profile pic of Hitler and being jewish...

 

The Holocaust was totally never a thing, srsly

I'm assuming that is sarcasm...

[Ayayay]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention. You titled this thread perfectly.

He didn't title this, Fizban the wizard did when he split the topics.

[Fox Fire]

He didn't title this, Fizban the wizard did when he split the topics.

Oh. Well good job on that one Fizban. I mean really, exquisite.

[Jefferson Davis III]

if you had bothered to read that text, which is doable to people with more than a third grade education and crap for history research skills. You would have noted that it took less than a year to build an aircraft carrier, and it took less material. THATS WHY THEY BUILT MORE YOU NIMROD!! THEY COST LESS AND WERE FASTER TO BUILD! DONT INSULT ME! I DONT TAKE THAT LIGHTLY!

[Ayayay]

if you had bothered to read that text, which is doable to people with more than a third grade education and crap for history research skills. 

You weren't taught to read until third grade? I guess they also never bothered to teach you formatting nor basic grammar rules.

[Fox Fire]

You would have noted that it took less than a year to build an aircraft carrier

Citation needed.

[Casey]