Rivers of Blood

[Sabcat]

A strike was done in support of him, but you're really trying to argue I said something which I didn't. What I said was that the anger against Multiculturalism/Mass Immigration/Political Correctness is increasing, something which aligns with the principles in the speech. Enoch's speech is from the 60s, I'd expect many to not be aware of it, however aware of it or no there a lot of people out there in agreement with it's principles. 

 

You're smart enough to see a very simple point so why do this? To begin with you're mixing the ethnic/cultural stuff with the tolerating stuff, I'll be nice and assume thats an honest mistake. So I was talking simply the tolerating aspect, so native or not is irrelevant. Now I asked you to imagine such a cult existed that had such mad views, do we tolerate it until they start gassing people or crack down on it early? As in refuse to tolerate that which is intolerable? Yes or no will do. 

 

You'd be a lot less angry with me if you weren't arguing against an invented version of me. As I said previously, the principles that a lack of integration would cause trouble, that mass immigration would inflame the matter further, and all this while shielded by political correctness was something I derived from his speech. I believe those basic principles in it to have been proven correct, we can see it easily enough today nearly 50 years on. Now if you believe that such things are incorrect then we can have a discussion. Saying I must secretly be a racist and am just framing things dishonestly ain't going to get you anywhere. So argue against those principles I said were proven correct if you're going to continue please.

 

I'm not arguing against an invented version of you. I'm arguing against what you post. Such as you have an argument, so far you don't, just a procession of assertions.

 

This cult still lacks any kind of relevancy to the matter at hand - it's tolerance of behaviour. You might just as well ask should we tolerate rapists and try to claim that's analogous to tolerating immigration. It's absolute drivel.

 

Back to the matter in hand though. Give us an argument, demonstrate this increasing anger at multiculturalism/political correctness/immigration.

Edited March 31, 2016 by Sabcat

[Rozalia]

I'm not arguing against an invented version of you. I'm arguing against what you post. Such as you have an argument, so far you don't, just a procession of assertions.

 

This cult still lacks any kind of relevancy to the matter at hand - it's tolerance of behaviour. You might just as well ask should we tolerate rapists and try to claim that's analogous to tolerating immigration. It's absolute drivel.

 

Back to the matter in hand though. Give us an argument, demonstrate this increasing anger at multiculturalism/political correctness/immigration.

 

Bloody hell, simple yet cannot be understood it seems. The point is exactly what you dismiss, there are things we do not tolerate, that does not make us wrong. If something is ultimately a negative then we are justified in not tolerating it. Now considering how these things usually go, said cult in the example I'd assume you'd defend on freedom of religion grounds until they inevitably gas somebody. 

 

I have to provide you evidence of anger against immigration? Yeah no, I don't even to provide the easily found by yourself. Immigration is one of those issues that there is a lot of anger towards, not always flaring up by any means but it often comes up. Asking me to provide you evidence of this is ridiculous. 

[Sabcat]

Bloody hell, simple yet cannot be understood it seems. The point is exactly what you dismiss, there are things we do not tolerate, that does not make us wrong. If something is ultimately a negative then we are justified in not tolerating it. Now considering how these things usually go, said cult in the example I'd assume you'd defend on freedom of religion grounds until they inevitably gas somebody. 

 

I have to provide you evidence of anger against immigration? Yeah no, I don't even to provide the easily found by yourself. Immigration is one of those issues that there is a lot of anger towards, not always flaring up by any means but it often comes up. Asking me to provide you evidence of this is ridiculous. 

 

Bloody hell, simple yet cannot be understood it seems. The point is exactly what you dismiss, there are things we do not tolerate, that does not make us wrong. If something is ultimately a negative then we are justified in not tolerating it. Now considering how these things usually go, said cult in the example I'd assume you'd defend on freedom of religion grounds until they inevitably gas somebody. 

 

I have to provide you evidence of anger against immigration? Yeah no, I don't even to provide the easily found by yourself. Immigration is one of those issues that there is a lot of anger towards, not always flaring up by any means but it often comes up. Asking me to provide you evidence of this is ridiculous. 

 

This thread, your entire offering boils down to you don't like immigration, you want a homogeneous culture, and you don't like political correctness. 

 

Your inability to let go of your ludicrous cult analogy is telling, but hey, I can't help you with that but for the benefit of anyone else - it's irrelevant because you're conflating tolerance of other cultures/ethnicities/races with tolerance for a set of behaviour. Because of your prejudices you have decided that these are negative which is why you chose your faulty analogy.

 

You're not even close to being clever about it. 3/10, mainly for effort because you have typed a lot of words.

[Rozalia]

This thread, your entire offering boils down to you don't like immigration, you want a homogeneous culture, and you don't like political correctness. 

 

Your inability to let go of your ludicrous cult analogy is telling, but hey, I can't help you with that but for the benefit of anyone else - it's irrelevant because you're conflating tolerance of other cultures/ethnicities/races with tolerance for a set of behaviour. Because of your prejudices you have decided that these are negative which is why you chose your faulty analogy.

 

You're not even close to being clever about it. 3/10, mainly for effort because you have typed a lot of words.

 

Incorrect. I've argued such things in other threads perhaps but this one was not created for that purpose, though if you pick a fight with me on the matter than naturally I will tell you I support it. What I like is quite irrelevant to the thread at hand though I make no secret of it. If you want to debate there is no anger against the 3 listed things then go ahead, otherwise I'll take it you're just trying to be combative for the sake of it as disproving those 3 should be your goal yet you ignore it.

 

Oh boy. Alright, lets take ghettos for example. Horrible things, nasty, just sad. There are no good things to say about them, all those immigrants moving in and taking over large parts/entire town. Yeah you can point to some positive examples perhaps but over in Europe it's strictly a negative thing, and besides it hurts integration. Anyway, knowing this is a negative and not something to tolerate it is not wrong to oppose gtettos and support immigrants to be more spread out across a nation. It is not wrong to refuse to tolerate the intolerable, that was what I threw out and you have yet to challenge that in any way. What you're calling me doesn't even work. I don't want to deport all immigrants, merely shut the valve and integrate those here already. What a monster. 

 

If you're going to troll me then do it right, 4/10 is the number you're looking for and if you don't know why then well it's best you educate yourself on the fine arts. 

[Sabcat]

You've yet to argue anything at all.

[Rozalia]

You've yet to argue anything at all.

 

As I said, don't waste my time if you're just going to play these games. I've explained my side of things and even did as you requested when you deemed such a simple example too ridiculous. To then go to the statement of, "you've not said anything really" is poor showing. If you want to ignore my posts you don't need to post saying you're ignoring them, thanks. 

[fistofdoom]

As I said, don't waste my time if you're just going to play these games. I've explained my side of things and even did as you requested when you deemed such a simple example too ridiculous. To then go to the statement of, "you've not said anything really" is poor showing. If you want to ignore my posts you don't need to post saying you're ignoring them, thanks. 

Games? I like games.

[Sabcat]

As I said, don't waste my time if you're just going to play these games. I've explained my side of things and even did as you requested when you deemed such a simple example too ridiculous. To then go to the statement of, "you've not said anything really" is poor showing. If you want to ignore my posts you don't need to post saying you're ignoring them, thanks. 

 

No, you haven't. You've asserted a number of things, drawn some (odd) comparisons but so far you've not actually advanced an actual argument. When challenged to do so you posted "Yeah no, I don't even to provide the easily found by yourself".

 

I'm not ignoring you, you're hilarious, it's fun. Please post more.

[Rozalia]

No, you haven't. You've asserted a number of things, drawn some (odd) comparisons but so far you've not actually advanced an actual argument. When challenged to do so you posted "Yeah no, I don't even to provide the easily found by yourself".

 

I'm not ignoring you, you're hilarious, it's fun. Please post more.

 

Stating 3 basic principles were shown to be true is not making an "odd comparison". Anger against such things is simply a commonly known fact, one if you really aren't aware of (doubtful) then you're a couple of clicks away from educating yourself. If you can't disprove the 3 basic principles are false then thats fine, best you just don't post. 

[Sabcat]

Stating 3 basic principles were shown to be true is not making an "odd comparison". Anger against such things is simply a commonly known fact, one if you really aren't aware of (doubtful) then you're a couple of clicks away from educating yourself. If you can't disprove the 3 basic principles are false then thats fine, best you just don't post. 

 

Now, you've changed your position. It's gone from "anger against Multiculturalism/Mass Immigration/Political Correctness is increasing" to "anger against such things" which is not even subtly different. I'm well aware there's anger against immigration etc, I was on Dover a few weeks ago kicking the living shit out of some people who are angry about such things which was made possible by, amongst other things, there being far more of us than thick angry racists.

 

So, what actually is your position. Some people are angry (you being one of them) or increasing numbers of people are angry. If the latter, when did this increase begin, why and how has it manifested itself. If the former, well done you for posting the bleeding obvious, have a cookie.

[Rozalia]

Now, you've changed your position. It's gone from "anger against Multiculturalism/Mass Immigration/Political Correctness is increasing" to "anger against such things" which is not even subtly different. I'm well aware there's anger against immigration etc, I was on Dover a few weeks ago kicking the living shit out of some people who are angry about such things which was made possible by, amongst other things, there being far more of us than thick angry racists.

 

So, what actually is your position. Some people are angry (you being one of them) or increasing numbers of people are angry. If the latter, when did this increase begin, why and how has it manifested itself. If the former, well done you for posting the bleeding obvious, have a cookie.

 

The main point doesn't go further then multiculturalism and mass immigration are going to cause problems, while shielded by political correctness. In actuality people don't need to be angry about it for those basic principles to be true, and as I said it is common knowledge that they have been failures and they have been protected by political correctness. 

 

I have for the purposes of the discussion answered things put to me of course. Harkening back to 1968 is important to show even then people knew the obvious, for a common attack is to try and portray anger, anger which has increased for numerous reasons depending on where you are could be EU, Islamic terrorism, ghettoisation, reporting of criminality, suffering unjustly from political correctness, and more, is a recent thing and unjustified. A fix for such problems should have been done not simply yesterday but as far back as 1968 in the context we're talking about, so arguing for "radical" fixes so many decades after is justifiable. 

[Sabcat]

What problems? It's just more assertions from you, make and argument, build a case. Simply stating something, repeatedly makes you sound like an idiot.

 

When you say "multiculturalism" do you mean the material reality of people from different races/ethnicities/cultures living in the same society or do you mean the policies of political multiculturalism (in the UK, obviously, in France for example policy is quite different). Try to move beyond facile generalisations and at least attempt to demonstrate you've given these things any kind of thought at all. So far it's been quite pathetic.

[Rozalia]

What problems? It's just more assertions from you, make and argument, build a case. Simply stating something, repeatedly makes you sound like an idiot.

 

When you say "multiculturalism" do you mean the material reality of people from different races/ethnicities/cultures living in the same society or do you mean the policies of political multiculturalism (in the UK, obviously, in France for example policy is quite different). Try to move beyond facile generalisations and at least attempt to demonstrate you've given these things any kind of thought at all. So far it's been quite pathetic.

 

On one hand you're hitting me with the angle that I haven't posted enough. On the other hand I'm also going too fast and need to slow down and explain basic things to you slowly. Collect yourself and don't hit me from two opposite ends please. What problems does political correctness bring, mass immigration? You're a smart lad, fill in the obvious blanks. 

 

Stop going in circles and trying to take this off track, I'm wise to such tricks. I've said it's different country to country so trying to hit me on "facile generalisations" don't work, stop reading from the music sheet and start being civil please. 

[Sabcat]

On one hand you're hitting me with the angle that I haven't posted enough. On the other hand I'm also going too fast and need to slow down and explain basic things to you slowly. Collect yourself and don't hit me from two opposite ends please. What problems does political correctness bring, mass immigration? You're a smart lad, fill in the obvious blanks. 

 

Stop going in circles and trying to take this off track, I'm wise to such tricks. I've said it's different country to country so trying to hit me on "facile generalisations" don't work, stop reading from the music sheet and start being civil please. 

 

That post reads like you saying you don't have the first idea what you're talking about. So far  all you've posted is "some things are bad" no reasoning, no argument. You've gone from increasing anger to existing anger, still with no argument.

 

You, my angry internet friend are all over the place.

[Rozalia]

That post reads like you saying you don't have the first idea what you're talking about. So far  all you've posted is "some things are bad" no reasoning, no argument. You've gone from increasing anger to existing anger, still with no argument.

 

You, my angry internet friend are all over the place.

 

Do you require evidence of said angry internet people too? Wheres the proof at?

[Sabcat]

The basics of constructing an argument are probably where you should start. Learn that before you start another thread if you want to be more than a thing of ridicule.

[Rozalia]

The basics of constructing an argument are probably where you should start. Learn that before you start another thread if you want to be more than a thing of ridicule.

 

If you want to continue refer back to my OP and go from there, otherwise bye bye. 

[fistofdoom]

If you want to continue refer back to my OP and go from there, otherwise bye bye. 

Once again, popcorn. No, don't go!