Rozalia vs Ibrahim, on Islamic Misdeeds

[Rozalia]

If I said this then why, pray, did you not simply quote me?

Too much to quote flower. A quick read of this thread or knowledge on your IRC exploits and people would know pretty quick the twisted views you hold.

 

Not condemning ≠ condoning.

Will you condemn the Nazis then? Wait actually, they killed a lot of Jews so they're likely your heroes too... then again they ain't Muslims so I suppose your lunacy may allow you to.

Condemning ISIS is the easiest thing in the world yet you refuse to, instead whitewashing their crimes.

 

I'm pretty sure it had more to do with the fact that those soldiers were trying to kill them more than anything.

Except they show off their killing of civilians with no issue. I myself have seen the videos of them killing women.

 

That's because I prefer truth/honesty, and they happen to be neither of those things.

Well I'm glad I did in fact get an answer out of you though you never intended to give one. So they are aren't lunatics or a death cult, they're in perfect mind and hold perfectly fine religious beliefs. Also you value truth/honesty yet do nothing but try to distract to avoid answering questions if you don't outright ignore it.

 

Given the fact that they are fighting both the Iraqi/Syrian armies and the rebels in Syria all at the same time, I am assuming they have a lot more than 30,000 soldiers, and the Kurds who are actually fighting them on the ground claim they have around 200,000.

 

They are also not just made up of fighters but judges, administrators, doctors, engineers, street cleaners, builders, etc. Since they are acting as a de facto state in the vast territory the control by taxing the local population, selling oil, and providing services to 10 million people (according to the Committee of the Red Cross).

I thought you might quote that figure and am very happy you blundered into it:

 

Strength Inside Syria and Iraq

200,000 (Kurdish claim)

100,000 (Jihadist claim)

20,000–31,000 (CIA estimate)

 

In no way would an ISIS supporter like you take the Kurd's estimate over ISIS's own, unless of course you're just pulling whatever figure more makes your argument look better. 

 

Didn't you earlier say there is no proper Muslim state in existance, something along those lines? You going to take that back now due to your boys ISIS having one, or are you finally going to condemn them for something? 

 

Oh and of course lets not forget: Ibrahim; Who would you class as true exponents of Islam?

Edited October 2, 2015 by Rozalia

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

I myself have seen the videos of them killing women.

 

Provide a link to at least one of the videos, if you are being truthful, and I will reconsider what I said.

 

I thought you might quote that figure and am very happy you blundered into it:

Strength Inside Syria and Iraq

200,000 (Kurdish claim)

100,000 (Jihadist claim)

20,000–31,000 (CIA estimate)

 

In no way would an ISIS supporter like you take the Kurd's estimate over ISIS's own, unless of course you're just pulling whatever figure more makes your argument look better.

 

Again, you are assuming I'm a supporter, and I think they may have even more than 200,000 (for the reasons I mentioned before).

 

Didn't you earlier say there is no proper Muslim state in existance, something along those lines? You going to take that back now due to your boys ISIS having one, or are you finally going to condemn them for something?

 

I believe my exact words were: "I don't believe there are any Muslim leaders of any recognised country, today."

 

Oh and of course lets not forget: Ibrahim; Who would you class as true exponents of Islam?

 

Muslims. (Not including apostates.)

Edited October 2, 2015 by Ibrahim

[Rozalia]

Provide a link to at least one of the videos, if you are being truthful, and I will reconsider what I said.

 

You know full well I can't post a video whereupon someone is beheaded, so cowardly as usual.

 

Again, you are assuming I'm a supporter, and I think they may have even more than 200,000 (for the reasons I mentioned before).

 

Backtracking from your support of ISIS now? Getting scared you might be receiving knocks on your door now? Come on now, where is that "brave holy Muslim" now? So ISIS says 100,000 and you think they may have more then 200,000? Ridiculous. Let me give you the fact of the matter though you're so deluded it won't matter. The Kurds inflate their enemies numbers. ISIS inflates their own number. Both the 200,000 and 100,000 figures are undoubtably wrong, but you are so deluded that even they are not quite big enough. 

 

I believe my exact words were: "I don't believe there are any Muslim leaders of any recognised country, today."

 

So you don't recognize ISIS's Islamic state? Answer the question now, are ISIS's state a proper Muslim state? Just give an answer, no distractions. 

 

Muslims. (Not including apostates.)

 

Cop out answer that doesn't go with your earlier statements. Before you condemned Saudi Arabia for being too liberal so clearly they ain't true exponents of Islam. If even religious fundamentalists like Saudi Arabia aren't true Muslims then that only leaves people even more fundamentalist as possibly being true Muslims. That leaves ISIS and nutjobs like yourself in my estimation. 

 

So again Ibrahim; Who would you class as true exponents of Islam? And to expand on that question, are ISIS true exponents of Islam? They what Muslims need to aspire to be? Yes or no?

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

You know full well I can't post a video whereupon someone is beheaded, so cowardly as usual.

 

Stop projecting your cowardice onto others. Post the link with clear warning that It contains graphic content, as I have done in the past. There is no rule against doing so, but you will never be able to do it since I know for a fact that you are lying.

 

So ISIS says 100,000 and you think they may have more then 200,000? Ridiculous.

 

When did they say they only had 100,000? I want direct quotes with names.

 

Let me give you the fact of the matter though you're so deluded it won't matter. The Kurds inflate their enemies numbers. ISIS inflates their own number. Both the 200,000 and 100,000 figures are undoubtably wrong, but you are so deluded that even they are not quite big enough. 

 

Syrian Army has 125,000 active personnel with 200,000 in reserve.

 

Iraqi Army has 283,000 active personal with 528,500 in reserve.

 

Pashmerga have 270,000 soldiers.

 

YPG/PKK have a combined force of 65,000 militia.

 

FSA have 45,000 - 60,000 soldiers/militia.

 

(Note: I didn't even mention the hundreds of thousands Iraqi/Lebanese militias fighting them.)

 

And you're saying that I.S. fought all of them at the same time and utterly defeated them (especially the Iraqi Army) with only 30,000 soldiers? Despite being heavily bombed from the air by a coalition of more than 60 countries? ... Okay.

[Moreau]

Wew rekt

[Rozalia]

Stop projecting your cowardice onto others. Post the link with clear warning that It contains graphic content, as I have done in the past. There is no rule against doing so, but you will never be able to do it since I know for a fact that you are lying.

 

You posted images of dead people. Graphic but not hugely so. People alive having their heads cut off is a different matter.

Searching "ISIS beheads" in a search engine is enough to bring up many links of their deeds which you deny because... you're a bloody fool at best. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISIL_beheading_incidents

 

Just recently they beheaded Khaled al-Asaad simply for his work in Palmyra, who of course the most Holy ISIS then destroyed because they have no respect for anything. I wonder how you'd feel if someone flattened Mecca and the Kaaba, um? 

 

When did they say they only had 100,000? I want direct quotes with names.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/16/us-mideast-crisis-baghdadi-insight-idUSKBN0OW1VN20150616

 

"Despite thousands of foreign volunteers, jihadist ideologues say IS forces are 90 percent Iraqi and 70 percent Syrian in its two main strongholds, where they have about 40,000 fighters and 60,000 supporters.

 

Baghdadi, who forged links with Saddam’s Baathists while a prisoner during the U.S. occupation, also claims descent from the Prophet Mohammad and his Quraishi tribe – a heritage that allows him to assert that "we are the soldiers of the mission declared by the Prophet"."

 

Syrian Army has 125,000 active personnel with 200,000 in reserve.

 

Iraqi Army has 283,000 active personal with 528,500 in reserve.

 

Pashmerga have 270,000 soldiers.

 

YPG/PKK have a combined force of 65,000 militia.

 

FSA have 45,000 - 60,000 soldiers/militia.

 

(Note: I didn't even mention the hundreds of thousands Iraqi/Lebanese militias fighting them.)

 

And you're saying that I.S. fought all of them at the same time and utterly defeated them (especially the Iraqi Army) with only 30,000 soldiers? Despite being heavily bombed from the air by a coalition of more than 60 countries? ... Okay.

 

As always. You ask constantly for evidence but you at worst provide none of your own, and at best provide figures that you've plucked to say what you want. The Syrian figure was a pre-war number something which is simply not the case anymore (if it ever was). Millions have fled Syria and Assad only has control of 1/3 of the country at this point. Same with the Iraqi army and all those other quoted figures at that.

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

You posted images of dead people. Graphic but not hugely so. People alive having their heads cut off is a different matter.

Searching "ISIS beheads" in a search engine is enough to bring up many links of their deeds which you deny because... you're a bloody fool at best.

 

Like I said, I know for a fact that they did not execute any women, but nice try.

 

Just recently they beheaded Khaled al-Asaad simply for his work in Palmyra, who of course the most Holy ISIS then destroyed because they have no respect for anything

 

The real reason was because he was part of Assad's tyrannical regime.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/16/us-mideast-crisis-baghdadi-insight-idUSKBN0OW1VN20150616

 

"Despite thousands of foreign volunteers, jihadist ideologues say IS forces are 90 percent Iraqi and 70 percent Syrian in its two main strongholds, where they have about 40,000 fighters and 60,000 supporters.

 

No name! You can't even meet a simple request: "I want direct quotes with names."

 

As always. You ask constantly for evidence but you at worst provide none of your own, and at best provide figures that you've plucked to say what you want.

 

I got the figures from wiki, but granted they might not be up to date, after all the defeats they suffered

 

The Syrian figure was a pre-war number something which is simply not the case anymore (if it ever was). Millions have fled Syria and Assad only has control of 1/3 of the country at this point. Same with the Iraqi army and all those other quoted figures at that.

 

Still doesn't explain how I.S. could have frontlines with all those actors simultaneously, with only 30,000 soldiers, and across such a vast amount of territory whilst being bombed by a collation of 60+ countries.

 

Or how they could inflict the Syrian army with resounding defeated in their most fortified places like the Tabqa military airport, Division 17, Brigade 93, Al-Sukhnah, Palmyra, etc. Not to mention the capture of Ar-Raqqa, Jarabulus, al-Bab, Manbij, Tal Abyad, most of Deir Ezzor, (to mention a few) from Assad's thugs and the rebels they couldn't handle.

 

Or how they could capture Mosul, the second largest city in Iraq, and the provincial capital of Nineveh province in a matter of days. Or the capture of Fallujah and Ramadi (provincial capital of Anbar province) from tens of thousands of Iraqi soldiers and special forces stationed there. But I guess they are just that good, right? According to you each I.S. soldiers must be equivalent to more than 1,000 regular soldiers.

Edited October 2, 2015 by Ibrahim

[Rozalia]

Like I said, I know for a fact that they did not execute any women, but nice try.

 

You have to be the most pathetic person I've come across in my life. It must take a lot of effort to be that much of a scumbag. 

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3144213/ISIS-executes-women-beheading-time-group-kills-two-married-couples-witchcraft-sorcery-Syria.html

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/isis-terror-group-executed-over-10000-men-women-children-syria-iraq-1521094

http://www.iraqinews.com/arab-world-news/sohr-isis-executes-girl-deir-al-zour-whatsapp/

 

Guess who the source in the above is? Your old friend from Coventry, but let me guess... he is wrong this time because it's ISIS. Ah but you see ISIS doesn't just kill women no, they sell them as sex slaves too. Oh and lets not forget many of them are pedophiles. Killer pedophiles are the best Muslims of course considering ISIS are the best Muslims according to dear Ibrahim.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=41&v=AMWPr5xUpt0

 

The real reason was because he was part of Assad's tyrannical regime.

 

Yes an archaeologist who was for 40 years the head of antiquities in Palmyra was "part of Assad's regime". Your disrespect of the dead sickens me. Khaled al-Asaad refused to give in to the demands of your heroes before they killed him, that is bravery. You? Nothing but a pathetic coward worthy of nothing but scorn. 

 

No name! You can't even meet a simple request: "I want direct quotes with names."

 

So you cut half my quote out so you could say this? Keep embarrassing yourself. 

 

I got the figures from wiki, but granted they might not be up to date, after all the defeats they suffered

 

No you knew exactly what they were considering I looked at the source you used and it clearly says pre-war and then when you read on it says why that figure is widely off. Whenever you present some source of some kind they always possess these errors as to begin with you don't read your own sources, and second you are arguing such a stupid argument that is impossible for you to successfully argue it. The more you persist the more people think you a lunatic.

 

Still doesn't explain how I.S. could have frontlines with all those actors simultaneously, with only 30,000 soldiers, and across such a vast amount of territory whilst being bombed by a collation of 60+ countries.

 

Or how they could inflict the Syrian army with resounding defeated in their most fortified places like the Tabqa military airport, Division 17, Brigade 93, Al-Sukhnah, Palmyra, etc. Not to mention the capture of Ar-Raqqa, Jarabulus, al-Bab, Manbij, Tal Abyad, most of Deir Ezzor, (to mention a few) from Assad's thugs and the rebels they couldn't handle.

 

Or how they could capture Mosul, the second largest city in Iraq, and the provincial capital of Nineveh province in a matter of days. Or the capture of Fallujah and Ramadi (provincial capital of Anbar province) from tens of thousands of Iraqi soldiers and special forces stationed there. But I guess they are just that good, right? According to you each I.S. soldiers must be equivalent to more than 1,000 regular soldiers.

 

For one the Iraqi army fled in ISIS's advance so they've had an easy ride there. In Syria they are involved in a three way fight so Assad and FSA can't deal any significant blow to them without leaving themselves exposed to the other. ISIS are lucky, not skilled. 

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

All religions have bee extremely barbaric at some point in time, Islam, Christianity, Etc etc. Back in the day, Christians hung people who didn't believe in God. However, now the only major barbaric religion is Islam. Yes there are some inncocent people, but millions believe that anybody who doesn't believe in them should die. This argument is silly because Khilafah is wrong. Islam is not a peaceful religion. And the majority of people think the same

 

Edit: And nearly every time Islam tries to create a caliphate, an act of Christianity destroys it. Tell me, if Christians and Muslims believe in the same God, how is it that Christianity always succeeds?

Edited October 2, 2015 by Lysanderius

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

Tactics mostly.

Yes and if God really does exsist, he would choose who to win?

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

You have to be the most pathetic person I've come across in my life. It must take a lot of effort to be that much of a scumbag. 

 

Nay, you are worse than an animal.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3144213/ISIS-executes-women-beheading-time-group-kills-two-married-couples-witchcraft-sorcerySyria.html

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/isis-terror-group-executed-over-10000-men-women-children-syria-iraq-1521094

http://www.iraqinews.com/arab-world-news/sohr-isis-executes-girl-deir-al-zour-whatsapp/

 

Guess who the source in the above is? Your old friend from Coventry, but let me guess... he is wrong this time because it's ISIS. Ah but you see ISIS doesn't just kill women no, they sell them as sex slaves too. Oh and lets not forget many of them are pedophiles. Killer pedophiles are the best Muslims of course considering ISIS are the best Muslims according to dear Ibrahim.

 

Interesting how none of the links you provided are to any of the alleged beheading videos of women you apparently watched. A proven liar, you are.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=41&v=AMWPr5xUpt0

 

A desperate attempt on your part, but no cake.

 

Yes an archaeologist who was for 40 years the head of antiquities in Palmyra was "part of Assad's regime". Your disrespect of the dead sickens me. Khaled al-Asaad refused to give in to the demands of your heroes before they killed him, that is bravery. You? Nothing but a pathetic coward worthy of nothing but scorn. 

 

He was a member of the Assad's Ba'ath Party since 1954, and headed the Palmyra Antiquities Department and Museums, which come under the Directorate-General of Antiquities and Museums (a government agency), from 1963.

 

So you cut half my quote out so you could say this? Keep embarrassing yourself. 

 

The rest of your quote had absolutely nothing to do with what was being talked about. So who is embarrassing themselves? Honestly, grow up kid.

 

For one the Iraqi army fled in ISIS's advance so they've had an easy ride there. In Syria they are involved in a three way fight so Assad and FSA can't deal any significant blow to them without leaving themselves exposed to the other. ISIS are lucky, not skilled. 

 

That doesn't explain how I.S. could deal significant blows to both the rebels and Assad's thugs at the same time. Don't the same rules apply to them or are you saying they are just that good? 

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

Khilafah, do you believe that beheading thousands of people is a good thing?

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

Missed one.

All religions have bee extremely barbaric at some point in time, Islam, Christianity, Etc etc. Back in the day, Christians hung people who didn't believe in God. However, now the only major barbaric religion is Islam. Yes there are some inncocent people, but millions believe that anybody who doesn't believe in them should die. This argument is silly because Khilafah is wrong. Islam is not a peaceful religion. And the majority of people think the same

 

I think you mean "pacifist". Islam is certainly not a "pacifist" religion. Muslims are not only allowed to defend themselves, but specifically instructed to do so if attacked, and I'm guessing that what rubs you the wrong way. You just have to suck it up. (Nobody is here to please you.)

 

Edit: And nearly every time Islam tries to create a caliphate, an act of Christianity destroys it. Tell me, if Christians and Muslims believe in the same God, how is it that Christianity always succeeds?

 

Muslims always had a Caliphate throughout their 1400+ year history. It's only in recent times that they didn't have one (last Muslim caliphate was exactly 91 years ago) and It wasn't destroyed by an act of Christianity, far from it, but by Britain and France who divided up the region in the Sykes-Picot Agreement.

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

Missed one.

 

 

I think you mean "pacifist". Islam is certainly not a "pacifist" religion. Muslims are not only allowed to defend themselves, but specifically instructed to do so if attacked, and I'm guessing that what rubs you the wrong way. You just have to suck it up. (Nobody is here to please you.)

 

 

 

 

Muslims always had a Caliphate throughout their 1400+ year history. It's only in recent times that they didn't have one (last Muslim caliphate was exactly 91 years ago) and It wasn't destroyed by an act of Christianity, far from it, but by Britain and France who divided up the region in the Sykes-Picot Agreement.

Who which at the time endorsed Christianity extremely

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

Who which at the time endorsed Christianity extremely

And nearly every time Islam tries to create a caliphate, an act of Christianity destroys it. Tell me, if Christians and Muslims believe in the same God, how is it that Christianity always succeeds?

Yes and if God really does exsist, he would choose who to win?

 

Christians are pagans and Muslims are monotheists but regarding your other point...

 

Hadhrat Huzaifa narrated that the Messenger of Allah (saw) said: "Prophethood will remain among you as long as Allah wills. Then Caliphate (Khilafah) on the lines of Prophethood shall commence, and remain as long as Allah wills. Then corrupt/erosive monarchy would take place, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. After that, despotic kingship would emerge, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. Then, the Caliphate (Khilafah) shall come once again based on the precept of Prophethood."

 

The fact that their would emerge a time when there was no Caliphate is something Muslims long expected/anticipated and is not exactly considered a defeat.

Edited October 2, 2015 by Ibrahim

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

I can also quote the Qu'ran. And I can do it in a way to refute your claims.

(5:58) O ye who believe! take not those for friends who make a jest and sport of your religion from among those who were given the Book before you, and the disbelievers. And fear Allah if you are believers. (This talks about Christians and Jews)

 

 [60:8] It may be that Allah will bring about love between you and those of them with whom you are now at enmity; and Allah is All-Powerful; and Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful. (this talks about forgiving conflict between Muslims, Jews and Christians.

 

Source: The Holy Qu'ran

 

What have you refuted exactly?

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

Christians are pagans and Muslims are monotheists but regarding your other point...

 

Hadhrat Huzaifa narrated that the Messenger of Allah (saw) said: "Prophethood will remain among you as long as Allah wills. Then Caliphate (Khilafah) on the lines of Prophethood shall commence, and remain as long as Allah wills. Then corrupt/erosive monarchy would take place, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. After that, despotic kingship would emerge, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. Then, the Caliphate (Khilafah) shall come once again based on the precept of Prophethood."

 

The fact that their would emerge a time when there was no Caliphate is something Muslims long expected/anticipated and is not exactly considered a defeat.

so, your point is coming from a totally insane bible. And that Christians don't belive in Christianity? wow you know nothing. to counter that,

 

Muslims are Infidels, and Christians are monotheists.

[Robert Ap Ioan]

Muslims. (Not including apostates.)

 

You missed the point of my question, to be fair it was late and I was tired when I posted it.

 

By true exponent I mean who influences your reading of the Qu'ran? Who taught you Sharia law? Which Islamic clerics/philosophers do you class as being truly Islamic? Where do you get your worldview from, as it is totally alien to the worldview of Muslims I know.

[Speaker Faris Wheeler]

so, your point is coming from a totally insane bible. And that Christians don't belive in Christianity? wow you know nothing. to counter that,

 

Muslims are Infidels, and Christians are monotheists.'

"Put on then, as God's chosen ones, holy and beloved, compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness, and patience, bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive. And above all these put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. ..." 

Colossians 3:12-17

 

Christian bible ^

 

 

In the Islam bible, the teachings are to kill people. wow thats soooo humane 

 

Islam be like "Put on then, as Allah's chosen ones, radical and hated, uncompassionate hearts, unkindness, unhumility, unmeekness, and impatience, unbearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, killing each other; as the Allah has not forgiven you, so you also must unforgive. And above all these put on hate, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the war of Mohammed rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Mohammed dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all Cowardness....."

Edited October 2, 2015 by Lysanderius

[Rozalia]

Nay, you are worse than an animal.

Says the ISIS supporter. Virtually all your pathetic appeals can be countered with that, you just don't realize how much your support of those fanatics discredits you to any rational person.

 

Interesting how none of the links you provided are to any of the alleged beheading videos of women you apparently watched. A proven liar, you are.

No I'm not providing a direct link to a beheading video, people can find it if they wish to. However the news pieces talk about such things, something you chose to ignore and are now trying to distract from. No, address them and ISIS's barbaric killing.

 

A desperate attempt on your part, but no cake.

Doesn't in any manner address the video because you can't obviously, outside conspiracy theories naturally.

 

He was a member of the Assad's Ba'ath Party since 1954, and headed the Palmyra Antiquities Department and Museums, which come under the Directorate-General of Antiquities and Museums (a government agency), from 1963.

No doesn't work that way. A party membership and working for a government agency (do you expect them to have privatised their heritage sites?) does not make you "part of the regime". That implies he had some role in the fighting when all he cared for was doing his job. As for why he was killed, everyone says it was because he refused to do as ISIS says. You on the other hand think you have the authority to say no, he was killed because he was "part of the regime". Even ISIS would laugh at your ignorant arse, they killed him for the mentioned reason (not your nonsense) and for idolatry.

 

The rest of your quote had absolutely nothing to do with what was being talked about. So who is embarrassing themselves? Honestly, grow up kid.

Your constant imagining of conspiracies to make ISIS of all things look bad bores and insults everyone who reads it.

 

That doesn't explain how I.S. could deal significant blows to both the rebels and Assad's thugs at the same time. Don't the same rules apply to them or are you saying they are just that good?

I suppose your grasp is pretty non existent on reality but if you didn't know Assad and FSA had already been fighting for ages already when ISIS moved in with force.

 

I think you mean "pacifist". Islam is certainly not a "pacifist" religion. Muslims are not only allowed to defend themselves, but specifically instructed to do so if attacked, and I'm guessing that what rubs you the wrong way. You just have to suck it up. (Nobody is here to please you.)

Those who hate Islam thank their lucky stars for nutjobs like yourself. People like you bring the day Muslims will become like the Jews of old ever closer, enjoy the Pogrom I suppose.

 

Muslims always had a Caliphate throughout their 1400+ year history. It's only in recent times that they didn't have one (last Muslim caliphate was exactly 91 years ago) and It wasn't destroyed by an act of Christianity, far from it, but by Britain and France who divided up the region in the Sykes-Picot Agreement.

Hard to know which one you're exactly pointing at as they've been many since then, but if we're talking the most important final one...no actually. The Ottoman caliphate collapsed because people rejected it's nonsense and opted for secularism.

 

Christians are pagans and Muslims are monotheists but regarding your other point...

 

Hadhrat Huzaifa narrated that the Messenger of Allah (saw) said: "Prophethood will remain among you as long as Allah wills. Then Caliphate (Khilafah) on the lines of Prophethood shall commence, and remain as long as Allah wills. Then corrupt/erosive monarchy would take place, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. After that, despotic kingship would emerge, and it will remain as long as Allah wills. Then, the Caliphate (Khilafah) shall come once again based on the precept of Prophethood."

 

The fact that their would emerge a time when there was no Caliphate is something Muslims long expected/anticipated and is not exactly considered a defeat.

What happened to "people of the book"? Pretty common I suppose. You talk of respect when it suits you, but disrespect any other time. 

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

so, your point is coming from a totally insane bible.

 

The fact that you don't know the difference between Hadith and the bible, Is pretty sad.

 

I'm just going to simplify it for you and hopefully you will understand:

 

Prophet Muhammad (saw) said a time will come when there won't be any Caliphate on earth for a period of time, but corrupt/erosive monarchy and despotic kingships, and then the Caliphate would return upon the prophetic methodology. So the fact that Muslims experienced 91 years without a Caliphate is not something they find surprising or consider a defeat but rather something they expected and anticipated.  

 

so, your point is coming from a totally insane bible. And that Christians don't belive in Christianity? wow you know nothing. to counter that,

 

Muslims are Infidels, and Christians are monotheists.

 

The current form of Christianity that is prevalent in the world today teaches paganism (3 gods: The Farther, The Son, and The Holy Ghost) as opposed to the initial message of monotheism Jesus came with, but that was a separate point aimed at answering the question you raised regarding whether or not Christians and Muslims believed in the same God. There are still some monotheistic Christians but they are a very small minority, unfortunately.

[Arthur Wellington]

To speak of The Islam or Christianity is a false statement of a supposed unified collection of people with a shared believe systems. Fact is that there has never been a unified Church or Islam. Most damage to either groups is done by people claiming to be part of that group itself. 

Edited October 2, 2015 by Vivke

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

 

"Put on then, as God's chosen ones, holy and beloved, compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness, and patience, bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive. And above all these put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. ..." 

Colossians 3:12-17

 

Christian bible ^

 

 

In the Islam bible, the teachings are to kill people. wow thats soooo humane 

 

Islam be like "Put on then, as Allah's chosen ones, radical and hated, uncompassionate hearts, unkindness, unhumility, unmeekness, and impatience, unbearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, killing each other; as the Allah has not forgiven you, so you also must unforgive. And above all these put on hate, which binds everything together in perfect harmony. And let the war of Mohammed rule in your hearts, to which indeed you were called in one body. And be thankful. Let the word of Mohammed dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all Cowardness....."

 

 

Wow, you need serious education mate, and I am not here to be your teacher.

 

I will say this though: There is no such thing as a "Islam bible" lmao

 

Also since you made me laugh so much...

 

He (Jesus) said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.†(Luke 22:36)

Edited October 2, 2015 by Ibrahim

[Ibrahim (Banned)]

To speak of The Islam or Christianity is a false statement of a supposed unified collection of people with shared believe systems. Fact is that there have never been a unified Church of Islam. Most damage to either groups is done by people claiming to be part of that group itself. 

 

Muslims don't have churches

[Robert Ap Ioan]

The current form of Christianity that is prevalent in the world today teaches paganism (3 gods: The Farther, The Son, and The Holy Ghost) as opposed to the initial message of monotheism Jesus came with, but that was a separate point aimed at answering the question you raised regarding whether or not Christians and Muslims believed in the same God. There are still some monotheistic Christians but they are a very small minority, unfortunately.

 

The Holy Trinity is one God, made of one essence, there is no other God. Your understanding of Christianity is wrong. Christianity is a monotheistic religion, again you show your ignorance.

 

 

Muslims don't have churches

 

What does Church mean? It means a unified body with one set of beliefs, Like Vivke said there is no unified body.

 

 

Also are you going to answer my questions?

 

 

You missed the point of my question, to be fair it was late and I was tired when I posted it.

 

By true exponent I mean who influences your reading of the Qu'ran? Who taught you Sharia law? Which Islamic clerics/philosophers do you class as being truly Islamic? Where do you get your worldview from, as it is totally alien to the worldview of Muslims I know.

 

I know they are challenging, but I want to fully understand where you are coming from.

 

What do you think of Salafism and Wahhabism?

Edited October 2, 2015 by Rob Ap Ioan