Moreau Posted June 16, 2016 Author Share Posted June 16, 2016 (edited) The topic is about what a Christian response is to the Orlando shooting, not you and Rozalia's discussing whether Islamic scholarship is valid or not. Not every post has to have some Islamic bullshit thrown in expressing the Islamic view or its "superiority" over other faiths. Most people do not give a flying !@#$. Nor do we need a rebuttal every time Islam is mentioned nor its "failures" at its self-claimed authenticity by an angry wrestling fan. Pastor Steven Anderson on Orlando Pastor Steven Anderson preaching 3 years ago about Sodomites at Faithful Word Baptist Church in Tempe, AZ. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnV0WnEkmqw Edited June 16, 2016 by Moreau III Quote Signed by Sultan Moreau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doktor Avalanche Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Congratulations! You found a Christian response. Quote Beer. Damn Good Beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doktor Avalanche Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 I found another Christian response as well. Quote Beer. Damn Good Beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moreau Posted June 16, 2016 Author Share Posted June 16, 2016 I found another Christian response as well. Pastor Steven Anderson Responds To Christian Sodomite Sympathisers! Quote Signed by Sultan Moreau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doktor Avalanche Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Good thing I am not a Christian. Quote Beer. Damn Good Beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moreau Posted June 17, 2016 Author Share Posted June 17, 2016 Sodomite PRIDE? Quote Signed by Sultan Moreau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozalia Posted June 18, 2016 Share Posted June 18, 2016 I am not sure if you even read the content of the link you provided as it does not support your assertion that Sahih/Hasan ahadith contradict the Quran. Thats really what you're going with after I told you that wasn't what I had said at all. I stated some Hadith do such a thing yes, however the main point being made and what the link is for, is that "sound" Hadith contradict each other. Ignoring the point made so you can state "I'm going to ignore your point, what about the other one?" is very dishonest. My objective is to demonstrate with specific examples that Bukhari and Muslim contain hadith which are not reliable. The easiest way to do this is to present multiple hadith about the same circumstances which contradict each other. By definition those hadith cannot all be true. Muslim Book 010, Number 3886: Jabir b. 'Abdullah (Allah be pleased with them) reported that he was travelling on his camel which had grown jaded, and he decided to let it off. When Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) met him and prayed for him and struck it, so it trotted as it had never trotted before. He said: Sell it to me for an 'uqaya. I said: No. He again said: Sell it to me. So I sold it to him for an 'uqaya, but made the stipulation that I should be allowed to ride back to my family. Jabir (Allah be pleased with him) reported: My camel had grown tired as Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) came to me. He goaded it and it began to jump. After that I tried to restrain its rein so that I could listen to his (Prophet's) words, but I could not do that. Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) met me and said: Sell it to me, and I sold it for five 'uqiyas. I said: On the condition that I may use it as a ride (for going back) to Medina. He (the Holy Prophet) said: Well, you may use it as a ride up till Medina. When I came to Medina I handed over that to him and he made an addition of an uqiya (to that amount which had been agreed upon) and then presented that (camel) to me. Muslim Book 010, Number 3893: Jabir b. 'Abdullah (Allah be pleased with them) reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) bought a camel from me for two 'uqiyas and a dirham or two dirhams. As he reached Sirar (a village near Medina), he commanded a cow to be slaughtered and it was slaughtered, and they ate of that, and as he (the Holy Prophet) reached Medina he ordered me to go to the mosque and offer two rak'ahs of prayer, and he measured for me the price of the camel and even made an excess payment to me. Muslim Book 010, Number 3895: Jabir (Allah be pleased with him) reported that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) said to him: I have taken your camel for four dinars, and you may ride upon it to Medina. What did he pay? 1 uqaya? 5 uqayas? 2 uqayas and 1 or 2 dirhams? 4 dinars? There are other slight differences to the story beyond the money of course, where the payment was made, if the first offer was turned down, if a "tip" was provided. Like I said, Chinese Whispers and you hold that these men are perfect (you've never once when asked several times stated a negative to this). "Sound" Hadith are not perfect. The above are all half true in that they speak of a story which we can derive a camel was brought for some sort of sum. The original if I had to say was likely very simple and along the way someone added the "tip" bit for example to make it seem more generous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aisha Greyjoy Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 The Christian response is contained in the bible. John 8:8-8:10 Essentially, Jesus is confronted with a sinner and others want to condemn and kill the sinner. Jesus asks that those without sin go ahead and stone her. None do so. As they did not condemn her, so does Jesus not condemn her. Love and forgiveness of sin("as we forgive those who trespass..") is the Christian response. Both for the nutjob shooter and the victims at the nightclub. Lots of those who claim to be Christian do not know Jesus and say "stupid shit" in his name. 2 Quote Duke of House Greyjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Ap Ioan Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 (edited) Sodomite PRIDE? Who made this eejit a pastor and to whom is he accountable. Certainly doesn't sound like a mainstream Christian, more like a heretic....for pete's sake the Man is a KJV onlyist, that is always a warning sign, unless he accepts the apocrypha.... Edited June 20, 2016 by Robert Ap Ioan Quote Still a man hears what he wants to hearAnd disregards the rest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakai Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I'm a pastor and the tragic turn this topic took has me disturbed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Ap Ioan Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 I am not sure quite what you mean. I see a group of Christians trying to share the good news that God came to save sinners, by making one sacrifice for all men. We believe in a God who desires relationship and hates sin. He went out of his way to make that relationship possible. Telling people that God hates them is neither helpful or honest. Quote Still a man hears what he wants to hearAnd disregards the rest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doktor Avalanche Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 (edited) Pastor Steve L. Anderson is the Pastor of Faithful Word Baptist Church in Tempe, AZ. According to Wikipedia: "The Faithful Word Baptist Church's doctrinal statement is posted on its website. The church believes that the King James Bible is the inspired Word of God and is without error. The church also believes in the the post-tribulation rapture, salvation by grace through faith, eternal salvation through Jesus Christ and eternal torment in hell for the unsaved. Among the church's beliefs are that life begins at conception, that homosexuality is a sin and an abomination which God punishes with the death penalty, and an opposition to worldliness, formalism, modernism and liberalism. In March 2015, Anderson published a documentary called Marching to Zion, in which he argued that the anticipated Jewish messiah is the Antichrist, and that the Talmud is blasphemous. He has since promoted Holocaust denial as well." Here is the Church's Website: http://www.faithfulwordbaptist.org/ Here is a list of their doctrines from their website: Doctrinal Statement We believe that the King James Bible is the word of God without error. We believe that salvation is by grace through faith. Being born again by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ is the only requirement for salvation. We believe in the eternal security of the believer (once saved, always saved). We believe that the unsaved will spend eternity in torment in a literal hell. We believe that Jesus is God, and that Jesus Christ was conceived of the Holy Ghost and born of the virgin Mary. We believe only in the local church and not in a universal church. We reject the teaching of Calvinism and believe that God wants everyone to be saved. We believe that the rapture will take place after the tribulation but before God pours out his wrath on this earth. We reject dispensationalism. We believe that life begins at conception (fertilization) and reject all forms of abortion including surgical abortion, "morning-after" pills, IVF (In Vitro Fertilization), birth control pills, and all other processes that end life after conception. We believe that homosexuality is a sin and an abomination which God punishes with the death penalty. We oppose worldliness, modernism, formalism, and liberalism. Edited June 22, 2016 by Lord Asmodeus Quote Beer. Damn Good Beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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