[State of Baseball]

15 minutes ago, roberts said:

bro if you like baseball so much would a nerf to the income (which you've already ROI'd like three times over) really hurt you that badly?

Just keep playing and have fun, this is a game balance/exploit issue for the wider meta.

Perhaps if you actually read what the nerfs would do you might have a valid opinion but the nerfs would make baseball not worth playing any longer which is just what pre wants. But I'm sure you already know this.

[State of Baseball]

How about this. Split baseball into two leagues, Minor League and Major League.

For Minor League you go ahead and do the nerfs you want but for Major League you leave it just the way it is right now.

Minor League would be free as it is now but Major League would be like VIP, 1 credit for 60 days of access. That way sheepy gets paid as well.

There should be 1 addition to both leagues though, a 1 click button to upgrade your players.

Please don't complain that this would make P&W pay to win as it already is when you can make $400 million per month by cashing in credits for cash.

[State of Baseball]

3 hours ago, His Holy Decagon said:

Just punish the 3-5 people that are making it such a big and important issue to bring community attention to.

Are you also going to punish the people that spend hours every day trading and raiding?

[State of Baseball]

8 minutes ago, Basebond said:

Same with video ads too. 

Sheepy will never do that, he makes money off the rewarded ads.

[State of Baseball]

32 minutes ago, Mayor said:

Cheaters gonna cheat no matter what bot you use. 15 minutes or 45 minutes don't matter if you're afk and not even at your computer, making max money on BB per day, but yes this is so good for new players. I think when someone has abused mechanics as much as you have (and at 34 cities by time of this post) that this has gone on long enough with no mod intervention or changes.

I click the button for every game I play. I have been playing this game for 2320 days, that's over 6 years. Most people would say I should have many more cities than I do for the time I have been playing.

You really are a terrible troll.

14 minutes ago, His Holy Decagon said:

And to play advocate, @Who Me I’m sure you’re far from crystal clean hands in this scenario. Certainly if you didn’t play hundreds, if not thousands of games a day through *whatever* means you’re doing it, this wouldn’t even be a topic.

Over the life time of my nation I have averaged playing 681 games per day. That really isn't all that much and I click the button for every one of them. No bots or cheating involved so I would suggest that you learn how baseball works before you accuse people of cheating.

1 minute ago, Mayor said:

Rawr, I feel ya bud. I am even worse at city growth. Still, even Sheepy himself suspects Who Me of using illegal bots regardless of how bad he is at everything else besides baseball. (Military, Politics, etc.) You know how trash Who Me is so I don't need to go into detail here.

It must be exhausting being in an alliance with you.

[State of Baseball]

18 minutes ago, Mayor said:

So let me get this straight, you're saying that TKR defends cheaters? That is very concerning to hear. By the way, he does not spend a massive amount of time on this, he spends 15 minutes to generate max income using a bot, he literally just said this.

I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit. I said you could do it using Doc's script, I didn't say I used Doc's script which I do not. I use an older script that is slower and takes about 45 minutes to play 250 games. Perhaps sheepy should just ban all scripts used in the game, that would be fun wouldn't it?

[State of Baseball]

5 minutes ago, Mayor said:

Another pro-baseball post from a TKR guy, certainty nothing fishy going on over there. If you really meant what you say then Who Me wouldn't be in your alliance.

I guess you really can't troll any better. Oh well.

1 minute ago, Arawra said:

I don't really care about baseball, I'd even say remove it just so discussions like this don't happen every quarter.

However the concern that baseball generates too much money is kinda funny since the credit capped got increased to 20 not too long ago. That 400m is so much more impactful than the meager amounts people generate monthly from baseball, not to mention that 400m is more money than a lot of nations generate each month.

Greedy.

Well, you see, sheepy doesn't make any money from baseball after all so yeah.

[State of Baseball]

1 hour ago, chad said:

I have to jump on this I am a new player comparatively as in I am about 1/4 as old as you in term of nation days. I can tell you this as someone who is new and teaches cadet. Over my time teaching now about 100 cadets about 10 at most have used baseball profitably. I as an anecdote also played baseball at the start wasted my first city grant money and lost 90% of that money in the end. Why do I  say this it's simple and the data backs this up the people who play and use baseball the most our upper tier nations. I also will ask if this is about helping noobs why do the people who play baseball the most embargo new nations with messages such as upgrade your staduim. 

First, baseball has changed a lot over the years but right now if you use Doc's script you can play your 250 home games in less than 15 minutes I believe. So if you max out your team to 100 level you can make that money back in around 12 days at 15 minutes per day and then you are making however much money per day as you want to take the time to play. As for most of the people playing being upper tier nations, this is just not true. I know of several 3 and 4 city nations that have 100 level teams and play away games for tips.

While some players do embargo low level players, I personally only did it if they were playing away games. I don't care if they play home games when I was playing away games. Low level teams should only be playing home games anyway.

42 minutes ago, Mayor said:

Worth it if that loss in activity includes your nation.

Surely you can troll better than this... maybe not.

[State of Baseball]

You only earn 100% income from baseball for the first 250 games you play each day, home or away. After that you only earn 10% for each game. If you nerf baseball too much or just remove it from the game you will probably see a good sized drop in activity in the game because people will have no reason to log in more than once per day, if that. Trading is dominated by a few nations that use scripts to tell them when they have been undercut so they can then come back and do the same so the smaller players will just get tired of that and not trade.

[State of Baseball]

Pre just has a hard-on for baseball and has for a very long time. Quite frankly he should just be removed from the dev team because of his constant desire to kill something that anyone in the game can use equally. He seems obsessed with killing something that new players can use to help them boost their nations quickly which is something sheepy seems to desire. 

[Peace in our Time]

Well hell guys, if you hate it so much just suck up your courage, get together and do something about it. Otherwise please shuuuuut uuuuuup.

[Peace in our Time]

15 minutes ago, Arln said:

ts really the fact that even if they did do it the tide would probably eventually turn against them. You both have the size advantage alone. And now you joined together to stop anything from possibly touching you. Shoot at least MysOasis was touchable and made in action to a foe that actually has superiority over us. Not that I supported it then either. 

Perhaps none of us want to waste out time, effort, money and resources with your sorry asses right now? Did you ever think of that?

I know thinking is not you peoples strong suit but you really should try it sometime.

[[Sphere] Fate Lies in the Stars]

39 minutes ago, Vexz said:

but better to salvage something that wasn't working than to lead it to a painful death.

So Rose is disbanding then?

[Proposed Beige Change]

7 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

If a nation wins a war, that nation can produce an additional 25% units for the remainder of that day. This number stacks but is always calculated off of the base 100% unit production levels.

Does this mean that if a nation wins 4 wars in a day they can then rebuild 100% of the military units in one go and not have to wait the extra days to rebuild?

2 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

You quoted the answer, no one is forcing the alliances to rebuild and fight back. They don't have to throw all of their resources into a war, they can sit and bide their time for the next war just like in the current system. Only with this change, they will now have the option to fight back if they choose and deem it worth the cost to rebuild the alliance army. 

Or one side could all hit VM for a few weeks thus losing very little and killing activity in the game.

 

Are the loot rules for beige still going to be applied the same? If 2 nations fight a war to a draw why should 1 of those nations be punished by losing loot and infra from a beige

 

 

[[Sphere] Fate Lies in the Stars]

3 hours ago, Vexz said:

Like I get jumping on the hate train is easy points but don't be oblivious. TKR spent so much time after signing HedgeMoney saying they did it because they found themselves in a defenseless position and were scared of that position leading them to be rolled (TKRsphere was relatively the size of Rosesphere at that time). Yet, the very moment you gained further security of impending attacks to your security; you used your better footing in tiering to go on the offensive on a smaller party.

Yeah, I can't imagine why such a thing would happen. Perhaps you might have an idea why this occurred?

[Radiant Motion Picture Group's newest acquisition.]

So we are now protecting The Garden of Eden and Eden or did they just change their name.

[[Sphere] Fate Lies in the Stars]

6 hours ago, BigMorf said:

You could've been honest with us about how you really felt about the tiering etc, but it's clear to me now that you were saying one thing externally while having an entire different stance internally on both accounts. 

Tsk, you should know by now that WANA doesn't speak the truth.

5 hours ago, Gaius Julius Caesar said:

I believe WANA has made it abundantly clear that this move is not about Grumpy. He has said multiple times in this exact thread that this has nothing to do with Grumpy, and that his position towards Grumpy has not changed and that he does not desire more wars with Grumpy.

Tarroc, Tarroc, Tarroc

1) see above

2) the reason this treaty happened is because TS and Rose both have lazy and crappy leadership.

I guess we will just have to wait and see whether or not you folks are being truthful this time.

 

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

33 minutes ago, Zevari said:

To be fair you still make a pretty penny from baseball through tips. Alex isn't necessarily wrong in saying the extremes make a lot of money when the top two have 20% of the overall earned.

But this is still quite a small number when split over 6 years, and the added fact that the average player makes quite an insignificant amount.

However I feel the problem isn't that baseball provides too much revenue but lack of saturation away game players have, hence why these extremes exist. If instead of having two people with ~25bil earned combined we had 25 people with 1bil earned each the dev team would care a lot less. (I think the big numbers on a couple of people gave them a scare)

Yes, but you can't make anywhere near the $11 billion I have made in the last 6 years now due to the 250 game limit so that is just out there to get you attention and can't be replicated any longer. Most of that was made back when you could play unlimited games and there were a few people running bots.

Now if I play 250 away games against another 100 level team, if they tip me, I can make any where from $1.45 to $1.65 million due to sheepys RNG. So I would have to play 4 different 100 level players to make that $6 million. That rarely happens these days and every time I have a player retire it costs roughly $3 million to level that player so every time that happens I may or may not make any money that day.

 

Also, if they make it so you can't play baseball while you are blockaded I would imagine you will start seeing a higher turn over of small nations and more bigger nation hitting long term VM during curb stomp wars so good luck with player retention.

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

5 hours ago, Zevari said:

Total invested into baseball all-time is: $69,020,062,694.96

Total earned from baseball all-time is: $113,750,636,412.21

Net value added to the game is: $44,730,573,717.25

Perhaps you could give us the numbers from when you nerfed baseball to the full revenue for the first 250 games until now to get a true picture of how much money is being added to the game now?

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

18 hours ago, zigbigadorlou said:

But natsims are by design incredibly slow growth made to be played over months and years.

The problem with this is that the game developers constantly and consistently under estimate the ability of the players to find ways to quickly out grow the limits that the developers try to impose on the game.

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

7 minutes ago, Alex said:

Total invested into baseball all-time is: $69,020,062,694.96

Total earned from baseball all-time is: $113,750,636,412.21

Net value added to the game is: $44,730,573,717.25

---

Average value invested into baseball is: $2,629,836.64

Average earned from baseball is: $4,334,188.32

Average net value added to game is: $1,704,351.68

---

If we filter out anyone who has $0 earned in baseball, then averages are:

Avg invested: $3,657,536.84

Avg earned: $6,121,228.24

Avg net: $2,463,691.41

The top baseball team has earned over $14b net, the second top team has earned over $10b net.

I mean, you have generated nearly $11b net from baseball. If I was going to guess who is botting baseball, my top two guesses would be you and https://politicsandwar.com/nation/id=70736

First of all, what are those numbers in context to? Per person, per day, per person per day?

Next, here are my number per your own display:

Founded:

02/01/2016 (2,230 Days Old)

 

The Dont Know Dont Cares have an overall record of 1,055,787 wins and 436,635 losses. In their history they have scored 5,498,676 runs, 2,854,020 of which were home runs, and they have pitched 31,378,918 strikeouts.

Money Invested: $731,003,500.00 | Money Earned: $11,593,637,936.15

As you can see, I have been playing P&W for a little over 6 years now and except for a few months after NPOLT I have been playing baseball every day. Although with how often your coding breaks I doubt those figures are accurate.

As an aside, most of the money I made was before the nerfs after NPOLT. A period of time when you were deaf and dumb to with regards to baseball. There were days when I was making $35-40 million per day playing baseball because there were people so obviously using bots which you could have seen if you had bothered to look.

As for botting, if you would bother to check the time between games played and how long people play it would be very easy to spot the people using bots. When you have someone playing a game a second for 10 hours a day with no breaks it's pretty glaring. No one is playing like that now though. At least not that I have noticed.

For the record, I do not nor have I ever used a bot. I am old and retired so I have plenty of time through out the day to play baseball so please do not accuse me of using a bot again.

If you really want to know who was botting back in the day you should check this nation https://politicsandwar.com/nation/id=132570

 

 

2 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

Damn Who Me, what are you blowing all that sweet sweet baseball money on?  Hookers and blow?

Cities and rebuilding after wars. So many rebuilds.

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

You don't actually think they will bestir themselves to investigate a couple of people that may be using a bot do you? It's much easier to punish the many for the sins of the few.

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

Quote

So can we have the global rate of return on baseball? You know, the extended playerbase and not just a few outliers.
I would quite like to see how profitable baseball is compared to the money the global playerbase has sunk into it.

Also, can we see the sunk costs of these players? I feel like just going "This guy made an extra 6mil but spent 5+ hours doing it is bad" is a horrible approach."

Good luck getting anything out of the dev team that doesn't fit sheepy or pre's narrative

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

25 minutes ago, Alex said:

I'm fine with that, though I don't know that a "math" captcha is secure enough.

I agree on this point; I was sympathetic to this argument in the past (it's a tool for losers to recoup) but I agree that with Rewarded Ads, you can still achieve this but without baseball. Plus, if you can find a way to effectively bot rewarded ads, the only person you're defrauding is the ad company, so it's a non-issue.

 

12 minutes ago, zigbigadorlou said:

And for those who are wondering: yes Alex has approved a script to automate rewarded ads, and yes you can freely get it on github as a tampermonkey extension. 

So what we learn from this is that sheepy is fine with scripts that make him money but hates baseball because it doesn't. What a lovely attitude.

[Poll: Baseball Profits Hard Cap]

4 minutes ago, Prefontaine said:

If you'd like to have a constructive conversation once you've cooled down. I'll be all ears. 

I am quite cooled down. I am just tired of the dev team focusing on things that don't matter to the majority of the game while not fixing things that affect 100% of the game which is what you should be doing.