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Roquentin
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Posts posted by Roquentin
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Just now, James II said:
I have been consistent with where I stand, and I've stood by it. You're the one whose morality is on shifting sands. For you it is of mere convenience. You're welcome to peace us out on reasonable terms. We've offered it day one (Rememebr when I sent you an offer and you'd said you'd forward it to everyone and never did.) You lied. You never had any intention then or in recent history to peace out as supported by the logs (verbatim words from Coal B leadership).
As for Leo being 'hacked' it looks like his claim is unravelling. Illegal use of bots for automated banking. Shame. I remember he pretended to be hacked before to gain sympathy.I did forward it. I'm tired of your bullshit claims.It was forwarded to the NG and Leo and they declined. Simple. It's not on shifting sands. You gain everything by peacing with no conditions and so on. We get nothing and a ton of ill will anyway. That's dumb as hell.
Again, bullshit. There was unauthorized access and the ayybank/BKnet is legal and was always cleared by alex. This type of bullshit you spew is really bad. When did he pretend to be hacked before? You keep saying it but you've never backed it up. You told people it was about terms when Leo has never had that happen.
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Just now, James II said:
You threaten to roll people who aren't hostile. They just want the war to end on your side. You verbatim tell them if they accept any kind of peace, you will roll them. Numerous alliances.
We don't have that many alliances lol. I've already explained our position re:peace. There's just nothing in it for us in it of itself. It's just been you guys want to codify that peace is always good because that suits you along with the short war stuff when it's harmful to us. I mean any group would try to make stuff that benefits them into the common morality, so you guys have done a good job at that but we know that the morals here with regards to in-game stuff are just a representation of the individual interests of each group/alliance.
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1 minute ago, James II said:
and if they don't, you roll them?
If they get hostile yeah.
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13 minutes ago, Akuryo said:
Just an aside here to say Reaper is correct on who came up with the plan. Twas George and myself and it was originally designed to be sued by NP and Demacia. Whether it ever became official in Demacia I don't know, but I had every intention of going rogue with it.
I also find it interesting how the paranoia of Coalition B doesn't take issue with the fact that Camelot's leader and 2IC were two facing them, not only planning to leave the war but actively conspiring and part of the discussion on how to respond to IQ aggression.
Then again I guess IQ prefers the kind of loyalty that comes from burning literally any other bridge they had that wasn't Pappa Row or Mommy Leo. That's fine, we here at North Point are very understanding and never kinkshame ones preferred method of Hegemonic Imperialism.
And Sphinx knew right and he wanted it to happen?
I mean, obviously they took issue with some aspects of your scheming and I know Camelot was upset over Seeker but there was at least an opportunity presented to make things right. At least one alliance offered a way we could do something for them. It's not meant to be a one way street. We're willing to back people up when they've backed us up.
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4 minutes ago, REAP3R said:
I made an edit to the original post that you might want to read. Regardless though, they wanted to keep you out because they didn't want to assist BK if I remember correctly, and it seems like the compromise then was to hit Kerchtogg whales, but considering the flaming that occurred in Syndicate's thread as you might recall, I still don't think you can seriously argue there were underlying good relations. Unless that was feigned just like Surf's Up.
There were underlying good relations. They're old friends. It was just they didn't trust Kayser as much. It was easy for it to all go away with a "Roq manipulated us and have at it".
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6 minutes ago, Buorhann said:
Sure, I am. However, I’m not TCW, TKR, CoA, Carthago, OWR, etc. They all have their own thoughts to the situation.
Those are all really contradictory. Those wanted to go their own way without us and we still have to deal with you. With CoA it's pretty funny, but they would have to actually follow through on rhetoric and they were just too focused on following tS. We've gone over OWR and Carthago before. They didn't want to fight to win, so they bailed and we did criticize Carthago for not trying but we did try to sort it out and we always supplied them when needed. With both OWR and Carthago they never really had positive feelings towards us even before the war, so it was natural they would try to screw us.
With TKR again, their members/gov were pretty openly antagonistic and there was no real way it was going to work out. The town wasn't big enough and there was too much unresolved on both ends and the Chaos signing was seen as pretty aggressive. I"m not really sure what you expected to happen?
9 minutes ago, REAP3R said:Syndicate are also whales last I checked, and they helped you fight the whales in Kerchtogg cause they wanted them to take damage. Dunno how that would insinuate underlying good relations.
Regarding Sphinx, the raiding plan was North Point's contingent in case IQ brought us back into the war over bullshit (which is what happened), and Sphinx only started making moves against you guys when you brought us back in the war over bullshit, among his own set of grievances with your coalition which he already outlined publicly. The original intention was for Sphinx to leave the war separately from coalition B, but you gave him not much choice when you attacked allies defended under our supremacy clause.
They didn't really care. They just didn't want us to help Coalition B so keeping us out was the goal so they set the conditions and they thought it'd be a short excursion and BK would get wiped clean.
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doublepost
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1 minute ago, Buorhann said:
Interesting that you think pissing off the majority of the game’s community is the lesser evil.
I guess at this point it makes sense. I’d have a hard time seeing anyone trust any leadership who follows your perspective.
You're pissed off anyway. You've been pretty clear the entire time with your stances.
You've always said this anyway. You gave us no choice but to reciprocate your negativity. What did you expect?
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Just now, REAP3R said:
Yeah, I mean it's not like we don't have people confirming Sphinx made this plan with Akuryo to set us up by beiging all the whales and the crap George pulled. There's just no words for that.
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3 minutes ago, REAP3R said:
You literally pushed all the whales into one coalition, including your own.
We didn't. They think it's easier that way and most of them talk to each other. It's pretty ridiculous what an old boy's club it is.
They hated Sphinx less than they did us and he saw an opening to get back in their good graces and partner up with as many as possible flip flopping on EM, protecting George, Rose, getting Don Juan to join and the list goes on.
You don't know how cliquey they are.
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8 minutes ago, Don Juan said:
A bad peace? You weren't even obligated to enter, yet you did, confirming IQ hadn't broken up and stuff wasn't as "dynamic" as it was meant to be. This situation is of your own making.
Surf's Up was a legitimate dynamic war... So your "consolidation" rhetoric rings empty too. Do you think it was easy fighting former allies in TKR? No, it was not.
This is funny considering your AA now. It has nothing to do with IQ or whatever besides the fact that we actually have rapport with one side over the other. Coalition B was never going to be able to handle it on their own and was way more fragile than KERTCHOGG. It's a bad peace given we're shouldering the flak given the origination point, so we won't peace with people that made it clear they feel most wronged by us while they retain their structural advantages. That's really not productive. We won't be on the hook and waiting for them to come while your alliance gets off consequence-free.
It wasn't. There was little in terms of political motivation or objectives. It was a 2nd best to doing what happened anyway after. Stop pretending otherwise. It doesn't ring empty given you're even signing Rose most likely. I'm expecting Rose to sign more people too on the same side and it's been rumored for a while.
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3 minutes ago, Prefonteen said:
Gov was hostile. Gov does various hostile maneuveurs that directly and indirectly harm us. You had plenty of chances to work it out with us. You didn't and you frustrated any attempts at mediation.Members were hostile.
No hate?
lol
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Just now, James II said:
They were frustrated with you sure, but they weren't going to hit you, which is your justification for the escalation. You told me yourself that's why you had it escalated.
The justification for the escalation was that relationship with tS coming to an end and it was clear the sphere was no longer viable when they signed Carthago/OWR and that was their powerplay. Their hostility both before and after and actions taken like the TEst protection indicated they would likely indeed fight us when it was opportune. The impression was that it was over as it was already discussed with HS as tS being bad at ending the relationship. We had reasonable suspicion they would convert their passive aggression into active aggression later on.
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Just now, James II said:
No one hates you. You somehow convinced yourself everyone wants to hit you, including your allies and people you had NAPs with.
One often meets their fate on the path they take to avoid it.Um, there's plenty of evidence to the contrary. I don't know anybody that tells their ally "haha i can listen to the voices in my head lke you" or intentionally undermines them constantly. I didn't convince myself. The hostility with tS was palpable.
1 minute ago, Prefonteen said:Do you believe that yourself?
Anyway- you're out here placating james while there's demands of 7 billion on the table. Why are you being two-faced?If he wants to seek a separate negotiation we can work on that. It's on the table as part of the comprehensive settlement.
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Just now, Prefonteen said:
Why did you demand 7 billion from Church of Atom then?
People were upset with James saying in private that he wouldn't hit people and then he went in a contrived fashion. This feels like deja vu, but it would have been negotiated down probably.
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2 minutes ago, James II said:
This is false. You've forced your allies and non allies to fight despite their protests.
I meant on your side.
2 minutes ago, REAP3R said:Just a hunch, but I think you guys might want them to peace out more than they want to peace out.
With Church of Atom yeah, since we didn't want them to get involved. With everyone else not really except like HS/Soup/Farksphere/a few others, there's longstanding hate so it's not really productive.
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1 hour ago, James II said:
I support my allies. And am not under coercion to continue fighting. I will stick by them.
I mean here's the thing James is you jumped into this without any real obligation. We never tried to antagonize you. We just wanted you to sit out. We never said you were ruining the game or anything. We just couldn't stomach getting insulted constantly by tS and having them undermine us militarily. So why won't you just peace separately if you want peace? That's the thing is we haven't prevented alliances from peacing out. The war is no longer about any of the original things so anyone staying in on your side is deciding to stay in for its own sake.
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1 hour ago, Charles the Tyrant said:
Pretty amateurish to believe that military muscle is the tool required to finish this job and get us around to accepting your manner of thinking. Especially considering half of your own starting coalition have rejected such thinking.
It's the fundamental flaw in your alliance's strategy which is based upon numbers and strength alone.
Truth be told, if I was member of NPO or BK, I would be furious with my gov for passing up a sure victory a couple months ago in return for what is essentially an open and growing insurgency. The costs of which NPO's members are being asked to mostly bear since nearly two thirds of guineas are no longer paying taxes and the likes of Camelot , goons and BK along with others on your coalition are being supplied by NPO.
I'm amazed NPO's gov hasn't been couped because you lot sure as hell deserve it for sheer incompetence.
Good thing no one ever listens to you. Not even TGH in this war.
Our starting coalition were mostly micros and other weak alliances that would have been happy if we won on day one and that's it. We were never going to be able to appease most of those alliances. They wanted it too fast.
No one cares about that. A bad peace is worse than war - Tacitus. People that are tough enough to handle fighting the reconsolidated EMC should be funded.
Again this would have been a million times worse if we let these people pull this crap months from now. That's why it's the lesser evil to have it happen now. There has been no potential for anything else to happen because they've solidified and with Sphinx's powerplay where apparently he was going to have the whales beiged anyway acccording to new intel just shows the level of duplicity these guys are up to which makes us look relatively angelic. So we have no real incentives here. The whole playing possum aspect was a good trick that pulled the wool over people's eyes and at this point third parties may eventually see that it's just mutual hatred playing out and if they have no investment in it, then why pay attention?
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10 minutes ago, Menhera said:
Well we are the ones currently fighting a bunch of backstabbers that have killed multiple games before...
So i guess you are the wrong person to say something like that
You have an equal number of backstabbers. Guess it's just convenient.
Virtue is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.
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33 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:
Or you know this opens the door to making new allies post war. Dragging this thing out, has unified everyone else against your corner of the world, because you have proven you are the biggest threat to every other alliance's sovereignty. Because of this I dont see how dragging this out isn't also suicidal.
Also as to be on topic, people stop being dicks and purposely going outside of game rules to stick it to others.
Not really. I think you don't particularly get the reasons why people dropped out, They dropped out because it was too hard to keep going. No one has been under threat that didn't do something in some way. You can pretend everyone is getting violated sovereignty-wise, but you literally are condoning multiple bank heists with your side's embrace of Gorge, all the shady stuff Akuryo has been involved in, Sphinx/Alexio wanting to bankrupt Chaos, embrace of deserters, and so on. It's more suicidal to be at peace with people who has made their agenda clear. The fact that nothing matters to your side besides just hate of a few alliances means you will always be blinded to anything else.
27 minutes ago, Hodor said:Bruh. Before all these new entries, our block was beaten blue and down to less than 400 members, half of those being in TKR and t$/enterprise. Between you, BK, and GOONS, you've got 400, not to mention the 1k in GPWC and assorted 250+ that have stayed with you for the longest war in Orbis history.
The battle for the neutrals was anyone's game once this war was over, but y'all shot yourselves in the foot at every turn, not only losing the neutrals, but also allies.
Again this is why we don't think your side is ever honest, you're using nation counts just like at the start of the war. If you were really downtrodden, there'd be no hope no matter what the intervention this late in. You made it out to be like the alliances were beyond repair, and so on. Like I said you staged a passion play. Where your nations are tiering-wise is the most important factor. You've always used this justification to mess with us/BK/etc.
We can't retain "allies' that want to play on easy mode. It just never works and in every war that was shorter we've always lost the weak-willed. Stop pretending otherwise.
So yeah after the North Point crap you guys are pulling, it's at the point of no return. You're playing a game of chicken and expecting us to blink and it's not going to happen.
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3 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said:
Well I have seen the screen shots and such that's been sent to Alex, The truth is I stand correct on the fact it was not a dummy account used, Gorge used his own BKnet account that had amounts already in there, Also screen shots of BK members who left sometime ago who still have rrs and cash in their BKnet account, so it seems to me that Leo and BK just failed on removing Gorge account. Now if this is the case and from what I have seen it seems so, then those resources and such belong to gorge according to the BKnet.
But this covers the banking that we all know Gorge abused BKnet, no proof of any kind have been offered or supported that Gorge logged in to Leos account and kicked people, this for me is a whole new issue, as that is clearly hacking and whoever did that should be banned for life.How can one forget such levels, Roquentin has called me Hitler countless times in the Col B high gov chat, and also supported the actions of forcing me to quit for good, no matter how much someone over steps the mark its wrong to call someone Hitler and its wrong to force people to quit. (Roq do not ask me to post screen shots, we both know you did and I do not have time to go over it again)
So he did go into it with unauthorized access. I'm not sure iwhether there was a way for him to see admin stuff and get Leo's pass though. That's the question.
I didn't say you were Hitler.
I said that you were everything wrong with the game since you kept wanting to bail to just play farmville and no one believed the 50b or whatever was yours. They're just flattering you now when they don't really like your playstyle either. Feel free to find the logs. Keshav was mad when you broke the deal yeah, but he had even agreed to the NAP.
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Yeah sorry. Maybe the topic can be split?
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1 minute ago, namukara said:
Prior to your attacks on TMC there was next to no reason for Farksphere to enter the war.
The fact that you still attacked TMC, despite it being plainly evident that they had a treaty with Fark, and that Farksphere honours its treaties, is proof positive that you had a desire to bring us into the war. This being the case I cannot accept that OD attacks on allies of TCW, who they knew TCW had an obligation to defend, were not intended to bring TCW into the war.
I am not fighting you because I hate you. There are NPO members I regularly chat to, I know people in your alliance from other places it exists. I am fighting you because whatever respect I have for the NPO, I have far more love for a game I have invested time and money into playing. The fact that the NPO has, for the duration of its history across multiple games, failed to realise that these sorts of activities only persist while there is an effective opposition to one group is not the fault of those fighting it. The fact that we realise that our communities are more important than our pixels is also not our fault, however it is the reason I will not stop fighting until OD's attempts to crush any meaningful alliances which could present any threat to them ends.
Peace is in your interest. If you go for it, the game survives and so do you. If you don't go for it, the game dies or you do. I see, however that you've made your decision. Enjoy the battlefield, I'm still smiling.
Rant ends
We didn't intend to draw it in. The NAP didn't cover TMC in our eyes as TMC was not signed before that and TMC was the aggressor. They were on bad terms with Fark wehn the NAP was done and started the BoC thing.
Okay let me break it down to you: we were never going to eliminate effective opposition. By giving an easy peace that allows enemies to consolidate and build on their structural advantages, it was simply suicidal. Whenever they eventually reached a settlement, they would still be in good shape and have tons going for them. The rhetoric from their side has indicated their long-term intent and thus we have no reason to make it easy for them. They hate us and we are reciprocrating the sentiments. They did a passion play and made themselves out to be completely crushed forever when it was never the case. They are in decent condition no matter how long it goes or they wouldn't have the energy for this. This would have just happened some period after a peace deal, so it would have been entirely stacked in their favor. Some people have been more upfront in acknowledging that.
Again, it's not. Peacing in this situation when they're doing this stuff just means it's even more slanted in their favor going forward. If they resorted to gimmicks to try to win, then they're going to have to deal with the outcome there. We derive no benefit from entrenching their dominance and letting them get something they want.
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1 minute ago, kalev60 said:
And you could have easily not escalated things in the first place by not attacking our allies.
Um they started it and when they were countered the plans they had leaked.
12 minutes ago, REAP3R said:So you're trolling?
He was trolling. I didn't say it wouldn't be endless. The continued use of the gimmick is why we have no real reason to peace along with the other reasons. Someone is playing with a loaded die and peace is what they want. We don't have any incentive for peace until we actually get one. If people are using the friendly wars to their advantage, why would we accept that? It's entirely slanted in your favor. We just derive no benefit from peace so it's not going to work for people employing the gimmick.
Unacceptable Behavior
in Orbis Central
Posted · Edited by Roquentin
Well I can show you the logs, but they were told. It was a misunderstanding about what you were asking about.
TheNG and Leo can confirm.
I just want to know the specific incident where Leo claimed to be hacked before. What is even the context here? You've never brought it up before. Nice troll.
Okay, so one side has a majority of the stuff going into a war, they get put on an infra diet. They don't want to be on an infra diet so they can get back to building on the advantage. They typically don't like fighting intensively with the highest infra nations for a long duration. They collaborate more often than not. The previous war was possible due to Rose, CoS, TEst, and some arrgh upper tier and most ended up being aligned with KETOG or swappable between KETOG and Rose. KETOG also included the two big upper tier juggernauts. With CoS on its last legs and TEst a thing of the past, there was no one left who had fought the whales in Knightfall outside of KERTCHOGG, so it would essentially be an upper tier hegemony. In this war we had TCW to substitute a bit but that's only because we fought KERTCHOGG first and then tS. Since I knew tS had no intention of fighting KERTCHOGG and wanted to hit our side instead at a later date, it was essentially a stacked deck and it would continue to be a stacked deck as a unified whole that just always gets to have vast amounts of infra and only fights people not in the upper tier or vastly outnumbered.
You get to go back to your beloved infra pumping and we get to wait for you to make your move. Zero benefit. Get it now? The only way there's any benefit for us if we get something in the peace deal because we know there's ill will and we're the primary recipients. We don't really mind fighting indefinitely, so peace has to be incentivized for us not to be signing a a carte blanche to further entrench your structural advantages when it will screw us to do so. This becomes an even bigger issue with TCW on your side. We derive zero benefit and you institute your own megabloc. You are the only actual people who have consolidated so much in the past to completely outgun the rest of the game, so we know what you're like. The negativity throughout the war has provided us with no incentive to just hand you the keys to the city. We're fine with everyone within the non-expansion burning together since we all have issues with each other so it works for us.