IRON

Unfortunately, you are unable to even understand a simple sentence or even do a simple search. Till 330 BC, it does not begin from 330 BC. Check the content of first chapter "6- The Prehistoric Beginnings of Civilization", other sections are also about pre-history as well in chapter one.

Content of the first chapter, "The Establishment of Civilization" in volume 1: 1- The Conditions of Civilization 2- The Economic Elements of Civilization 3- The Political Elements of Civilization 4- The Moral Elements of Civilization 5- The Mental Elements of Civilization 6- The Prehistoric Beginnings of Civilization The first 5 sections are also mainly about primitive tribes and pre-history.

Actually, north Korea does not have even a single Coronavirus case officially, but do you really can trust the reports coming from countries which news are censored systemically (China, Vietnam and north Korea)? Countries like Singapore or Taiwan are better examples for how to handle Covid19. Usually, fascist states act economically good, you can refer to the Spanish economic miracle during Franco's reign or high economy growth during Pinochet's Chile, Salazar's Portugal, Suharto's Indonesia and some similar right-wing authoritarian regimes. If the economy of Germany before WW2 wasn't efficient, after the defeat in WW1, hyperinflation and great depression, how could it handle a world war with many great powers and have a upper hand till 1942?

The chapter one:The Establishment of Civilization in the first volume of The Story of Civilization, is mainly about pre-history. Check it out before you make a troll out of yourself. The other book was cited for the other stuff that I said about communism.

You are deeply mislead, fascism is based on nation, a nation can be consisted of different ethnic groups. Also, there were no systematic antisemitism in Francoist Spain. Moorish communists?? There were no moors in Spain since their prosecution after Reconquista. You are just making a baseless story all by yourself Communism doesn't have "structural violence"? It wants to violently destroy many aspects of a civilization. Communism created Millions of victims. Why are you not opposed to communism? Communism is a joke for you? If you can tolerate Communism, then tolerate fascism as well.

Having fascist alliances is legal in this game. It is not for somebody like you to decide where should I go. If my presence bothers you, you can get out of this game. Also, read my previous posts about dictatorship of proletariat, elimination of classes, communism views about religion, forcible acquisition of bourgeoisie's wealth. All of these are done forcefully and violently in a communist country.

Some people called me a troll in this thread, look who really is a classic troll. I cited "The Story of Civilization by Will Durant" and "The End of the Cold War by David Pietrusza". You didn't even try to read my posts (I know it is hard for you to read long texts), so I'm quite sure you have never heard of these books.

No, I was just giving some information about your love, Japan. Was my information incorrect?

Big brother, using personal attacks and calling me fool, troll, hypocrite and etc just shows that due to your lack of dialectical ability, you are getting angry. A civilization has some important aspects like government, hierarchy, trading, money, justice system, security forces and etc. Communism wants to destroy all of it, so what remains is pretty much something like a pre-history tribe. Believe it or not every political or economic process has a beginning and until it reaches the current form, it needs to take a long road. Capitalism as an infant began when the ownership began, like pre-historic hunter societies, some pre-historic agricultural societies shared all of their agricultural products in the beginning, they shared everything equally regardless of how much a person worked on the farm, but again since this proto-communism rewards lazy people, they decided it is more efficient that families own their products. Long before Plato, coinage, trading system, merchants were present. It really shows your ignorance if you think private property began around 400-300BC, long before that in ancient Egypt in big cities there were many rich people who lived in their palaces, poor people lived in their farms, some of their farms were under rent of government, some other farmers owned their farms. I just checked and it seems you wikipedia'd "private property" and reached to the conclusion that private property was invented by Plato!!! It is written like this in your beloved wikipedia, "Ideas about and discussion of private property date back at least as far as Plato". It means philosophical aspects of private ownership were discussed by Plato. I know you only like to read short sentences, but please at least read it properly. Long before Plato, people owned houses, palaces, farms and other stuff in civilizations like China, Egypt, Assyria, India, Babylon, Achaemenid Persia and others. Well, you only cite information from wikipedia, since you don't like to read long books. So, the existence of books in the internet does not help you. You just want to find some information (preferably in short sentences) in the internet as fast as possible to counter my points. As I said before, the development of capitalism began by ownership, it does not mean the current form of capitalism created by the hands of pre-history people. Please read my responds correctly, I know you don't like long sentences, but you may learn one or two things from my posts. Now this is a really important sentence. As I said before, Communism wants to destroy the civilization, so it is completely normal for a communist to think that "the story of civilization by Will Durant" is just useful for toilet paper. Thank you for showing that I am telling the truth. If my definition of Christians is irrelevant, can a christian not believe in Jesus? These non-Marxist communist are some irrelevant and experimental political thoughts that suggested by some random dudes with minor effect on politics. If you insist to take them into consideration, they are some sort of anarchists. Well your non-Marxist communists and anarchists still wants to destroy government, monetary system, police forces, judicial system and etc. Therefore, they want to destroy the civilization. They also want the forcible acquisition of wealth which is done by using force. They also want to impose their atheistic and materialistic views on the people. So, they are not very different than Marxists. Both ideologies wan total political control, but As I said before, fascists don't care about your religion, wealth, while communists want control over your beliefs and money. Communist dress code is different in every communist country, some like north Korea or Maoist china or Khmer rouge had a really strict dress code, others just wanted you does not look like a bourgeoisie person (fancy dress and lux stuff). In practice we have seen the soviet union that was created by Lenin (and other communist countries by Marx and others' ideology) what have done in practice. Also, if you want to learn the truth about anything, you need study its supporters and opponents's views. For communism you just read the communist books (if you read them actually) but not their opponents. That is way you are dogmatic about communism. About your third paragraph, if you really think the Maoist china and current china both had the same capitalist mode of production, then you are clearly ignorant. Actually Mao tried his best in Great Leap Forward to create a socialistic mode of production but it lead to death of millions. Communist states tried their best to have a socialistic mode of production, but it never worked, so they had to retain some capitalistic aspects. Even if what you said in this paragraph is true, then why they couldn't achieve a socialistic mode of production? Isn't it because it is impossible and only will lead to famine and chaos? In comparison to communism there is more individuality in fascism. Refer to stuff I said about religion and wealth. You don't read my posts correctly. The nationalism in Khmer rouge is like socialism in Nazism. If Khmer rouge is a nationalistic group, then Nazism is also socialist. Also, the use of communists by foreign powers is not something new, Lenin and other comrades, came to Russia by using German money and train in 1917. Supposedly Khmer rouge got support from USA, does not prove that they are not communists. You are just saying just because they got money form US, they are not communist. It is false. They got closer to your communist heaven more than anybody else. Their good rival is Maoist china. There is no "communists that reject authority in favor of liberty", maybe you are talking about social democrats. A communist needs authority to run his plans. A nationalist prefers his own countrymen (which can be consisted of various ethnic groups) over foreigners. That does mean putting priority on your own people. It is not related to the race, Both ideologies kill their opponents, but the economy of fascist or right-wing states is better than communist countries. The fascist states also do not care about people's religious beliefs or wealth. Everything bad in fascism is worse in a communist country. As I said I know the communist's dream is something like a primitive tribe. In your recent post, the stuff you said about Plato, Will Durant and Khmer rouge was really bad and embarrassing. Also, the communist countries only going to remain in their dictatorship of proletariat phase, creating their heaven is not possible unless you return to pre-history. My whole point here was that communism is worse than fascism. I am comparing these two. That doesn't mean fascist states were the best places on the earth. Usually these fascist states were created (by army or by popular support) for confronting the red threat, usually after a while they get softer and transfer the power to civilians. Communism does not give up the power unless they are faced by a bloody revolution or a total economic collapse. Refer to my points regarding the dictatorship of proletariat, elimination of classes, communism views about religion, wealth and other stuff in comparison of fascism and communism. Please try to put more pressure on yourself and do not make a conclusion just based on reading two sentences in a dictionary.

The root of capitalism is the ownership which began in hunter societies, what they had was the most primitive form of capitalism, the capitalism was a quite little infant baby then. As I said before, Will Durant in his book describes that this how capitalism began, the ownership is the core of capitalism. I also think he is right. What you are describing in your second paragraph is an early form of government, not related to capitalism. I just wanted to find an alliance who is symbolically fascist. there is no need for the government form of alliance necessary be fascist. As I provided a link in the first post, the game creator believes that fascism can be in the game.

Maybe Dics and Idems want to help a fellow citizen.

Look, as a newbie my intention was not to start a political debate as soon as I arrived here, I just asked an honest question. Instead of answering the question, some people stated a debate, it is not like I am afraid of political discussions as you can see, but my intention for starting this thread was different. Also, some people think that whichever role you chose in a game is exactly the role you have in real life, this is clearly wrong because they don't understand a game and roleplaying, for more information you can refer to the first page and stuff I said about GTA. The situation that pre-historic tribes had are pretty much all things that communists want. While communism claims that it is progressive, it is actually very reactionary, it wants to destroy many of human achievements like government, justice systems, banks and etc. You can say communism is against civilization and wants to return to pre-history societies. It is clear that you unfortunately didn't understand or properly read my previous post, so I am going to repeat it. We have a tribe here, all of them hunters, whenever somebody hunts they split it among all tribe members, this is the beginning situation for all pre-history tribes. Like any society, there are some lazy people in this tribe, they don't hunt (or hunt less) but still other people split their game with them. After a while the guys who hunt ask themselves why we should hunt when others are willing to split their game with us? It is better to let others hunt for me, so the number of active hunters is going to decrease while the number of lazy people are increased. So, there is no enough hunters in the tribe and there going to be a famine. Then all tribe members gather together to find a solution, what is their solution? Everybody hunt for themselves and keep the game for his family, there is no need for sharing. They are still a pre-historic tribe but people own their preys. In this way everybody had to hunt for themselves. This owning stuff is going to spread to other stuffs like spears and etc. The pre-historic tribe reached to the conclusion that not sharing the preys is the solution for the aforementioned problem, I never said tribes are lazy. Owing stuff was their idea. Now capitalism is based on the ownership, when the ownership began the capitalism also began. A hunter who hunts more is going to have a better life than the neighboring lazy hunter. Because the active hunter has more preys, he can exchange them for better equipment, so he has better life, better equipment, therefore the inequality began. Now, when the active hunter dies, his children has a better start then the lazy man's family, therefore the gap between them can be widened after a while, so we are going to have different classes, one poor one rich. It is primitive in nature, but the situation is quite close to what we have in a capitalistic country. The tribe had proto-communism and then proto-capitalism. Marx also got some inspirations from this proto-communist tribes. Now, what is the source for the stuff that I said? Unlike you who apparently get all of the information from the internet, I sometimes read books. The book who described this development of tribes is "The Story of Civilization by Will Durant, the first volume:Our Oriental Heritage, chapter one:The Establishment of Civilization". How capitalism is began and how was the primitive-communism is all described there. This is not some stuff that I invented myself, your lack of information about them just makes you the ignorant one here. A communist who does not believe in Karl Marx, is like a christian who does not believe in Jesus. You can consider these non-Marxist communists as a bunch of anarchists. They also never took power in any country, so they are irrelevant. As I said before, the the dictatorship of the proletariat and the elimination of classes (and also eliminating religious beliefs) are some indications that communism is quite authoritarian and essentially evil. Communism wants total control of every aspect of a human life, it wants to impose its atheistic and materialistic views on everybody, it has even a dress code. If you are a rich people, then communists in the name equality will come to your doors and violently ask for all of your wealth that you and your previous generations made by hard working and then maybe shoot you. Fascism does not care about your religious beliefs or how you dress or your wealth, therefore clearly communism is more totalitarian than fascism. Communism creates equality by making all people poor (of course their leaders have quite a luxury life like Ceausescu). While in a capitalist nation, the middle and rich classes have a good situation. Fascism is based on the observation of human history (and even nature) that if you don't get strong, others will smash you. It is a bitter truth. While communism is just based on the fantasies that never going to work. Communism does not reward efficiency, therefore it is bound to fail. Since in a communist state, people does not get fired for inefficiency, the system is inefficient and it is eventually going to fail. Refer to "The End of the Cold War by David Pietrusza" for more information about how this inefficiency led to the Fall of Communism. You always accusing me of lying, but you are the one that denying obvious facts, the official party of Khmer rouge was "communist party of Kampuchea", it tells you everything about them. Khmer rouge also had support from other communist states like china. They actually got closer to the communist "heaven" than any other communist states, because the eventual goal of communism is to destroy civilization. This is why Khmer rouge is described as the purest form of Marxism (and communism). Communism is built on the destruction of the individual in favor of the society. As I mentioned before, there is lot more individuality in fascism in comparison to communism. A nation can be created from different ethnic groups, fascism concentrates on the nation, while the basis of Nazism is on race. The lack of anti-Semitic behavior in fascist countries that I mentioned shows that they considered Jews their own countrymen. I give you several examples of fascist states that weren't racist, so it clearly shows that fascism is not essentially racist. So a communist can criticize fascism for being authoritarian and he is not hypocrite but the other way around is not correct? I think you are the one that embarrasses himself more than anybody by stating falsehoods. Your post is full of misinformation, as I said to big brother, in a communist state, you don't have religious freedoms, you cannot accumulate wealth, you even have a dress code, so clearly communism is more extreme. Btw, Fascist states began in 1920's not 1930's, also as I said before economically communist states were all failures, while fascist states have a much better score in economy (for example refer to the Spanish economic miracle during Franco's reign). I gave some examples of non-racist fascist states and I repeat again the fascism bases itself on the nation not the race (unlike nazism). Your notion that fascism comes from socialism is also clearly false, others addressed that well enough.

Thank you very much for your kindness and advice. I just wanted to play in a fascist alliance for roleplaying reasons, since this game is about politics I assumed some fascist alliances might be here as well. But others took things very seriously, they don't understand that they are playing in a game.

As I said before, in my personal opinion both communism and fascism should be part of the game. The game creator thinks like that, too. Actually, those pre-history primitive tribes had what communists strive to be. A hunter always split all of its game among other tribesmen and there were no class, no inequality no state no justice system, but since this system rewards lazy people, after a while nobody hunts and they expect others to do it. Therefore, everybody became hungry, then they reached to the conclusion that every hunter should keep its game to himself, therefore the capitalism began. This problem also exists in communist countries, the communist system does not reward efficiency, therefore it is not stable and bounds to fail. Communists and Anarchists both have the same final goal, communists believe in order to reach this final "heaven", the dictatorship of the proletariat is necessary, anarchists don't want any medium and want to go to this stateless situation immediately. The guy before stated that the theory of communism is not evil and only the leaders were evil, so I responded to that and stated communism is essentially evil. I didn't defend fascism. But I think I can safely say that fascism acts much better than communism economically. Also the elimination of classes in the best case scenario is done by forcible acquisition of bourgeois wealth and in the worst case by physical elimination of Bourgeoisie. Communists usually prefer the physical elimination, some communists (like Khmer rouge) even wanted to destroy cities and their inhabitants. Now I don't even want to talk about their enmity toward historical monuments. Racism is not limited to some nationalistic ideologies. In soviet union, communists ethnic cleansed Tatars, Chechens and others. The Yugoslavian partisans ethnic cleansed Italians after WW2. The Khmer rouge committed genocide against many minorities in Cambodia. Even nowadays, Communists in China have put millions of Uyghurs inside camps in order to make them become "more Chinese". Thinking non-Europeans are inferior to Europeans is not related to fascism (btw I am not even European), it is very older than fascism, even democracies like France and UK believed that. Belgium was a democracy but they had human zoo, they even made very horrific crimes against Congolese people. USA have a long record of racism, but it was never a fascist state. The states that I mentioned (Francoist Spain, Pinochet's Chile, Salazar's Portugal) were not systemically racist states. Their behavior toward Jews can prove that.

Fascism is legitimate in the game. Communists hide their crimes under the disguise of beautiful words, the words and actions of fascists are the same. There have been dozens of different communist countries across the world, all of them were failures and full of crimes against humanity. Also, communists believe in the dictatorship of the proletariat and elimination of other classes, it is beyond me how these beliefs are not evil in your book. Fascism is not racist (francoist Spain, Pinochet's Chile, Salazar's Portugal), Nazism is racist.

Actually, you have a really good alliance, tax is also very very important for me, I don't have anything against freedom of speech, I might come to your alliance after I paid my debt, if you accept me.

https://politicsandwar.com/nation/id=230974 Check his trade list, he has at least 5 accounts.

No, I was just saying that you are a perfect fit for my future alliance.😌

You know Japanese that you love their manga and anime so much are overtly nationalist. Most of their prime ministers visit the Yasukuni temple regularly. They also deny the Nanking massacre.

You are really logical, I wish others had your sensibility too, things that you said are correct. I don't say that fascism is good, but this ideology is an important part of politics and it should be in a political game, it also adds flavor to the game.

Don't have the money.

I am not saying communists shouldn't be here, but since people tolerate communist alliances they should also tolerate fascist alliances too. It adds flavor to the game. It is not even against the game rules, but some people freak out.

I have a question too, why do you tolerate any kind of authoritarian theme but fascism? Even right now people are suffering because of communism in China. You cannot tell me what to do or not do. According to the game developer we can have fascist alliances. If you don't like that, you can just leave. Nazism is not tolerated in this game, so how can they normalize Nazism? You can say these stuff about communists too, that they are normalizing the crimes of Stalin and Mao and Pol pot and others. But you are just happy with them for unknown reasons. As I said, having fascist alliances adds flavor to the game. About Mussolini, the large parts of horrific aspects of anti-Semitism of Nazi Germany only became known after or near the end of WW2. Even Henry Ford and Charles Lindbergh worked with Nazis.

Cybernations once had lots of players, but now it is dying. Perhaps the number of alliances belongs to its golden age. It is a game. Do you also say to pirates in the game "Are we going to do the 16th century over again? ". Also if it is about fascism you should have said "1920's".

Your logic is a little bit too much meme-centric, but still it is the strongest one so far. But pirates also have an alliance here, are there lots of memes about pirates? Also, there are lots of fascist alliances in Nationstates or in Cybernations.