9/1/2015 - What's Going On

[Wiccan High Priest]

I am fine with the rollback (by fine I mean pissed off that it's hurt my alliance but accepting the necessity)

 

However:

 

1. There needs to be more professionalism. When we donate all those credits to "support the game" we expect that money to be spent on game development, including professional security and so on, not just on "wages" or upkeep. And yes Mensa have invested a great deal but by "we" I mean all players.

 

2. The message in OP was poorly thought out to the point of being rude. "try better second time round" or whatever sounded like it was supporting the VE side of the war. I'm sure this wasn't the intention but it sounded like he was giving them a second chance. The mention about credits now being available was incredibly poor and made me absolutely certain I'll not be buying credits ever again.

 

3. People who are saying Mensa should leave if we don't like it obviously don't understand how games like this work. I'd like to see P&W with a hundred thousand active players and a dedicated admin team with an office. Telling a group that is actively bringing money and activity to the game to !@#$ off is so counterproductive and good customer service isn't a "take it or leave it" situation, it involves working proactively with all of your customers.

 

In any case I hope Sheepy will discuss this further with the Mensa leaership

 

 

discuss it with Mensa leadership? your one alliance in a line of alliances, this did not effect just one alliance or nation, it effected them all. not one alliance or nation in the game was spared the loss of time, money, growth.

 

this is not the first or will be the last start up game with things like this happaning, Cybernations, Trukz, Civiny, Eve all of them had hacking issues when they first started out.

[Kyubnyan]

I vote we rename this the !@#$%ing thread where we all talk about how annoyed we are. But srsly this is a game and problems happen, so if everyone would stop complaining that would be great.(ಠ_ಠ)

Edited September 1, 2015 by Kyubey

[Wayne]

It's very much a business.

 

Although I agree with the general point of not offering return on donations purchases.

Can we all start calling them what they are?

Edited September 1, 2015 by Wayne

[Wiccan High Priest]

TY Grammer Nazi, I thank you for the corrections.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Wiccan High Priest

[PigInZen]

Hey 'tards, stop bickering over bullshit.  The larger issue is whether or not there have been sufficient changes made to the game architecture to ensure that any future exploits using this vector are prevented.  Rolling back MAY or MAY NOT assist with this overall goal but is probably not sufficient in and of itself in preventing further use of the exploits related to the current vector.

 

Granted, this is all very assumptive on my behalf.  

 

BTW, I think anyone annoyed by the rollback is entirely within their rights to be.  Doubly so if donations were made.  Those arguing that others should not have emotional or logical outrage are misguided, regardless of who "benefits" from any rollback. 

[Kyubnyan]

Hey 'tards, stop bickering over !@#$.  The larger issue is whether or not there have been sufficient changes made to the game architecture to ensure that any future exploits using this vector are prevented.  Rolling back MAY or MAY NOT assist with this overall goal but is probably not sufficient in and of itself in preventing further use of the exploits related to the current vector.

 

Granted, this is all very assumptive on my behalf.  

 

BTW, I think anyone annoyed by the rollback is entirely within their rights to be.  Doubly so if donations were made.  Those arguing that others should not have emotional or logical outrage are misguided, regardless of who "benefits" from any rollback. 

At least some Mensa members are not !@#$%ing because of malicious hacking attempts against Sheepy (That are not his fault).

Edited September 1, 2015 by Kyubey

[Aisha Greyjoy]

Is anyone considering the last backup was done 5 days ago? Or are we just assuming the admin can back the game up to whatever second he wants?

IT backups typically happen once a day at a set time.  Cheaper IT shops will do weekly backups.

 

More frequent then daily backups are a pain, because any problem you have gets into your backups rather quickly.  Backups also eat a significant chunk of CPU, unless you're cloning SAN LUNS, in which case its 0 overhead.

[martiy]

This is the best game ever!!!!

[PigInZen]

At least some Mensa members are not !@#$%ing because of malicious hacking attempts against Sheepy (That are not his fault).

 

Actually, security is 100% the application owner's responsibility.  I'm not keen to blame a target but tighter security is probably a good idea consider he's accepting payment for services. 

 

IT backups typically happen once a day at a set time.  Cheaper IT shops will do weekly backups.

 

More frequent then daily backups are a pain, because any problem you have gets into your backups rather quickly.  Backups also eat a significant chunk of CPU, unless you're cloning SAN LUNS, in which case its 0 overhead.

 

This doesn't even begin to discuss backup strategies such as incremental hourlies, full nightlies, etc.

[Oblige]

So let's review:

 

1.) Game got hacked (bad)

2.) Backups were not as regular as they should've been (also bad)

3.) Game has to be rolled back (good news for some, bad news for others)

 

---

 

@ the people shitting all over at Sheepy, he stated in the OP that he is a.) in the middle of a move and b.) on a god damn boat with limited internet and wireless. So that means he is also i.) doing everything over a shitty cellular or satellite connection ii.) has limited access to electricity and power. "Being in America" does not mean universal wireless internet everywhere, especially in the middle of a lake. 

 

Given that this game is basically developed in house by a single individual with some part time assistance, it's pretty clear he's handling this as well as he is able to under the circumstances.

 

To put even the smallest amount of this into perspective- how many of you have stayed up till 4:30 in the morning for your jobs?

 

--- 

 

PiZ is very correct in that a huge portion of the long term longevity of the game will hinge on how well Sheepy responds to his incident and improves the game in such a way that improves its overall security. So far it looks like he's started utilizing CloudFlare for some of their security services, which is a good start, and apparently moved servers as well. Both of these changes represent a considerable investment of resources. 

 

---

 

If Mensa is very concerned about the implications of the rollback on their war effort they should pursue a different track, and ask for the game to be pushed back before the war started. Once that's been done they can simply repeat the actions that led us to where we are right now. Everyone starts again on even footing.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Oblige

[Spite]

discuss it with Mensa leadership? your one alliance in a line of alliances, this did not effect just one alliance or nation, it effected them all. not one alliance or nation in the game was spared the loss of time, money, growth.

 

this is not the first or will be the last start up game with things like this happaning, Cybernations, Trukz, Civiny, Eve all of them had hacking issues when they first started out.

 

1. Mensa is a significant proportion of both the game community and the paying membership so yes the guy who relies on donations for income should provide customer service directly to our senior reps.

 

2. "Other games are shit" is not an excuse for this one being shit

 

3. I agree that other alliances have a reason to be angry (well, some of them) but that's for their members to deal with. I can only represent my group interests.

[martiy]

I agree with Oblige

 

I'm honestly a bit surprised at the people shitting on Sheepy, asking him why he didn't do one of ten things that they have suddenly become 'experts' about even though half of them have never written a line of code in their life. Or hosted a website for that matter.

 

 

You're looking at a highschool coder living on a boat with limited internet/electricity, that still managed to respond to the VE hack within the hour, take the game offline, and begin working on it till 5AM and managed to get another programmer on board and also move the game to a whole new server to ensure smoother and more secure running in the future.

 

And if you have EVER coded anything or hosted a website you will know what he's done in the past 24 hours is impressive.

 

 

I don't know about you, but given the circumstances I think that's fairly impressive and I am happy to have someone like SHeepy run this game.

Edited September 1, 2015 by martiy

[Pfeiffer]

To put even the smallest amount of this into perspective- how many of you have stayed up till 4:30 in the morning for your jobs?

 

There was a month in 2010 where I slept about 3 hours a day during a final campaign push. That's just what people do, especially when you own the shop.

 

Replying only to this because it !@#$ing annoyed me. I really am over the rollback. Everyone knows it's bullshit, but it's what we have to work with at this point.

[Saruman]

Can I have a refund on my credits instead? When I bought them things were entirely different and the goalposts haven't just been moved slightly, they've been completely relocated.

 

This has been very poorly managed. You're supposed to be running a professional business but you can't access the internet because you're on a boat. You're in 21st century America FFS.

 

Every major decision or change seems to screw Mensa over whether intentionally or not. First many of our opponents were getting masses of exploit money which was by no means resolved to the communities satisfaction. Then the spy system was nerfed because we were doing too well with it. Now when we're winning what is probably the biggest war in the games history, you've decided to undo a large, key proportion of it. If you want to earn $1000 less per month, you're going the right way about it.

 

I don't have time right now to watch for when the game comes back online and try to redo everything that had been achieved at great effort, even if it was possible, which it isn't because our opponents now know our every move. It will probably go live in the wrong timezone for me too.

 

It's sad that others want to win like this

 

 

This is how games die. Mensa have made a big contribution to growing this game, especially the active community. We're now being taken for granted and are having a very real discussion about whether it's worth continuing (cue cheers from opposing inferior alliances).

 

This isn't just about Mensa though. It's a poor way to run a game all around and I'm surprised at the attitude of some thinking that there are positives in this no matter what side they are on.

 

So yeah, refund please. Rant over.

The only thing Mensa has done for this community is make it seem like it's normal to whine every time you get the opportunity. Nobody's making you stay, nobody will cry if you leave.

 

Edit: Ok, it was a little unfair to say that Mensa hasn't contributed to the game, but still, they haven't been the most important alliance ever.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Saruman

[General Peterson]

Who's getting banned?

[LordRahl2]

To put even the smallest amount of this into perspective- how many of you have stayed up till 4:30 in the morning for your jobs?

 

Really Oblige?  To answer your question, silly as it is, about once a week.  I have had multiple year long + stretches where I am easily putting in 100-110 hours every week.  How about you Oblige?

 

If Mensa is very concerned about the implications of the rollback on their war effort they should pursue a different track, and ask for the game to be pushed back before the war started. Once that's been done they can simply repeat the actions that led us to where we are right now. Everyone starts again on even footing.

 

Sounds good, why don't we do this?

[LordRahl2]

The only thing Mensa has done for this community is make it seem like it's normal to whine every time you get the opportunity. Nobody's making you stay, nobody will cry if you leave.

 

bahahahahahahahaha

 

kek/10

[Sam Hyde]

I propose taking a massive chill pill, take a 2-day collective peace period to get ourselves back in balance, and we continue slugging at each other afterwards.

 

Once we get out of the stall period and get back in the game, we'll be experiencing a bit of a shock, and I think it'd be for the best to chill for a bit. No, really.

[PigInZen]

How about people stop referring to MENSA and start referring to INDIVIDUALS.

 

Jesus H the proclivity of posters here to draw generalizations about groups of people is annoying.

[Ayayay]

How about people stop referring to MENSA and start referring to INDIVIDUALS.

 

Jesus H the proclivity of posters here to draw generalizations about groups of people is annoying.

Welcome to Earth, would you like the guided tour?

[Prefonteen]

This hacking is very unfortunate, and I am sorry to see that this has happened, as well as sorry that Sheepy has  been forced to put this much work into it. It sucks to have malicious players attempt to take a crack at the game you have so long tried to build. I do understand this, and wish the best of luck recovering things.

 

With that said, Politics and War is very much a business. It derives revenue from advertisements and offers a free to play gaming experience with available in-game purchases. The moment a business or organization begins monetarising its product (especially at a B2C level), said business takes on a (social) responsibility to its customers. As of right now, it looks like we have been playing (and paying for) a faulty product.

 

Risk mitigation is a key component in the daily functioning of any business. As I understand, it was longer apparent that there was still an imminent risk of hackings. Various actions could have been undertaken to mitigate this risk, or at least reduce the potential impact:

 

- A specialist could have been brought into the fold earier (as has been done now, after the fact)

- The server could have been upgraded to allow for daily backups

- As I understand, the security of the database has been subpar and could have been improved

 

I am not certain whether any of these measures have been taken prior to the hacking, but from an outsider's perspective (and hearing the accounts from people like Robster), it does not sound like this was the case, despite pressure from elements within the customer base to do so.

 

Now we are in a situation where, due to neglect in mitigating the aforementioned risk, the entire outlook of the game has been altered significantly. The Admin has decided that a rollback is a necessity and as a result, and has interfered with the flow of the game in an attempt to minimize damage to the overall game. This minimization however, has significantly benefited one group of players at the expense of another group of players (I need only point to the numbers in the Rose-tS war to make an adequate point here).

 

Now, it is more than understandable that elements within the player (read: customer) base, who have invested in your game and are consistent sources of revenue, are showing discontent. When something as significant as this happens, it is only natural. This is where proper Customer Service normally comes into play in a business. A simple 'oops, our bad', in my opinion, is not enough adequately appease those who feel like they have been put at a disadvantage.

 

I will speak frankly about my personal considerations now, though I suspect that there are others with similar concerns and questions. As government of The Syndicate, I have spent considerable manhours in the past week to leverage and maintain a strong advantage for my alliance in this war. The same counts for all my members and fellow government. Our opponents damage done to my alliance is mainly derived from the first few days of fighting (this is supported by stats, which I am happy to bring over in support of my concern). After -against the odds- overtaking our opponents, the long-term damage done by my alliance to our opponents is mainly derived from the later phase of this war: The past 3 - 4 days. The current rollback will roll us back exactly to the point where what damage we have done is largely negated, whereas damage to my alliance is retained. This puts us in a position where our opponent now has a second shot at taking us out, and is less likely to be caught off guard. It means that many advantages which my alliance has worked for to create -on all levels- have effectively been whiped clean.

 

You may understand that this rollback as such, has had a severely demoralizing effect on both our members and our government, myself included. This goes to the point where some of us are now considering the option of taking our time and money to spend at a different venue. We like Politics and War, but these exploits have made us wary of whether the investment of our resources is worth it, provided the seemingly continuously apparent risk of our labor being undone.

 

Before I decide whether or not I will continue having an active presence in this game, and whether I will continue playing at all, I would like to invite Sheepy and his staff to actually engage the player base in solving this issue through venues other than the odd announcement every now and then. I would specifically request for an answer to the following questions:

 

- What was the cause of this hack, and what steps have you taken specifically to address this cause. You have added a staff member to the game, but what measures will he specifically implement to prevent further issues?

- Will there be further investigation as to the perpetrators of this hack, related hacks, and their relation to any players currently residing in the game? What will be done, and what measures will be taken against the perpetrators and those affiliated?

- Will any compensation (be it monetarily or in terms of in-game benefits) be made available for those who have been put at a severe disadvantage because of these rollbacks, specifically pertaining those who have consistently supported this game by donating to it? 

- Are there currently any other security risks or other factors that may severely impact the game, which we as players should be wary for? If so, what measures do you intend to take in order to mitigate said risks?

 

My questions all tie into the same theme: What do you intend to do to ease the concerns of me (and those who feel similar) as a paying customer?

 

Thank you in advance for your time.

 

EDIT:

I understand that some may feel that I sound like an ass, and bash me for 'going too hard' on sheepy. But what sheepy as a young entrepreneur needs, is feedback. Answering these questions will not only help ease our concerns. It will also force him to set out a clear policy on where he wishes to take this game. Ultimately, that is what we need.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Partisan

[PigInZen]

But Syndicate, you're free to go, no one will cry if you do. 

 

At least that was the reply upthread to similar concerns.

[Kemal Ergenekon]

If Mensa is very concerned about the implications of the rollback on their war effort they should pursue a different track, and ask for the game to be pushed back before the war started. Once that's been done they can simply repeat the actions that led us to where we are right now. Everyone starts again on even footing.

 

Hahahahahahahahahahahh.

[TellUrGrlThx]

Meh. This community is like !@#$ing aids. 

[Sam Hyde]

Meh. This community is like !@#$ aids. 

 

You think this is bad? Wait till you get to Bloc.