The Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire

[Palsada]

I have been waiting to write this for a long time. For those of you who know me, I was once the Co Leader of the alliance know as Empire of the Romans. I have the honour of being Justinians first merger, although definately not the last.

 

The Idea of Rome

 

When first approached by Justinian asking about a merger, it started off extremely poorly. Despite my alliance being the larger of the two, Justinian approached it as us simply merging into his for the good all involved. When we balked at this idea, and proposed more equal terms the talks almost died right there. Many times, looking back, I wish it had. But instead, I got my best people together, and decided it was best to negotiate this out for the potential it had. Notably, Justinian brought nobody but himself to these talks. His people would do whatever he decided on was what he said.

 

The talks were a clash of ideals, democracy and standards on one side, quick and flexible authoritarian on the other. In the end we tried our best to merge these conflicting ideals into one cohesive foundation for our new joint alliance, the Empire of the Romans. There were a few things left out, with the idea that we would get back to them later. Things left out, conflict resolution, warchest standards, fiscal policy and government expectations. These would be the seeds for the fall of Rome.

 

The Rise of Rome

 

The initial merger went as well as could be expected. My members joined the new alliance within a day, the alliance bank was transferred, people joined the new discord, things went swimingly. Justinian and I worked hard to set up a community, a government, and a path forward. We had elections, people were joining, our financial situation was stable. Justinian and I were a good team, in the beginning. We worked together, we figured out solutions to problem, we compromised.

 

Justinian worked hard on finding mergers for the new alliance, although this was the first real indication that this alliance was not. what it first seemed. Despite being equals, at least on paper, I was not informed about mergers before they were just about to happen. While I was okay in principle with mergers, not being informed on them was a troubling situation. I chalked this up to growing pains, and let him know that I did want a bit more in terms of notice and updates regarding potential mergers. 

 

With this out of the way, we grew. Merger followed by merger. All really disorganized alliances, all broke. So while we grew in terms of numbers, our alliance bank did not. And despite communicating that I and all of gov needed more information about mergers, the information we got was usually last minute, hours if not minutes before the merger was to take place. This pattern would persist until the very end.

 

The Cracks Begin to Form

 

The first real drag it out conflict that Justinian and I had was over which sphere to choose. PRIU, having fought hard in the delta hedge war, had secured a protector in Children of the Light, and we had good working relations with them. Justinian was coming from Hollywood and TKR, and wanted to continue with them. For once, we could not agree. Which was fine, we had planned for this possibility. If we could not decide, Gov would. And gov voted for Cataclysm. This should have been the end of the matter. Instead Justinian engaged in a smear campaign, dragged CotL reputation through the mud, twisted arms, and forced people to change their vote. This went against everything that we had decided on, but instead of making it a bigger issue than it needed to be, I simply remembered that this was how it was going to be going forward. I didn't know it yet, but the good times were already over, it was going to be a battle of wills from this point forward.

 

Meanwhile, the mergers continued. At this point, I started to sound the alarm. Not only was our bank shrinking in comparison to the amount of members we were absorbing, all of these nations had 0 warchests. Myself, knowing the importance warchests played in PRIU doing well in our war, wanted to stop. Consolidate. Train our members before getting new ones. Justinian wanted to seize the momentum, continue to grow. These lumps of coal could be turned into diamonds at a later date. Besides, TKR would keep us out of war. But to address my concerns, he would import a specialist government minister from outside the alliance. If I said our military situation was abysmal, he would grab a guy he said was an expert in military affairs. If I said our builds were junk, he would import a IA guy. Economics  10/10 taxes was hurting us, he would import a finance guy. These people would stay for as little as 3 weeks sometimes before going inactive or leaving for another alliance, all the while the issues they were here to address went unresolved. And the ones that did stay were the loyal yesmen to Justinian, that seemingly being their strongest attribute. More on this later.

 

The absent leader

 

To begin, I understand this is just a game. The pay is horrible, the hours can be long, and the credit if fleeting at best. That said, those who want to be leaders do need to put in the time.

 

I made sure to always be around my discord, available to members and government alike should something arise. Maybe too much time, as my wife would tell me as I sorted government issues while out on date night. So I don't blame people for having a life outside the game, Justinian least of all. But there comes a point where I began to wonder, how could I help run the alliance when the guy Im supposed to be running it with is never there? Gov would spend hours discussing an issue, awaiting Justinians input, we wouldn't get a response for 20 hours. I would send paragraphs of text suggesting policy, wouldn't get a response for days. There were times I needed to join the VC after one of his shows to get a hold of him to let him know all of gov was waiting on him to make a decision. Again, everyone needs a life outside this game, but a leader of an alliance should be available more than 20 minutes a day. And its not like he would be at work, or with family. He would be playing EU4 while ignoring all our pings. And when he did grace us with his presence he was more likely to simply want to do something that popped into his head without collaboration instead of addressing what myself and gov had been discussing. 

 

So in late november, this finally came to a head. Not by me, but by Justinian saying he was over running the alliance. We should merge into TKR. Little did I know that talks were pretty much complete and the merger was my approval away from being completed. I for the life of me could not understand how someone who put in 20 minutes actually governing could be tired of it all, but I did manage to talk him down from it. But it has to be known, EotR was on borrowed time from mid to late November. It was no longer a matter of if EotR would merge into TKR, but a matter of when.

 

The decline of Rome

 

Arrgh did in Rome. Arrgh killed the dysfunctional alliance called EotR. 

 

Arrgh mass raided EotR for 2 days. Arrgh, in 2 days, drained alliance members of 50-60 percent of what was in the alliance bank in resources.

 

It wasn't clear yet, but Arrgh had set EotR into its death spiral. Everything wrong with the alliance came back to bite it. Preparedness, nil. Warchests, for the vast majority, none. Build discipline, none.(20 percent of net losses were suffered by 3 individuals, all under 12c with average 2700 infra). I had never been so embarrassed in my time in this game. Milcom was none existent. People being blockaded for 1 turn talking about surrender. I was ashamed I had let things get to that point. All the mergers just made the alliance bloated. Not stronger, bloated, with soft nations with subpar militaries and no warchests. And all during this raid, Justinian was nowhere to be seen. Too busy getting high and drunk, we could deal with it. In 2 days, Arrgh laid bare every failing of the alliance. Low taxes meant a pitiful alliance bank. No warchest standards meant a lot of wars lost, and high infra builds destroyed. Poor gov standards meant little to no effective milcom. And the final nail in the coffin, conflict resolution would end my time as leader.

 

Before the arrgh raid, I had let it be known that if standards were to be applied alliance wide, they needed to start in gov. So I let every gov member know, have a effective warchest or you cannot serve as gov. I gave 2 months for people to get up to speed. And they all did, to their credit. Until a week after the argh raid, when Klaus Noxix sold his entire warchest for a new city. I fired him. Justinian reinstated him. I fired him again. I sat him down and talked to him about the importance of warchests and made sure he understood before I let him back in gov. A compromise in my mind. Not good enough for Justinian. Klaus Noxix was one of those loyal yesmen Justinian wanted, so the standards didnt apply to him. He removed me that same day. Why? We had never come to an agreement on conflict resolution, so off I was. Everything I put into that alliance, for nothing.

 

The final days of Rome

 

I was kicked. Equal Co leaders my ass. But oddly, I wasn't upset. I thought I should have been. Knocked down to member,discord priveleges taken away. I should have been raging. I was anxious about starting from almost scratch.(Justinian, to his credit, gave PRIU its original bank back). I had go contact my members, get Clock to bring me back into the fold, organize a move from EotR. But I was not angry. Why? Why was I not angry?

 

Because EotR was doomed. I knew it, and I believe Justinian knew it too. Not because I left, or because all but 1 PRIU member returned to the reformed alliance, the few of the alliance with proper standards and proper militaries. No. It was because as Arrgh had shown us internally, EotR was broken. Its fundamental structure was broken. And it would be up to Justinian alone now to fix it.

 

All those rapid fire mergers with a bank that was actually slightly smaller than it was at the original merger but with 3 times the members left the alliance 1 major conflict away from toppling over. And as that conflict began, I watched EotR be the only member of Hollywood to go negative net, and I knew it was over. And so it is, merged into TKR as it would have been in november if not for my intervention.

 

While I can watch with amusement from afar, this does not fill me with any great joy. A lot of people put a lot of work into that alliance, despite its failings. To watch it crumble 5 weeks after I left is nothing but a disservice to those who did put in that hard work, those long hours.

 

As for why now, why share this all now? Well, with the alliance all but dead, nothing I say will effect it further. I had wanted to share this before, and many of the news organizations in game wanted to hear it. But due to the work those still there had put in, I bit my tongue, and went on with my life. So this is for those who wanted to know.

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by palsada
Typo

[JackRackham429]

where Byzantium?

[Eschatos]

Not to be rude, but

Edit because all I'm reading is "Rome, Rome, Rome": Ave Legio.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Eschatos

[King Valerio]

During GW22 we had our problems. But we eventually started to gain ground and put ourselves into positive net. After a lot of arguing(I was absent at the time of this) a couple gov members had left. Before that I thought we were doing really well, but I must have been wrong. We were growing, we had plans of growing our current members, but we never had chances to do that bc of all of the mergers we had. We always had to accommodate the new members, out them where they needed to be, and put the gov members, who were promised gov, in gov. When Ethereal light merged into EOTR, all of my members loved Rome, some members, who weren't gov before, we're getting gov opportunities, me getting gas low gov(low gov is above staff), and was promised to become the fa head when Klaus was named the 2ic, which was going to happen in days to weeks to come. When I heard that we had merged, I was pissed. I had just settled down(I was/am still away, just checking discord here and there) into my gov position and was really happy I was going to be the fa head. Then I wasn't. We had merged, and my dreams crushed. Now I am forced to either join TKR, join the "new Rome" or make my own alliance. All thanks to Justinian "awesome" idea to merge EOTR int tkr. We spent so time into making Rome into what it was, and it just got taken from us like no one cared we tried. It seems as if justinian just didn't have the time, or patience, to run Rome anymore. He could have made someone else the leader, and went off on his way. Our members might have understood. But no, he did what the majority of our members wouldn't have wanted and merged Rome. 

[Lucilla]

This speaks for all true Romans 

[Pascal]

Literally 476

[Alyster]

How many mergers did EotR have in total? 

[Palsada]

3 minutes ago, alyster said:

How many mergers did EotR have in total? 

5 or 6.

[Lysander]

It was at least five, probably a lot more.

[Alastor]

Not the worst critique I’ve ever read.

I personally disagree with your assessment of the absentee leader and will present you with my perspective:

Constant and incessant arguing in gov that always needed my intervention to resolve. 3-5 times a day I had to step in only to remind people to be respectful. Let alone be able to get any work done. To the point where I could no longer call this a game I played for fun but rather a chore.

The membership of Rome, for what it was, were great people and solid group. I literally gave everything I had to them. Money, time, energy. Everything I did was for the benefit of Rome including the merge when it was clear the alliance was sustainable.

I had a great time and made good memories despite how it turned out. I hope everyone looks back on it fondly to some extent.

[Kevanovia]

13 minutes ago, palsada said:

5 or 6.

Those are rookie numbers. Gotta boost those puppies up

[MrNukey]

I’ll personally look back at rome with respect. For all the alliance has done for me and the community i was a part of 

Makes me sad to see it go but nothing lasts forever i guess

[Tiberius Aurion]

Very well said, Palsada. I wish I had gotten to know you more before everything. Your vision for what Rome should be is what we are working together to build over in the Empire of Rome. 

Rome still lives. Rome Eternal.

[Indger]

51 minutes ago, King Valerio said:

But no, he did what the majority of our members wouldn't have wanted and merged Rome. 

Why did most of them join TKR then?

 

 

[Xineoph]

How many mergers did you go through? Did these mergers affect things in any way differently than if they were recruited?

[Indger]

And yes, very well said and written, @palsada

[BigMorf]

So are we just going to ignore the part of the story here where you actively engaged in creating an internal fifth column of PIRU people and kept trying to stack elections and play up factionalism. It's really easy to point to the failing of an alliance and point the finger somewhere else and ignore the part of the story that actually got you fired and removed. 

[Leopold von Habsburg]

2 hours ago, Indger said:

Why did most of them join TKR then?

 

 

As someone who went through a similar situation quite a few years ago when I was just starting out in this game, the less involved members who are quiet and obedient tend to follow the orders from the government, sometimes even when they come out of nowhere such as a merger. I have a sneaking suspicion that they werent presented the merge as a mere option but more so an order and many probably just went with the flow. I'm sure they will be fine in TKR - it is going to be much more stable from the sounds of their alliance  from this post. Whether people would have actually opted for the merge if given the choice, that is a different story.

[Alyster]

23 minutes ago, BigMorf said:

So are we just going to ignore the part of the story here where you actively engaged in creating an internal fifth column of PIRU people and kept trying to stack elections and play up factionalism. It's really easy to point to the failing of an alliance and point the finger somewhere else and ignore the part of the story that actually got you fired and removed. 

How do you fire an equal position co-emperor?

[Bis]

Yet again, the Barbarians win . requiesta en pache

[Schnauzerguy]

59 minutes ago, alyster said:

How do you fire an equal position co-emperor?

Judging by how I think empire of the Romans was ran, I assume by gathering a majority of representatives to agree to it. Or just forcibly removing him ingame and from the discord 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Schnauzerguy

[Mayor]

Glad to know Arrgh is still destroying alliances even today, it is great to see. Still it is hard to find sympathy for anyone who would join Justinians alliance or convinced to be one of his "merges". Too bad he is less like Justinian and more like Emperor Nero.

[Uncle Iroh]

[dawg cat dog lol]

F in the chat 

[Firwof Kromwell]

7 hours ago, Justinian the Great said:

Not the worst critique I’ve ever read.

I personally disagree with your assessment of the absentee leader and will present you with my perspective:

Constant and incessant arguing in gov that always needed my intervention to resolve. 3-5 times a day I had to step in only to remind people to be respectful. Let alone be able to get any work done. To the point where I could no longer call this a game I played for fun but rather a chore.

The membership of Rome, for what it was, were great people and solid group. I literally gave everything I had to them. Money, time, energy. Everything I did was for the benefit of Rome including the merge when it was clear the alliance was sustainable.

I had a great time and made good memories despite how it turned out. I hope everyone looks back on it fondly to some extent.

 

W/ all things considered here & in the news servers, would you have ever considered that due to all the new ppl coming in whom are practically receiving a low amount of consolidation when instated into the aa, followed by the lack of raising standards via training over time as more of a contravention to the aa itself?

Yes you may have came in to settle although maybe if ppl were actually held accountable furthermore drilled w/ t EotR's core aspects of each dept,  they would have happen less as well those whom are knowledged enough can apply it towards willing others. You among some close others leaving ppl amidst while intervening when "necessary" only sound like ya wanted to be seen as a savior when you stepped in. But w/ conflict continuing, ppl grew weary of that but gained a drive to do better. Althou, what is their to do when the leader is seemingly purposely disarraying ppl so they have to get your so called "good willed" contentions. If I learned anything from my aa hoping, ppl want a leader whom actually leads collectively  w/ calm consideration rather bosses them around to their brooding w/ minimal questions asked. Arguments are goin to happen in this game nothing the less but you taking action to avoid it. Specially when the aa you seem to enjoy fell due to a lack of actually settling shit, more of offsetting it (which makes stuff pile up worse if it wasn't obvious enough) to your will.

I've seen this multiple time in my own viewing as all those I listen too. Even been in similar spot to Pallies in a few of my gov experiences. Im no golden boy cuz I certainly have my wrong doings but ones gotta open their eyes outside of themselves or one only becomes self-absorbed n greedy whom can cover such sins w/ lighter tones. Gather ideas around to middle ground into a stronger one over time, not just mainly what you saw was best to your values moving forward. Act like a Julius Caesar, & you will be left saying "Et tu, Brute", which you nearly did just that.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Firwof Kromwell
where am I wrong here & how so?