Popular Post Raphael Posted July 27, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 27, 2021 In the modern world, naval piracy is only a problem in select geographic areas. However, online piracy is omnipresent and hackermans are the greatest threat to the modern Boomer using "Password" as their password. To reflect a little bit of realism and add some flavour, I would like to propose a new spy operation: "Hack Bank Accounts" - Steal 1-5% [RNG of course] of your opponent's cash on hand. Pretty simple but I think it would add some cool potential flavor. 1 6 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) you would have to put a limit on the amount that can be stolen, say 1-5 million dollars. Edited July 27, 2021 by Sweeeeet Ronny D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raphael Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: you would have to put a limit on the amount that can be stolen, say 1-5 million dollars. For legal reasons, this is a joke. I think some kind of diminishing returns thing would work best for this spy op though. Something like, it's more likely to get 3-5% of lower amounts of cash and more likely to get 1-3% of larger amounts of cash. But I think it would provide another "strategy" piece to consider in multiple facets of the game. Raiders would probably like to start keeping spies maxed out, whales might like to deposit things more often, people holding banks might consider using Arcane instead of Fortress (or whatever they use now). People might become more secretive about where banks are hidden. Maybe more! edit: to add a little math: 5% of one billion is $50m. So if you roll perfectly on, say, a bank holder you're still stealing a negligible amount. Every successive spy op obviously steals even less. Edited July 27, 2021 by Bojack Horseman 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted July 27, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 27, 2021 The issue is this, while most of us grumpy whales do keep most of our money in the bank, we do have to withdraw it from the bank when we pick up cities. Now I know people have bots for everything, and I would think it may not be too hard to make a bot that traces bank transactions to help people determine the best possible targets to spy attack with this. You say, why would anyone do this? well my next city costs 3 billion dollars, so if someone were to spy my cash it could yoink up to 150 million dollars from me if they time it right, during the time between withdrawing it and buying a new one. Now that I think about it, I believe Borg's bot can already estimate a person's warchest and its surprisingly accurate. If put to its full potential, you could have people making 50-200 million dollars a day just spying cash. That is a huge amount of cash for an op that costs around 1 million bucks to do, and would certainly be worthwhile for someone to develop a bot to help people target this. 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigbigadorlou Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 1 hour ago, Bojack Horseman said: using "Password" as their password Dang it how did you know 48 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: grumpy whales do keep most of our money in the bank For this reason, I like the idea a lot if it steals from the alliance bank (with caps). That way your offshores can actually be threatened 1 Quote Hey Krampus, the signature edit is under account settings. Actually, here's the link. https://forum.politicsandwar.com/index.php?/settings/signature/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indger Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 I do not support Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrythonLexi Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 I like the idea at its heart, but I do think there would need to be balance applied for the reasons @Sweeeeet Ronny D mentioned - the possibility of bots being used to snipe city build funds. Much like nukes and missiles, maybe having a small time limit for "safe" money (Say, a turn or two - not as OP as a day to where you can just deposit and withdraw all your money daily to keep it immune) so that city builds and projects are kept largely safe. Targeting alliance banks would be a bit overpowered imho (ex. a small, newbie nation being able to spy some amount of a huge alliance warchest). For that problem, I would recommend entirely different changes to how offshoes work (Not for this thread, but TL;DR changing alliances shouldn't prevent looting alliance warchests for active members). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majima Goro Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 16 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: I would think it may not be too hard to make a bot that traces bank transactions This actually has existed since or even before NPOLT, possibly as long back as AC. In fact, there is an api now for this. however, a situation like this is extremely unlikely 16 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: well my next city costs 3 billion dollars, so if someone were to spy my cash it could yoink up to 150 million dollars from me if they time it right, during the time between withdrawing it and buying a new one. Why? Because even if it is a bot automated to pick up transaction logs, doing this for every nation using scraping is going to take at the very least 10-20 minutes. I know this because I personally have bots that scrape some info that is not available via APIs and each call takes ~0.1-0.5s/page. It is almost implausible to think that you would withdraw money and someone would find out you withdrew within a fraction of a second and do an op on you. The probability of something like this happening is astronomically low. Even then, using bots to spy is against game rules so the bot would need to first find the transaction and then ping a role/person in a discord channel and then he'd manually go an do the op. This would take atleast some time which should be enough to buy a city imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 Because people dont have bots that constantly check the trade market for shitty trades, and those trades get snapped up with extreme quickness. You dont need to do this for every nation in the game. You dont think someone can make a bot that tracks the bank transactions of all nations with say 30 cities or more (350 of them) or even 35 cities or more (120 nations) so that they can figure out exactly when to launch spy attacks. You are looking at taking 2 shots at 1-3 billion dollars which can net you 20-300 million dollars. You dont think there will be wackos in this game that watch for stuff like this like a hawk looking for a quick and easy payday? With 350 nations, and you estimate at that size conservatively you can pick up a city once every 60 days, that is 6 nations a day spending 1-3+ billion dollars a day on a new city. If you can catch one or two a week, that effort easily pays for itself. So if you want to do this, I dont have a problem with it, but you need to put some kind of cap on it because if there is a spy attack that when hit 3 times, can cost me over 400 million dollars, that is broken. Also you are assuming that there is little to no lag time between a bank sending money and it getting used. It could be less than a min or a few hours. Tho if something like this was implemented, Grumpy would quickly adjust how it does business to best protect its members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raphael Posted July 29, 2021 Author Share Posted July 29, 2021 10 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: Because people dont have bots that constantly check the trade market for shitty trades, and those trades get snapped up with extreme quickness. You dont need to do this for every nation in the game. You dont think someone can make a bot that tracks the bank transactions of all nations with say 30 cities or more (350 of them) or even 35 cities or more (120 nations) so that they can figure out exactly when to launch spy attacks. You are looking at taking 2 shots at 1-3 billion dollars which can net you 20-300 million dollars. You dont think there will be wackos in this game that watch for stuff like this like a hawk looking for a quick and easy payday? With 350 nations, and you estimate at that size conservatively you can pick up a city once every 60 days, that is 6 nations a day spending 1-3+ billion dollars a day on a new city. If you can catch one or two a week, that effort easily pays for itself. So if you want to do this, I dont have a problem with it, but you need to put some kind of cap on it because if there is a spy attack that when hit 3 times, can cost me over 400 million dollars, that is broken. Also you are assuming that there is little to no lag time between a bank sending money and it getting used. It could be less than a min or a few hours. Tho if something like this was implemented, Grumpy would quickly adjust how it does business to best protect its members. tbh you're pointing out a very unlikely scenario that nonetheless needs to be addressed in the mechanic... but I can't help but think someone netting billions from whales via spy ops would be glorious lmao 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgiumFury Posted July 29, 2021 Share Posted July 29, 2021 15 hours ago, Bojack Horseman said: tbh you're pointing out a very unlikely scenario that nonetheless needs to be addressed in the mechanic... but I can't help but think someone netting billions from whales via spy ops would be glorious lmao It's not unlikely. The game is competitive, i know of people who have bots to snipe trades and even high value raids, i'm sure this would not be unlikely at all. Ill do you one better, if this mechanic came out I'd have a bot made for me to do exactly this. SRD made a great point which would need adressing before it can or should be implemented. (it would be funny though) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zed Posted July 30, 2021 Share Posted July 30, 2021 If this came out, any alliance that did not actually find a way to do some technology around this even if they might never actually use it... well they are not worth much as an alliance. 1 Quote In paradisum deducant te Angeli; in tuo adventu suscipiant te martyres, et perducant te in civitatem sanctam Ierusalem.Chorus angelorum te suscipiat, et cüm Lazaro quondam paupere æternam habeas requiem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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