Popular Post hidude45454 Posted July 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2021 uuuuuuu god this is so late, life keeping me busy, and now everyone's gonna complain I'm talking about GW18 again T_T Gonna keep this short because the post is gonna be long enough as is: during GW18, there was always something that felt totally incongruous to me: why was it that at the end of the war, disputed territory only fell around C20 when every conversation I'd had with friends all the way up to C30 had them expressing shock they hadn't been taken apart completely? tl;dr here's what I thought Roasis Inc could've much improved on in order to push up to that range. Discussion is welcomed; all I live for is war, after all I'll start at the very beginning and push my way forwards: Rose militarization: To this day I cannot understand why Rose didn't militarize even if they were confident they weren't the target. This is especially coming from the richest alliance in the game where losing a minimal amount of steel or money from building and decomming is basically a drop in the bucket. What makes this even more baffling is we saw the notifications of them switching to 5553, expecting a full build for 2-3 days at the very least, and yet later we learned they were only instructed to max soldiers and planes. Why soldiers only??? Poor round 1 beige control: By the end of round 1, E404 was zeroed. CoTL was zeroed. Guardian was half zeroed and under serious fire. tO was zeroed. TKR was struggling to stay afloat. Oblivion was half zeroed, and the rest only went all out because we expected to die in a round or two. Everyone on Grumpy was on 4-6 wars trying to bail people out, and even then it wasn't quite enough. Instead, what happened? Everyone slowly started getting huge amounts of beige time. There were the numbers to prevent it from ever happening, and yet from the ashes we were able to give the order for anyone above C20 to remax military and start pushing. If this was NPO we were talking about, one alliance member aptly put it that there'd be no escape from the cycling machine. In that situation, there would've been almost minimal need for a planes-only strategy and pushing upwards would've been 10x easier. Late/weak do-not-beige order: In the end, the order to not beige anyone in HW was too little, too late. This absolutely should've been implemented at the start of the first round. Furthermore, it seemed like most people didn't want to follow this order -- I heard post-war far too many times that the competent ones were putting in the work to drag people down, only to be constantly and consistently frustrated by the incompetent ones blanket beiging on all wars. Additional do-not-peace order: A minor addition, but this should've been added along with the do-not-beige order (case in point: Grumpy slotting the same Immortals guy like 15 times). Accepting peace frees up crucial slots for attackers and leaves defenders with open slots that are much easier to be sat on by people with lower military. I offered peace to pretty much everyone I fought with during the later parts of the war and the number of people who accepted peace was pretty comedic. Building ships: A lot of people in Roasis Inc, especially in Oasis, continued to build ships even after all of their other military units were destroyed. This hurt the war effort in almost every single way -- they were max shipping low-infra people on raid wars (a total waste of resources), beiging people with ships with no regard for beige cycling, and also putting themselves in range of larger people who could zero them a lot easier. Meatshields: There is no denying that Rose, Oasis, and Mystery all contain a large amount of bloat from useless members and alliances. In peacetime, maybe this is for tax farm reasons or something, but during wartime, these members and alliances are not only free stats but also detrimental to the war effort as a whole. Weakest link theory: I think the reason why meatshields are so useless is not something people like to talk about a lot: a chain is only as strong as its weakest link. There are multiple reasons why: -Having HW members being slotted by meatshields allows them an incredibly easy time to fight back and rebuild to prioritize saving other members. -HW members can always target meatshields in order to farm stats and resources that Roasis Inc need to rebuild post-war. -They can also be targeted if HW members on say, zero ships, want a very easy way to stack beige from meatshields who don't know how to beige cycle. -Overall, they offer very little offensive or defensive value and waste space, time, and resources that would be much better utilized elsewhere. Lack of milcom leadership and talent: I have pointed out frequently that if the milcom govs between HW and Roasis Inc were switched, Roasis Inc would've almost certainly been able to push up to C30-35. Ultimately, this is due to a faulty priority of recruiting low-quality members or meatshields over recruiting and training good milcom leadership and talent. Quantity has become a bit overrated as of late: people often forget that even a small amount of quality can go a long way. Poor coordination: In a war like this, I like to attribute three different types of coordination available, intra-alliance coordination (within a single alliance), inter-alliance (between alliances within a sphere), and inter-sphere (between different spheres). Roasis Inc struggled mightily with all three bar a few alliances: Intra-alliance: although coordinated counters against HW attacks did happen occasionally, this was rare. More often than not, members would only attack one or two at a time, leading to a weak and dispersed effort that could be dealt with almost immediately. Inter-alliance: after the relatively coordinated blitzes early on, this was also sorely missing. For the most part, there was minimal communication between attacks, beige, and so on. HW compared to this was like night and day: if someone got hit, we knew almost immediately, and could search for people between alliances almost immediately to deal with it. No one was left on their own. Inter-sphere: This was almost certainly one of the largest factors that ultimately cost Roasis Inc a victory. Most members never communicated or fought with those outside their spheres, much less had any idea what the other spheres were up to. This also extended into milcom leadership as well -- it took weeks for spheres to learn to adapt the same strategies, resulting in a disjointed and confusing effort. Inter-sphere coordination on crossing over enemy spheres: At the very beginning, it was Oasis focusing HM-side, and Mystery focusing TKR-side. Obviously, there would be an inevitable point where spheres would have to cross over and hit the other side. This should have been and was entirely in Roasis Inc's court on when to call this. Prior to this, Oblivion was forced to ignore all Mystery targets in order to bail out HM on Oasis, and the same was true for basically all other alliances from both HM-side and TKR-side, severing a crucial line of communication all while both sets of gov were still in the very early stages of integrating HW together. This should've been taken advantage of, and when the crossing over eventually happened, should've been a massive and coordinated effort. Instead, wars began weakly trickling over from both sides, and this gave us the time to integrate the sphere much quicker and begin finding people much quicker to counter wars that were previously being left alone. Early blitz on Oblivion: This is the first of many potential turning points I observed. There was a period early on where Oblivion was heavily targeted for a few days. Ultimately, after some lightning fast counters (mainly from Guardian <3) that saved our asses, Roasis Inc decided to give up and focus on other things. The thing is, they didn't fail because they used a flawed strategy, they failed BECAUSE THEY GAVE UP TOO EARLY. In fact, y'all were so close to figuring it out that I was already preparing for the worst. After day 1, I was down to about 1300-1400 planes out of 2100. Even with building the maximum every day, I did the math, and with constant suicide dogfights (I was in 9 wars, for god's sakes) and 3x spy planes every day, I would've been melted. From there, it's only an issue of have the wars expire and then drag me down, down, down. Instead, the only person who bothered suicide dogfighting me after day 1 was Tyunka (shoutout if you're reading this), and the spy attacks stopped completely as well. Similarly, a fellow alliance member who'd been blitzed had some seriously botched counters launched to save him, and instead the guy who could've destroyed his planes completely went inactive for almost a day and had the plan fall apart. Even if I hadn't been taken down completely, I was totally out of service for a few days because I was forced to claw my way back up to max planes. I found this entire situation incredibly ironic -- it was one of the strongest displays of inter-sphere coordination I'd seen through the entire war, with the best strategy that could've been brought, meaning they had all the puzzle pieces there. If only they'd figured this out for us, who knows what they could've done to everyone else. The strategy: In the end, it was quite simple, really. You don't need three larger guys to pull you down. Sometimes, you just need three somewhat smaller guys. Sometimes, it's two smaller guys and one larger guy. Finding these people should not have been an issue. Target the people who are the most overextended, or who by being zeroed could free the most people. Even the zeroed people on a daily buy of planes can kill a non-insignificiant amount, to the point where often a target will be forced to beige them in order to protect their own planes (I experienced this firsthand). If no counters roll in, they're toast and you make progress. If counters roll in, you keep focusing them with suicide dogfights and 3x spy planes, and they're toast again. You don't even have to go planes only for this to work. I actually cannot believe that something this easy to understand was only implemented minimally. The flawed initial strategy: From what I hear, for whatever reason Roasis Inc decided to start their focus upwards and work their way down. When you are fighting Grumpy, this is literally the dumbest thing you could do. In fact, this was very obviously HW's strategy the entire time and should not have been Roasis Inc's. Flawed focus and difficulty maintaining focus on all objectives: Throughout the war a few alliances kept certain measurements or percentages as goals in order to fulfill a strategy. Aside from the fact that this was totally not done in HW (after all, statisticians do tend to lie), these were often the wrong objectives entirely, and often also ignored damages to their own side when trying to espouse damages done to HW. Furthermore, they often lost sight of both flawed and correct objectives, pursuing other plans or declaring aimlessly. Planes only: Even though planes only is a strategy, there's no denying that it's a bad (and outdated) strategy. Because of score changes and tanks destroying planes, someone with max ground will usually be able to beat someone with max planes. This is especially true when people are trying to declare at impossible numbers (like with a 7-10 city difference, for ex.), but even otherwise, TKR and tO's experience in The Last Ride told us that we should almost always be prioritizing ground attacks and eliminating ground for this reason. Later in the war, some people (especially Camelot) decided to get rid of soldiers entirely and quite literally go planes only -- I assume the strategy behind this was to reduce score even further and also get targeted by pirates instead of HW, and it worked to an extent, but for the most part soldiers barely affect the score, and we realized this pretty quickly and were able to switch strategies in order to make dealing with this even easier. Early round 2 on CoTL: Not long after Oblivion was getting targeted, CoTL began to reach max mil out of beige. The milcom head was completely absent for irl reasons, and for a day or two they began sending out coordinated counters against a reasonable amount of people. There were two significant risks associated with this strategy, neither of which Roasis Inc exploited. First, these counters were mostly only sent with two people assigned to a target. This meant they were zeroed quicker and could've had time to coordinate with their own counters to take down CoTL members. Second, almost everyone was overextending to do it, meaning Roasis Inc (as per usual) had the numbers in order to punish the overextension. Instead, I only heard of a minimal number of counters, of which mostly were dealt with quickly. In short, CoTL were able to come off with a string of victories relatively easily and with almost no cost. Speaking of overextension... Targeting overextended targets: A lot of people post-war remarked that Oblivion seemed much larger than it actually was. The reason for this, I think, was honestly really simple: we just picked the people involved in the most offensive wars against non-zeroed militaries and hit them, and so by strategically picking the best people to counter instead of any rando with a military, it seemed like we were larger (in reality, we were only 12 people rofl. 12 people can only do so much against a coalition of 1000+). Roasis Inc had the opportunity to take this and apply it on a far larger scale. Instead, I saw very little correlation with attacks versus offensive wars, and therefore the people doing the heaviest damage were allowed to continue doing the heaviest damage. Disagreement on strategy and inter-sphere milcom discontent: The larger issue was that for the most part, Rosesphere, Oasis, and Mystery never really figured out how to work beyond their own spheres. Each were pursuing their own goals that didn't fit with the others, and as a result it was easy for all the spheres to start blaming each other for their failures rather than coming together as a collective team. For example, early on, it was quite common for Oasis to be going max military, Mystery going planes only, and Rosesphere waffling in between the two indecisively. Ultimately, they realized what they should've already known far too late: any collective plan is better than no plan at all. Big egos: A lot of this, simply put, I think was because there were too many people unwilling to compromise outside their own beliefs and plans. It was so difficult for people to realize their own faults and that they were targeting the wrong things that in the end lots of people clashed with each other and ended up regressing any collaborative support that would've boosted the entire coalition. Weak opening spy blitzes: I was assigning HW spy attacks throughout the war, so I know this better than anyone. For the first week or so, Roasis Inc spy attacks were horrendous. I will give Rose a pass on this -- we zeroed them and their allies immediately, meaning the best spiers were out early. For the rest, few people were actually launching attacks, or if they were, it was Locutus assigning spy targets, which you should almost never be doing. So, HW was killing 3x as many spies per member as Roasis Inc, and we were beginning to grind the spy war to a halt because of it. It was only because DtC decided to personally assign spy targets by messaging everyone in the entire coalition that y'all got your asses saved. This front should've ended much sooner than it actually did. Poor spy coordination: Something that absolutely should've been done was a better tie-in between traditional milcom and spy ops. Once HW was near zeroed on spies, the priority quickly shifted to spying tanks on the highest whales and spying planes on a limited range where it might matter. While this did result in a massive amount of tanks being spied away, ultimately it didn't contribute much to the war goal and the net damage wasn't any more than a few days or so of total revenue for alliances with tanks being targeted. Instead, if Roasis Inc had learned how to properly updeclare, many more spy attacks against planes would've been directed in a larger range of the tiers that mattered -- this would've mattered a great deal if Oblivion had been constantly targeted rather than left alone after the first two days or so, for example. And with better communication between milcom and spies, milcom would've been able to pinpoint the most important targets to be passed over to spy ops. Camelot spies: I heard through the grapevine that Camelot was conducting their own spy ops separate of DtC's operation. While this probably was more directed towards coordination between milcom and spy ops (and probably was the source of spy ops against Oblivion), overall, this spy effort was weak and far from the strength they displayed while in Rosesphere. I think Camelot should've worked together with DtC in order to combine the best of both worlds here. Arrgh: This is a minor point because Arrgh is mostly missing these days, but Roasis Inc also could've taken advantage of Arrgh stacking beige time on their mid and low tiers in order to build up. Knight's Templar: KT was almost certainly a thorn for both sides in the war, and they'll probably be pretty happy with that, but Rose proved especially incompetent at dealing with them: first, by being incapable of stashing their offshores and not dropping massive amounts of loot, but also by becoming so singlemindedly focused on getting beige stacked by KT that it hurt their war focus altogether. At one point, this resulted in Rose literally declaring more wars on KT in order to try and get themselves beiged than actually declaring war on HW, and several people got nation striked for this and had their wars manually peaced out as a result. Poor mindset and giving up too easily: All this culminates into one overarching point: Roasis Inc started this war with far too dismal of a mindset and gave up very easily (especially Rose). People always underestimate this point: mentality is everything. It dictates how much effort you're willing to put into each element, what goals you're trying to pursue, what strategy you're going to take, and so on. As a result, because Rose thought they were totally outnumbered and beat down, it became a self-fulfilling prophecy, and they ended as poorly as they did because they didn't bother trying, even when they had many opportunities to. Similarly, because Roasis Inc as a whole set their bar exceptionally low and took a line at C20 as the expected result, it hindered them from being able to push any higher. This is opposed to HW -- even though our prospects were looking grim, we had the will to not take it sitting down to fight back, and we kept rebuilding even after a pretty bad round 1. This is why, I think, alliances like E404 were able to pull back a huge net loss of billions and end the war on a positive. Built-up nations doing nothing: One very pronounced effect of this was the number of maxed nations simply exiting beige without declaring any wars and getting promptly slotted by HW. There were always enough of them to coordinate and launch a few good attacks, and I know these people did ask, but most of the time milcom did very little to actually help out here. So, this resulted in a drop of defeatism spreading into a ripple, leading lots of the player base to give up as well. No damage strategy: Final point. In the tiers that were clearly lost and not worth fighting back in, there should've been a goal to deal as much damage as possible. This was true at the beginning of the war for HW anywhere C20 and under (and later pushed down) and should've also been true anywhere hitting people C33 or so and up for Roasis Inc -- that's why Lord Tyrion was able to get the most damage of anyone in Roasis Inc, for example. This strategy would've come with an additional benefit: if anyone wanted to stack beige time, they should've done it against Grumpy and not KT; Grumpy had almost zero beige discipline the entire war and that should've been taken advantage of. ========================================================================== Anyways, that's all I had on my list for Roasis Inc; feel free to discuss any of them, I don't imagine I'll be right 100% of the time. For the sake of fairness, I also came up with a few points I think HW could've improved on: Spy participation: For the most part, most alliances did a good job getting their members to fill assigned spy targets. However, there were a few where this was not so much the case. Higher spy participation would've probably allowed us to grind the spy front to a halt much faster, although admittedly that wouldn't have mattered a huge amount when fighting 3x as many spies. As the war progressed and it became clear we were losing, spy participation understandably dwindled. I think people should realize that no matter how few spies they have, there is always something they can contribute -- 1 vs 60 on a spy tanks op has a 50% chance of success, which is still honestly pretty good and has a net damage positive (and which is what I spent almost every day doing). Mindset: This is the same as with Roasis Inc. A couple people had some more dismal outlooks than others (and I can be blamed of this as well), and this probably did affect the war performance, but for the most part I think the collective mentality was relatively positive and offset any negativity. Initial HM-TKR split: As I said earlier, HM and TKR conducted their milcom separately at first, and this was a split that Roasis Inc could've (and didn't) take advantage of. Later on, this was much improved, but a few alliances did stick to themselves and their side of the sphere for the most part. Risky overextension: Fighting against any better coalition would've meant this would've been a big no-no. Lots of people (including me) were fighting far too many wars at the same time, which in a more competent world would've meant we would've been focused harder and taken down quicker, while freeing up many more people to fight, but in the end Roasis Inc didn't take advantage of this. Beige cycling: Although our cycling was a lot better than Roasis Inc's, it was still far from perfect. I'm not going to name names here, but I know for sure that Oblivion wasn't great either, although maybe this can be excused by the fact that there were always so many targets that we had to keep beiging and focusing them. A brief side note: props to TKR; a lot of people like to give them shit, but they were always careful about overextension and pushed everyone else to beige cycle, so kept it from getting much worse than it could've been. Grumpy: A brief starting note: Grumpy members downdeclaring super low was the exception, not the norm, and this isn't what makes Grumpy so overpowered or broken. For the most part, even though Grumpy hauled weight in round 1 and declared a huge number of wars to keep us in it, during round 2 and beyond they were mostly concerned with raiding resources and preserving infra, meaning for the most part they were mass beiging wars (to get loot and avoid nukes) and not decomming military or infra to downdeclare. I won't say it was a necessary step for them to do so, but I will say that Roasis Inc should've taken advantage of both of these things to stack beige and press for space. Decomming ships and infra: Beyond that, a lot of people weren't willing to decom ships (and later infra) in order to reach and push down. Again, this really wasn't incredibly necessary, but something something tragedy of the commons. I will note that I think TKR would've done this eventually had Roasis Inc not accepted white peace, and then we would've been able to push down a whole hell of a lot faster. ========================================================================== why did I do this to myself ;-; That was a lot, so just wanna end this on a brief positive note:Roasis Inc: Props to Weebunism for having the best intra-alliance communication. ASM for always being willing to suicide planes and updeclare to drag people down. Camelot for at least having a plan to stick to. The ppl who coordinated the hit on Oblivion for coming close (and Tyunka for pinning me for a good few days). DtC for being a spying god as usual.HW: Props to all the bloodthirsty peeps always asking for more wars and for being instantly available for counters. Guardian for tiering with us beautifully and bailing us out within the same turn of getting targeted. Ockey for being a good milcom teacher. CoTL and tO for decomming infra and ships to dive low, huge respect. E404 for clawing back the net damage. CC for being one of the best intra and inter-alliance communicators and having a strong spy war. TKR for keeping everyone principled and doing much better than GW16. BK for punching above their weight and being super solid internally. tl;dr fun war and I hope the next one is even better -- fighting against good milcom is always a pleasure even though it will definitely get me rolled :lmfao: 10 1 2 69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUT Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) Me: Write that down! Write that down! Edited July 5, 2021 by Mutsu 2 3 Quote Sultan of United Ummah, Head of Foreign Affairs.Inshallah, I will get some sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Thalmor Posted July 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2021 What an incredible analysis. I hope to see more things like this in the future from others. 1 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TRM Posted July 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2021 10/10 Worth the read. 1 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vice Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Who the F are you? I don’t respond well to threats. 😈 In all seriousness, great write up and thank you for taking the time to elaborate on things from your perspective. Also I think I left a sock at your place. I’ll get it next weekend. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khaos Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 great job, im surprised that I actually read the whole thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramona Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Cassia Posted July 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2021 I was also concerned CotL was overextended too much during that second round (apologies to anyone who witnessed me freaking out about that :')) but it turned out alright, for the most part the counters trickled in slowly and were downdecs so they were easy to slot. In fact the few folks who went down during that were the ones who got updeclared by a few smaller nations. They definitely could have used that to their advantage. Great read! 2 1 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidude45454 Posted July 5, 2021 Author Share Posted July 5, 2021 23 minutes ago, Cas said: I was also concerned CotL was overextended too much during that second round (apologies to anyone who witnessed me freaking out about that :')) but it turned out alright, for the most part the counters trickled in slowly and were downdecs so they were easy to slot. In fact the few folks who went down during that were the ones who got updeclared by a few smaller nations. They definitely could have used that to their advantage. Great read! idk if you can tell, but since you were in that juicy range the entire war I based a lot of my observations on comments you were making in the milcom channels, so thanks for the help xP 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Still laughing at how my c30 with max air and ground manages to hit c17-18s more than a few times. Totally worth every penny of sold infra lmao 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepingNinja Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Huge thank you Hi-dude. Your spy ops sheets were actually what enabled us to elevate our spy game but I especially appreciate the shout-out. 🙌 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadenStar10 Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 1 hour ago, hidude45454 said: Instead, the only person who bothered suicide dogfighting me after day 1 was Tyunka (shoutout if you're reading this), and the spy attacks stopped completely as well Can Confirm, @Tyunkais the GOAT Quote Hammer Councillor of The Lost Mines Diety Emeritus of The Immortals, Patres Conscripti (President Emeritus) of the Independent Republic of Orange Nations, Lieutenant Emeritus of Black Skies, Imperator Emeritus of the Valyrian Freehold, Imperator Emeritus of the Divine Phoenix, Prefect Emeritus of Carthago, Regent Emeritus of the New Polar Order, Coal Duke (Imperator Emeritus) of The Coal Mines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vali Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) its not like our side is that great either lmao but the point must be made without the presence of an elite sphere, something like IQ, with a sphere wide long term strategy for domination and without the threat of extinction due to losing a war will all future wars resemble this one? Edited July 5, 2021 by Vali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dream Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Damn, should definitely take the time to read. Nice work Hidude 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indger Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Many members from Roasis Inc didn't even know that war was going on and were begging for peace lol,that's what i experienced 🤷♂️ 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick McScott Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Loved reading this! Great lessons that can be taken from both sides. Thank you for taking the time to make this old friend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Scarfalot Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, Indger said: Many members from Roasis Inc didn't even know that war was going on and were begging for peace lol,that's what i experienced 🤷♂️ That always happens in the lowest tiers, and is always funny 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aero Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Thank you for this. It was a great read and I'm sure there will be things taken away from it. It was a fun war no matter what people see as the outcome. Moving forward should be for an interesting game now. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherise Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) Jeez, I'd better go finish the third draft of my memo instead of working on fiction about where the protagonist character sprays yellow Not-COVID on everyone from an airplane. But as I mentioned in Discord, the point of interest is the overlap. Some of the points Hidude made were made by others (impression of HW logistics running out), others were made by myself (utter incompetence in running updeclares). Where I tend to disagree was whether or not Oblivion and others overextended, and it was reported that Rose and others suicided planes. In fact, I made the opposite criticism that some Rose suicides didn't have to be suicides but were suicides because Rose etc overextended. === Having an official view of the war from HW's side, likewise, also emphasized some of the limitations of HW C4I. Obviously, while I'm aware of some of HW's mistakes in prosecuting this war (my general judgment was that HW was more adaptive to changing combat conditions than Rose coalition), I wasn't aware of others. Edited July 5, 2021 by Cherise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keegoz Posted July 5, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 5, 2021 I really hope people do detailed analysis of wars going forward. Might even give the losing side something to work on and get better at to improve the game overall. 14 Quote [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: But Keegoz is actually bad. [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: He's my favorite bad leader though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StressAndMess Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Great analysis, 10/10 read. As milcom gov for Atlas, can’t deny that was a few consecutive punches to the face but yeah, all of that was true. My perspective as being a minor part of coordination, in the beginning there was no plan. Sure, intra-alliance was well coordinated but Atlas isn’t the strongest Even with Atlas, I think we could have benefited from militarizing earlier and keeping our peacetime military up to par. That’s something I am tackling. (as ya girl just got promoted to high gov last thursday!) I can’t speak for other spheres, but due to how the wars were rolled out, i think the same lack of communication held true. Near the end of the war, communication improved tenfold. Props to Aurora for making this work. By then, I think it may or may not have been too late, or the rapid change from every milcom gov in every alliance doing their own thing to orders when used to a degree of power. That’s just my insider’s take. Pleasure doing war with you, hope the next is even better. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zigbigadorlou Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 What happened to 1000 word max ☹️ Quote Hey Krampus, the signature edit is under account settings. Actually, here's the link. https://forum.politicsandwar.com/index.php?/settings/signature/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StressAndMess Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 No way that’s 1000 words, man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majima Goro Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 (edited) Tl;dr for anyone not wanting to read a WoT Reasons why neo-IQ sucked: 1) Communication breakdown 2) Trash Milcom and members 3) Giving up and not knowing what to do Reasons why neo-EMC sucked: 1) Grumpy GoB Pixel-Huggers(the usual reason) Edited July 5, 2021 by Majima Goro Shoutout to members 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanJazza Posted July 5, 2021 Share Posted July 5, 2021 Based Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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