James Ironwood Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 Just now, Kyubnyan said: I actually fought against TKR in Knightfall as well. They did a lot of damage given how outnumbered they were and put up a great fight even though they did end up losing. Dogpiles usually don't turn out too well for the side being dogpiled (go figure). Really makes you think how this war ended so quickly and with such little resistance. Yeah, they have improved a lot over the years and continue to have a cohesive sense of identity and obligation. It's just too bad that can sometimes be overshadowed by a sour reality in foreign relations and infrastructural losses. But TKR keeps coming back, and will probably continue to until the end of the game. Good to meet a veteran of Knightfall. Do you remember the PnW Jack-o-Lantern competition? 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyubnyan Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 3 minutes ago, James Ironwood said: Yeah, they have improved a lot over the years and continue to have a cohesive sense of identity and obligation. It's just too bad that can sometimes be overshadowed by a sour reality in foreign relations and infrastructural losses. But TKR keeps coming back, and will probably continue to until the end of the game. Good to meet a veteran of Knightfall. Do you remember the PnW Jack-o-Lantern competition? Haha yeah, infrastructure loss / pixel burning is healthy for the game but I won't comment on foreign relations as that is not my area of expertise. P.S. yes I do remember the pumpkin carving contests but I wouldn't be able to tell you who has won them without a bit of forum digging. Humans cannot create anything out of nothingness. Humans cannot accomplish anything without holding onto something. After all, humans are not gods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Schmo Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, Kyubnyan said: Haha yeah, infrastructure loss / pixel burning is healthy for the game but I won't comment on foreign relations as that is not my area of expertise. P.S. yes I do remember the pumpkin carving contests but I wouldn't be able to tell you who has won them without a bit of forum digging. As low-tier TKR FA, as far as I can tell certainly a few people are angry about the recent war, but most seem to be pretty chill. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Kyubnyan said: Haha yeah, infrastructure loss / pixel burning is healthy for the game but I won't comment on foreign relations as that is not my area of expertise. P.S. yes I do remember the pumpkin carving contests but I wouldn't be able to tell you who has won them without a bit of forum digging. I only remember pumpkin that won because it is on the same topic and was at the same time as Knightfall. I think it was a crudely drawn "!@#$ TKR" text message; mind you, this was around the time hostilities br oke out, so it makes sense why it won. If you can dig up an image of the winner, I'd appreciate that! Also, thanks for the positivity. 1 minute ago, Joe Schmo said: As low-tier TKR FA, as far as I can tell certainly a few people are angry about the recent war, but most seem to be pretty chill. Thanks for the input, I guess it is just a small minority of people after all. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidude45454 Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 13 minutes ago, James Ironwood said: I only remember pumpkin that won because it is on the same topic and was at the same time as Knightfall. I think it was a crudely drawn "!@#$ TKR" text message; mind you, this was around the time hostilities br oke out, so it makes sense why it won. If you can dig up an image of the winner, I'd appreciate that! Also, thanks for the positivity. Thanks for the input, I guess it is just a small minority of people after all. Credit to Arch, I remember getting contacted to vote for this even though I wasn't even playing the game then rofl 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 Just now, hidude45454 said: Credit to Arch, I remember getting contacted to vote for this even though I wasn't even playing the game then rofl I bloody knew it! Hahahaha I remember it being more vulgar for some reason, but this is such a hallmark of why I fell into playing this odd, browser-based, strategy game. The community is very alive and has been for some time; thank you so much for sharing this, man! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Me Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, James Ironwood said: Yeah, don't know what was up with some of the inactivity. We weren't all like that, clearly, and I personally had a schedule. Regardless, all I suggested is that, given time, the sphere might have actually noticed there was a war going on and start to coordinate given enough beige time; TKR knows the predictable results of being outnumbered by active, militarized nations. I should know! I joined the game during "Knightfall" after all, and luckily I wasn't on your side. Dude you had 11 wars during Guns and Roses, all defensive, in a highly contested tier and 3 of those you peaced out. I would say it was us that were lucky you weren't on our side during Knightfall. Edited June 17, 2021 by Who Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Who Me said: Dude you had 11 wars during Guns and Roses, all defensive, in a highly contested tier and 3 of those you peaced out. I would say it was us that were lucky you weren't on our side during Knightfall. While I won every single war I fought in that GW, I was also a new player during Knightfall, so I agree with your assessment fully. 👍 FYI, it wasn't really "contested", but totally dominated by your coalition as my Milcom told me when I asked for help and coordination. I also decided to win as many wars as I could while losing as little as I could with my time. Now, if you are quite done with insulting the fact I have quite a few other activities outside the game, I'd like to move on from this forum. My little inquiry into exactly what happened this war is satisfied, thank you. :P Edited June 17, 2021 by James Ironwood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Poor rose, now they have their own inst/noctis lookalike nutjob. Downvoting even seems to upset him despite then no longer counting to reputation! Fun for everyone! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Me Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 4 hours ago, James Ironwood said: While I won every single war I fought in that GW, I was also a new player during Knightfall, so I agree with your assessment fully. 👍 FYI, it wasn't really "contested", but totally dominated by your coalition as my Milcom told me when I asked for help and coordination. I also decided to win as many wars as I could while losing as little as I could with my time. Now, if you are quite done with insulting the fact I have quite a few other activities outside the game, I'd like to move on from this forum. My little inquiry into exactly what happened this war is satisfied, thank you. :P Your side had an overwhelming advantage in numbers in that tier. If it wasn't contested but totally dominated by our side just shows how terrible your side is at war. The fact that your side rolled over and gave up speaks volumes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassia Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 4 hours ago, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: Poor rose, now they have their own inst/noctis lookalike nutjob. Downvoting even seems to upset him despite then no longer counting to reputation! Fun for everyone! I just wanna see if I'll get denounced, I didn't even read the post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherise Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 (edited) 26 was never held by Rose throughout the entire war. During the initial stages of the war, ranges from 25-32 were contested by Oasis and Minc, but the contested level fell to around 21-24 by the end of the war. Hollywood was firing into C14s with coherent assault groups by the very end, and I considered even C18s downdec bait by the time it was over. === In reality, the progress of the war was mostly that Hollywood seized the upper tier decisively, especially since Oasis couldn't rescue Rose's whale tier. Hollywood then began downdeclaring from secured tiers and constantly pushed the envelope down. I'd also say that the chart provided is somewhat suspect, given that other charts provided by your coalition show much less of a numerical advantage for the Rose coalition. Edit: This was a chart shown by one of your coalition milcom in RON. This shows that the numerical advantage was much less than what your chart indicated, and moreover, given the 3:1 ratio needed to updeclare, the Rose coalition only had a hard stopping point around the C13-14 point. Edited June 17, 2021 by Cherise 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 (edited) On 6/16/2021 at 10:13 PM, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: Poor rose, now they have their own inst/noctis lookalike nutjob. Downvoting even seems to upset him despite then no longer counting to reputation! Fun for everyone! Don't forget you did the same; also I denounced your nation for other reasons once I laid eyes upon it, buddy, and evidently half of your visitors did too! 😆 It isn't my fault that your page has something unappealing about it... On 6/17/2021 at 2:18 AM, Who Me said: Your side had an overwhelming advantage in numbers in that tier. If it wasn't contested but totally dominated by our side just shows how terrible your side is at war. The fact that your side rolled over and gave up speaks volumes. Refer to Cherise's chart.. this bar graph seems to be deeply flawed, who did you say made it? 🤔 Cherise's chart: On 6/16/2021 at 10:13 PM, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: Poor rose, now they have their own inst/noctis lookalike nutjob. Downvoting even seems to upset him despite then no longer counting to reputation! Fun for everyone! I am putting this remark here to replace a very stupid one made earlier. Peace, everyone, I'm out. Edited June 18, 2021 by James Ironwood 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majima Goro Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 1 hour ago, James Ironwood said: Don't forget you did the same; also I denounced your nation for other reasons once I laid eyes upon it, buddy, and evidently half of your visitors did too! 😆 It isn't my fault that your page has something unappealing about it... Refer to Cherise's chart.. this bar graph seems to be deeply flawed, who did you say made it? 🤔 Cherise's chart: By the by, way to call me a nutjob for opposing your opinions and disliking your nation. Is there any mental health issue going on that I should be made aware of? um i think you dont know how to read graphs The graph compares every city(c1,c2,c3.....) while the table compares tiers(0-10,10-20......) From the graph, it is clear that at certain city counts, IQ held a bigger numerical superiority while in others, it had less numbers than EMC. I'm pretty sure you can come to a similar result as on the table if you add the data from the graph. 3 hours ago, Cherise said: This was a chart shown by one of your coalition milcom in RON. This shows that the numerical advantage was much less than what your chart indicated, and moreover, given the 3:1 ratio needed to updeclare, the Rose coalition only had a hard stopping point around the C13-14 point. So you do agree IQ can never win unless it has more than 3x the numbers of the opposition? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maia Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 Oblivion was my favourite enemy. They were fighting very well. Ockey was TOP. Oh and I heard that Hidude is for sale. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiho Nishizumi Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 19 hours ago, James Ironwood said: NPO and manwha induced ragequitting. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post hidude45454 Posted June 17, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2021 Lmfao tfw Inst is using my charts so I guess I might as well chime in here No offense but Who Me's charts do look pretty inaccurate; they're pretty close on Roasis Inc's numbers but a lot of HW is super undercounted. My city-by-city at the start of the war amounted to this: (Sorry still on phone so can't crop them as easily lol) That being said, still no clue what Inst is on about and it is very clear to everyone that there is no 3:1 advantage required and that obviously we were never going to make C13-14 a battleground point. Furthermore, this point is moot because very early on it should be noted that there were no updeclare planes-only tactics being used, and conventional military meant everyone below C25 was max slotted and zeroed and C25-30 was feeling heavy pressure; I know that my C30 friends in CoTL were more or less zeroed and Oblivion was basically waiting for the worst to come (roughly a third of our alliance was zeroed or almost zeroed as well). In that case, the pure numerical advantage alone combined with much better beige cycling should've taken it. I will also note that in the spy war I fought, the tiers matter a bit less and there, I was constantly getting outnumbered between 2.5:1 and 3:1. One final point to James: my criticism is a bit more nuanced and shows to me a bit of a failure in military leadership. Round 1: failure from Rose to give the order to properly build to max military despite being at 5553 for several days. Round 2: failure from gov to assign you targets to drag down despite (I think?) looking to be on max military when C20-25 was still being heavily contested. As a result, you were taken down easily when beige expired and more or less used as statpadding. Round 3: more or less the same story. Rose leadership waffled between choosing milcom strategies; it seems by this point that y'all were switching over to planes only. The issue is planes only is totally useless when they again forget to assign you targets to drag down. People like Boyce were skilled enough to realize immediately to address the tactic using new strategies. (Side note, very rare you should ever be accepting peace on a defensive slot, shortens your time in beige and frees up critical slots for the opponent to declare on more people) And a final point: mentality is everything. If Rose gov just gives up and tells you you're totally outnumbered and there is nothing you can do, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That alone tells me why Rose performed so poorly despite having so many chances to hit where it hurt. When Oasis and Mystery joined in we were totally losing. It took the will to not take it sitting down to fight back. 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted June 17, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2021 29 minutes ago, hidude45454 said: And a final point: mentality is everything. If Rose gov just gives up and tells you you're totally outnumbered and there is nothing you can do, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That alone tells me why Rose performed so poorly despite having so many chances to hit where it hurt. When Oasis and Mystery joined in we were totally losing. It took the will to not take it sitting down to fight back. I agree with this, When both Oasis and Cam jumped in at the start of the war, I was like well we had a nice day where we were winning, but we got outplayed politically and we lose. Its too many nations to handle they will turn the tide. Then I did the Morf podcast, and listening to the other side talk about how they cant beat us, after I got off the show it was the first time where I actually was like.. holy shit we might actually be able to win. Here is the direct quote: Also removed the person who responded because I didn't get their permission to post this. It may or may not be secret HM leader. 1 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 @hidude45454 this ignores that planes only as a strat in this meta just reveals oneself to be an outdated fossil of a leader. I said this, and so did basically even the lowgov milcoms on CoTL when we saw it that they were desperate, because unless you're downdeclaring with those planes only it won't work. And sure enough it didn't, they sent c15s updeccing planes only into a c24 who had ZERO PLANES, but max ground. So anyway that c24 was eventually able to rebuild when their mid tier went into chaos and never got zeroed. whoopsie. @James Ironwoodhun you're trying too hard and the more you do that the worse it's gonna get. The people you're trying to be smarmy with are the ones who organized and called shots that resulted in your ass getting kicked, they know better how they did it than anyone. 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted June 17, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: @hidude45454 this ignores that planes only as a strat in this meta just reveals oneself to be an outdated fossil of a leader. This is lies, planes are still OP, and planes only is the best way to fight. Don't let her dissuade you guys. 7 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Leftbehind Posted June 17, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 17, 2021 3 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: Here is the direct quote: Also removed the person who responded because I didn't get their permission to post this. It may or may not be secret HM leader. Here we go again... 1 7 FORMER LEADER OF COTL. PLEASE GROW INTERNALLY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidude45454 Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: @hidude45454 this ignores that planes only as a strat in this meta just reveals oneself to be an outdated fossil of a leader. I said this, and so did basically even the lowgov milcoms on CoTL when we saw it that they were desperate, because unless you're downdeclaring with those planes only it won't work. And sure enough it didn't, they sent c15s updeccing planes only into a c24 who had ZERO PLANES, but max ground. This is absolutely correct and idk what Camelot especially was thinking trying to implement this. I was more pointing to the fact that for the longest time, about a third of Roasis Inc was operating on max mil, another third were doing planes only, and another third were either not hitting at all or had given up rebuilding entirely. It should've been their job to pick one plan, stick to it as a unified effort, and then actually get their members to carry it out; even a bad plan is better than no plan at all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Zei-Sakura Alsainn said: @hidude45454 this ignores that planes only as a strat in this meta just reveals oneself to be an outdated fossil of a leader. I said this, and so did basically even the lowgov milcoms on CoTL when we saw it that they were desperate, because unless you're downdeclaring with those planes only it won't work. And sure enough it didn't, they sent c15s updeccing planes only into a c24 who had ZERO PLANES, but max ground. So anyway that c24 was eventually able to rebuild when their mid tier went into chaos and never got zeroed. whoopsie. @James Ironwoodhun you're trying too hard and the more you do that the worse it's gonna get. The people you're trying to be smarmy with are the ones who organized and called shots that resulted in your ass getting kicked, they know better how they did it than anyone. If I have been smarmy, I apologize, it wasn't what I set out to do. I have this thing where I don't like getting talked down to for simply inquiring into a matter I evidently didn't know much about and now know more about. So, I'm sorry, but you should know that I denounced you in the game for different reasons than this forum, the forum is just how I found it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Ironwood Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 6 hours ago, Majima Goro said: um i think you dont know how to read graphs The graph compares every city(c1,c2,c3.....) while the table compares tiers(0-10,10-20......) From the graph, it is clear that at certain city counts, IQ held a bigger numerical superiority while in others, it had less numbers than EMC. I'm pretty sure you can come to a similar result as on the table if you add the data from the graph. So you do agree IQ can never win unless it has more than 3x the numbers of the opposition? No, I think it could. But this comes down to a number of factors including IRL shizz and commitment to the game; I heard that an important person in our milcom was camping as the war started and I was dogpiled. Regardless, our numerical superiority below C24 was a lot more than it was above that, generally, and lots of our folks at c26 might have not been militarized enough to make a difference, regardless of our numbers. On the same topic: Planes and tanks are the most important units to winning conventional wars and keeping people down because they can both attack planes, which are still the best units. I, personally was short on tanks, which is a mistake I admit to. 12 minutes ago, hidude45454 said: even a bad plan is better than no plan at all Very true! General Patton said something similar. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassia Posted June 17, 2021 Share Posted June 17, 2021 31 minutes ago, hidude45454 said: This is absolutely correct and idk what Camelot especially was thinking trying to implement this. I was more pointing to the fact that for the longest time, about a third of Roasis Inc was operating on max mil, another third were doing planes only, and another third were either not hitting at all or had given up rebuilding entirely. It should've been their job to pick one plan, stick to it as a unified effort, and then actually get their members to carry it out; even a bad plan is better than no plan at all. From what I saw the planes only strat was not helpful to them, a lot of their counters were so ineffectual that they ended up helping by sitting in our defensive slots. Some of these had no tanks and equivalent air. The updeclares were probably the best strategy they had at their disposal because it was really hard for us to cover anything below around 3000ns, but they didn't utilize that well. A few coordinated, maxed c15s could have dragged our c20s pretty easily I think. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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