BelgiumFury Posted February 22, 2021 Share Posted February 22, 2021 (edited) Have you ever had to deal with these pesky battles where you don't stand a chance to god and your opponent is going to roll over you like they are steamroller and you are a road needing to be steamrolled? Well fear not this might be the project for you. The Project Cost (Mine Research & Production Facility) 3000 Aluminum 1000 Munitions 500 Lead 20,000,000 Cash The Mines (Cost) Originally I imagined three different types of mines, although the core of this remains, producing three different types is making things too complex, hence the production will be merged into one category with one cost. 100 Munitions 50 Aluminum 50 Steel 50 Lead Mining Operations. Once you produced mines you will be able to place them for 3 Maps. You will be able to preform three operations: Place Anti-Tank Mines, Place Anti Personnel Mines, Place Naval Mines. All Mines will work similarly, but with somewhat different numbers. Anti tank mines will kill 7.5% of attacking tanks. Anti Personnel Mines will kill 15% of attacking soldiers Naval mines will kill 7.5% of attacking ships And at least 1 ship. When mines are placed they will damage enemy units before the actual battle calculation, this will be able to be used as a type of defense. Opponents will be able to see that you placed mines, but not which type of mines were placed. (later more on this) The Removal and Destruction of mines. When someone attacks your mines they'll see that the area was a minefield. So if your opponent just mined the ground it might be smarter to send smaller forces, but that might risk them building up.. Something else that happens when you attack a mined space is that the effect of mines will halve, and halve again (repeat over and over) this is to simulate the fact that mines get destroyed. Once again you will be able to send smaller forces, but, that is a risk of maybe losing the battle. If the defender (who placed) the mines attacks they will also be completely removed. The only way to get mine effectiveness up to 100% again is to lay new mines (and use maps + resources) The Fortification Synergy Fortification will improve the mine casualties by 25% (so 7.5 = 9.375), the combination of all these resources (mines + fortification) can turn a losing battle in a winning one, or, at least a costly one. Mine Intel Spy Op This spy op will show where a nation has put mines (in all wars). Planes? If this idea does get trough, there probably should be something similar for planes too. For balance reasons. ~~BelgiumFury (written in own name) PS: the numbers probably need some tweaking, I'm sorry, feel free to suggest. Edited February 22, 2021 by BelgiumFury 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maks Maximmillian Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 well as you said mines with fortification would be OP cause if your attacked by someone who only has soldiers (like arrgh) usually does you can just buy up soldiers and then lay a shit ton of mines and fortify and they wouldn't be able to do anything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JadenStar10 Posted March 19, 2021 Share Posted March 19, 2021 Sounds good, I think with more complicated war mechanics however, military action point usage and generation needs to also be edited. 1 Quote Coal Duke (Imperator Emeritus) of The Coal Mines Diety Emeritus of The Immortals, Patres Conscripti (President Emeritus) of the Independent Republic of Orange Nations, Lieutenant Emeritus of Black Skies, Imperator Emeritus of the Valyrian Freehold, Imperator Emeritus of the Divine Phoenix, Prefect Emeritus of Carthago, Regent Emeritus of the New Polar Order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefontaine Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 @Lucianus @Rockefeller I know you two are working on war system stuff. Not sure if you want to look at adding with coming overhauls. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raphael Posted March 23, 2021 Share Posted March 23, 2021 On 2/21/2021 at 11:20 PM, BelgiumFury said: Have you ever had to deal with these pesky battles where you don't stand a chance to god and your opponent is going to roll over you like they are steamroller and you are a road needing to be steamrolled? Well fear not this might be the project for you. The Project Cost (Mine Research & Production Facility) 3000 Aluminum 1000 Munitions 500 Lead 20,000,000 Cash The Mines (Cost) Originally I imagined three different types of mines, although the core of this remains, producing three different types is making things too complex, hence the production will be merged into one category with one cost. 100 Munitions 50 Aluminum 50 Steel 50 Lead Mining Operations. Once you produced mines you will be able to place them for 3 Maps. You will be able to preform three operations: Place Anti-Tank Mines, Place Anti Personnel Mines, Place Naval Mines. All Mines will work similarly, but with somewhat different numbers. Anti tank mines will kill 7.5% of attacking tanks. Anti Personnel Mines will kill 15% of attacking soldiers Naval mines will kill 7.5% of attacking ships And at least 1 ship. When mines are placed they will damage enemy units before the actual battle calculation, this will be able to be used as a type of defense. Opponents will be able to see that you placed mines, but not which type of mines were placed. (later more on this) The Removal and Destruction of mines. When someone attacks your mines they'll see that the area was a minefield. So if your opponent just mined the ground it might be smarter to send smaller forces, but that might risk them building up.. Something else that happens when you attack a mined space is that the effect of mines will halve, and halve again (repeat over and over) this is to simulate the fact that mines get destroyed. Once again you will be able to send smaller forces, but, that is a risk of maybe losing the battle. If the defender (who placed) the mines attacks they will also be completely removed. The only way to get mine effectiveness up to 100% again is to lay new mines (and use maps + resources) The Fortification Synergy Fortification will improve the mine casualties by 25% (so 7.5 = 9.375), the combination of all these resources (mines + fortification) can turn a losing battle in a winning one, or, at least a costly one. Mine Intel Spy Op This spy op will show where a nation has put mines (in all wars). Planes? If this idea does get trough, there probably should be something similar for planes too. For balance reasons. ~~BelgiumFury (written in own name) PS: the numbers probably need some tweaking, I'm sorry, feel free to suggest. I like this concept and the thought/coherency put into this suggestion. A few thoughts/critiques: As you pointed out - attackers can attack with fewer units to nullify the impact of the mines. So the mines would either need to add to the "defense" of a nation thus necessitating additional units or risk a failed attack. The problem this creates is that it allows for people who truly lose a war to give a final F-U and increase resource consumption for the victor. A problem we already are trying to solve as, in many/most cases, it's actually more costly to a winning side to continue to win after depleting an opponent's military than it is for the losers being beaten. I feel this would add to this effect in a negative way. A common complaint right now is that, as mentioned above, winners feel like they are punished for winning. Gas/Munis consumption, economic opportunity cost, risk of giving beige time, etc. I don't want to further add onto that. However, even with all that said I really like your idea and am myself a big proponent of fair warfare and giving a "loser" some recourse. I think the current system is unbalanced and needs to be seriously worked over to provide a fair opportunity for everyone fighting in a war - while also providing a clear avenue for victory. Both of which it currently fails to do. We're currently working on a beige-system overhaul (again) and Prefontaine has released the numbers in other threads that will be put into place probably sooner than the beige rework for just general military tweaks. I will definitely be taking this idea with me into those discussions - Likely as an addition/synergy to the Fortify mechanic. I hope this doesn't come across as a dismissal or "average dev team post" - Please keep throwing ideas out. I like to read through them and link/discuss them with the team as we go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgiumFury Posted May 24, 2021 Author Share Posted May 24, 2021 On 3/23/2021 at 3:19 PM, Roberts said: I like this concept and the thought/coherency put into this suggestion. A few thoughts/critiques: As you pointed out - attackers can attack with fewer units to nullify the impact of the mines. So the mines would either need to add to the "defense" of a nation thus necessitating additional units or risk a failed attack. The problem this creates is that it allows for people who truly lose a war to give a final F-U and increase resource consumption for the victor. A problem we already are trying to solve as, in many/most cases, it's actually more costly to a winning side to continue to win after depleting an opponent's military than it is for the losers being beaten. I feel this would add to this effect in a negative way. A common complaint right now is that, as mentioned above, winners feel like they are punished for winning. Gas/Munis consumption, economic opportunity cost, risk of giving beige time, etc. I don't want to further add onto that. However, even with all that said I really like your idea and am myself a big proponent of fair warfare and giving a "loser" some recourse. I think the current system is unbalanced and needs to be seriously worked over to provide a fair opportunity for everyone fighting in a war - while also providing a clear avenue for victory. Both of which it currently fails to do. We're currently working on a beige-system overhaul (again) and Prefontaine has released the numbers in other threads that will be put into place probably sooner than the beige rework for just general military tweaks. I will definitely be taking this idea with me into those discussions - Likely as an addition/synergy to the Fortify mechanic. I hope this doesn't come across as a dismissal or "average dev team post" - Please keep throwing ideas out. I like to read through them and link/discuss them with the team as we go. Hey, Im sorry for the increadibly slow reply but the forum didnt give me a notification of your reply. Your response seems completly valid. To your critique points I have a question however; would this situation be solved if it was instead some kind of multiplier / bonus to already existing units? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiki Mod Dr Rush Posted May 26, 2021 Wiki Mod Share Posted May 26, 2021 The core concept is solid, but it should be part of larger expansion of the war system. As a project this moves instantly to the must have pile and there are already too many of those. 1 Quote 23:38 Skable that's why we don't want Rose involved, so we can take the m all for ourselves 23:39 [] but Mensa is the cute girl at the school dance and she's only dancing with us right now to get our friend jealous 23:39 [] If Rose comes in and gives Mensa what she wants, she'll just toss us aside and forget we ever existed 23:39 zombie_lanae yeah I do hope we can keep having them all to ourselves 23:40 zombie_lanae I know it's selfish but I want all their love 6:55 PM <+Isolatar> Praise Dio Pubstomper|BNC [20:01:55] Rose wouldn't plan a hit on Mensa because it would be !@#$ing stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelgiumFury Posted May 27, 2021 Author Share Posted May 27, 2021 On 5/26/2021 at 3:10 PM, Dr Rush said: The core concept is solid, but it should be part of larger expansion of the war system. As a project this moves instantly to the must have pile and there are already too many of those. Fair point. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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