HeroofTime55 Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 3 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said: C'mon man. You can do better than this. At least I hope you can anyway. If not, keep on truckin. You wanted to go down this path, and now you don't want to play anymore. 1 Quote Worst Poster Ever (2011) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorSoul Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 21 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said: Although I do freely admit the common reaction amongst a decent portion of our side, or at least amongst the oldies I speak to anyway, is a feeling of pity for TKR being dragged into yet another war courtesy of tS. I, for one, am so gratified to have your pity. 🤮 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRM Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 1 minute ago, WarriorSoul said: I, for one, am so gratified to have your pity. 🤮 You can be sarcastic about that comment of Charles', but many feel that way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Adrienne Posted November 26, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 26, 2020 There's so much wrong with everything you just said, Charles, and it contradicts so many of your side's points, that I don't even know where to begin. Thanks for surpassing Phoenyx for most amusing post of the evening. 2 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeeeet Ronny D Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) On 11/23/2020 at 3:46 PM, Phoenyx said: But I'm sure you can understand that many people here are eager to hear what the answer is. you can stop the video at around the 32 second mark Edited November 26, 2020 by Sweeeeet Ronny D 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 14 minutes ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said: you can stop the video at around the 32 second mark Lol :-p. I'd actually been thinking you might well be right. Then I heard something today that got me to think that maybe the truth will finally be revealed for all to see. It may take a while, but that's alright, I can wait here impatiently :-p. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Bolivar Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Adrienne said: There's so much wrong with everything you just said, Charles, and it contradicts so many of your side's points, that I don't even know where to begin. Thanks for surpassing Phoenyx for most amusing post of the evening. But you don't agree with my side's points either? 🤔 But it's understandable why you would disagree. Edited November 26, 2020 by Charles Bolivar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 33 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said: But you don't agree with my side's points either? 🤔 But it's understandable why you would disagree. I don't have to agree to notice all the inconsistencies between your last post and the points they've been making. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Prefonteen Posted November 26, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 26, 2020 10 hours ago, Charles Bolivar said: Sooooo what you are saying is each of these three spheres should have instead let quack attack and roll them individually? Come on man, you know better than that and it's simply not how the game operates. Alliances/spheres find common causes against mutual and potential/actual threats and group their spheres together for specific strategic purposes. You know this better than most because you yourself did it plenty enough times against the likes of Rose and UPN back in the day. You even did so midway during the last war when you aligned tS's war efforts against NPO with the rest of us despite the actual reasoning for tS being in the war differing significantly thanks to NPO being stupid. Does it suck being dogpiled or being significantly outnumbered? Hell yeah, and I feel the pain because more than a few of us went through it during NPOLT for 6-8 months. But let's not try and paint this as something which it isn't. Much like how you blame chaos/ketog/HM's FA decisions last war for alienating tS from supporting us against IQ, it's tS's own FA actions and decision making which have resulted in today's state of affairs. Sure, you can argue indirect or direct actions of tS being the cause, but it all amounts to the same at the end of the day. If a coalition builds up against a sphere there are always simply two factors involved. The first being 1) that sphere did something to cause said coalition forming , and 2) said sphere also did not take enough corrective action to prevent the aforementioned coalition arising. So it's all well and good to come out here and scream things about coalitions forming but you know the rules of the game better than most. I get why you are saying it, namely because you need to paint some narrative which supports your own cause but the only people buying into it are the already converted hence the radio silence mostly from our side 🤷♂️ Also, done this on a phone so forgive the grammar 👍🤣 Good luck old friend. t$ and TKR's mistake has been trying to appease you lot rather than cynically doing what you've been accusing us of doing since january/february. I agree on that being a mistake. It absolutely changes nothing about the hypocrisy and double dealing involved. It's been made clear that short of us breaking up, very little (if anything) would have prevented the course of events that unfolded. And (but this is a matter of guesswork), even if we did break up, I would absolutely be surprised if certain parties did not swing for portions of our sphere anyway *because grudges presented as DyNaMiSm*. Further "corrective action" was frankly not tenable as we were locked in our position the moment the premature screeching began. 7 hours ago, Charles Bolivar said: I somewhat agree tbh, it is somewhat hypocritical, but then again I always regarded the notion of minispheres as idealistic nonsense only a fool could actually believe possible. I said it during the last war when people made a fuss about NPO defending BK for much the same reason which I found incredulous. How could anyone have reasonably entertained the notion that NPO would not have defended BK? And I say much the same now, we can talk about moralism, ethics, dogpiles, coalitions etc till the sun comes up and goes back down again but it's largely irrelevant to the fundamental basics behind this war in that a coalition of varying interests felt threatened by quack for whatever individual reasons and banded together for their mutual defence. That's rational behaviour and any alliance leader who attempted to tell their members " sorry guys, we are getting rolled by quack, we would have averted said rolling if we had joined up with other folks but I wanted to make minispheres instead" should be couped immediately for being a moron. So yes, we have hypocrites on one side and fools on the other. Much the same as any other war in that regards. I'll again note that I don't disagree with your assessment. Perhaps i've grown soft; we were given the impression by various parties (and hence our outrage) that they wanted to do things differently. Masks have come off in that respect. It was less about us (at least from t$' POV) "wanting" to make minispheres work. We did not want to take the villain role yet again however, so we limited our political movements (see: treaties etc.) and refused to opportunistically swing for single spheres on a few occasions when it would have been expedient. Strategically a mistake, I agree. Live and learn. 4 hours ago, Charles Bolivar said: To be honest, TKR is in this war alongside tS for much the same reasons as to why the opposing coalition banded together against quack. Mutual interests and defence being best served by working with others of similar mind. Although I do freely admit the common reaction amongst a decent portion of our side, or at least amongst the oldies I speak to anyway, is a feeling of pity for TKR being dragged into yet another war courtesy of tS. Sipping on tS koolaid is the common phrase. Like I get why, if TKR didn't ride alongside tS there would be a readily apparent belief within TKR that they would be next on the chopping block. That would be the rational thought process so it really does benefit TKR's interests to side with tS during this war. but in that case, TKR would be, and most likely is for that matter, utilising the same logic as a portion of our coalition anyway. Hypocrites on both sides it would appear perhaps? And yes, I suppose you do have the right to feel foolish. Lets not pretend it is a badge of honour though. There is no honour in having your membership pay the price for the idealistic notions of a few. C'mon man. You can do better than this. At least I hope you can anyway. If not, keep on truckin. At this point you've lost me charles. Either this is a war of t$' making, dragging poor TKR along with us. Or we are fools who got fricked by "multiple parties banding together out of mutual interest in a war that was gonna happen either way". Pick one. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micchan Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Charles Bolivar said: a coalition of varying interests felt threatened by quack for whatever individual reasons and banded together for their mutual defence Makes sense for HM and Rose, but Swamp last time I checked was the biggest sphere, the worst thing that can happen to them is a fair fight with Quack, and they should wish for a fun fight, not fear it I won't mind if Rose joined forces with HM for this war, no CB and just the intent to make it a fair fight, but it has to be a thing on the spot, not pre-planned with a paperless tie Paperless ties not only breaks the game because we base our politics on the ties we can see but they implies that no one involved is said tie is going to attack the others so HM, Rose and Swamp can sleep well knowing that the only war can come from Quack and when it happens is going to be a dogpile in their favor And btw the best solution here was to talk, probably talk a lot, and find a solution to the "Quack is too big" problem, we would point out that Swamp is big too, maybe if lucky we would agree for two split for both Quack and Swamp or the creation of a third sphere with some Quack and some Swamp, you would create a world with 5-6 spheres of similar size ready to cause some fun war Instead we had much less talk and more paperless ties that cause a no fun war and don't solve the situation, and the worst thing is that we are likely going to get another NAP Edited November 26, 2020 by Micchan more typo 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 22 minutes ago, Micchan said: Makes sense for HM and Rose, but Swamp last time I checked was the biggest sphere, the worst thing that can happen to them is a fair fight with Quack, and they should wish for a fun fight, not fear it I'm wondering how you're classifying bigger sphere. Does it take into account player activity? All I know is that Kaz, a leader in TFP, certainly didn't see it the way you seem to be portraying it. Quoting from something he told me: **Swamp vs Quack would have been a blood bath and had I ever even been approached about such a thing, I would have opposed it with every fiber of my being because it would have lead my fellow alliance and bloc members to the slaughterhouse.** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 2 hours ago, Phoenyx said: I'm wondering how you're classifying bigger sphere. Does it take into account player activity? All I know is that Kaz, a leader in TFP, certainly didn't see it the way you seem to be portraying it. Quoting from something he told me: **Swamp vs Quack would have been a blood bath and had I ever even been approached about such a thing, I would have opposed it with every fiber of my being because it would have lead my fellow alliance and bloc members to the slaughterhouse.** Yes that's the party line. "Swamps internal policies are loose so our size doesn't count as much as yours and so we're totally justified dogpiling you while claiming you're oversized!" is a non argument. Also notable yet often forgotten: rose/hm can trade blows with us on a per member basis much easier. Hm being included on swamp side far evens the odds. Same with tcw. Moreover, had hm been allowed to go on the offensive, their tiering/down declares would have made it a blood bath for quacks upper tier. Opposition far downplays its ability to fight back. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Emperor Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 On 11/25/2020 at 3:48 AM, Prefonteen said: I want to respond to this seriously but I feel it will trigger you into another flailing frenzy of faulty deduction and flawed logic, oh great one. So I will yield instead. If you keep saying things like "Faulty deduction" and "Flawed Logic" when referring to statements that are none of those things, but simply against your narrative, people will likely start seeing you as a joke IMO. I suspect at some point your constant lies and attempts at gaslighting will take their toll 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 1 minute ago, The God Emperor of Mankind said: If you keep saying things like "Faulty deduction" and "Flawed Logic" when referring to statements that are none of those things, but simply against your narrative, people will likely start seeing you as a joke IMO. I suspect at some point your constant lies and attempts at gaslighting will take their toll https://examples.yourdictionary.com/alliteration-examples-for-kids.html Jfc you're no fun. As for lies: once again you've brought forward nothing but incomprehensible drivel. There is no gaslighting or lying involved on my end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micchan Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 4 hours ago, Phoenyx said: I'm wondering how you're classifying bigger sphere. Does it take into account player activity? All I know is that Kaz, a leader in TFP, certainly didn't see it the way you seem to be portraying it. Quoting from something he told me: **Swamp vs Quack would have been a blood bath and had I ever even been approached about such a thing, I would have opposed it with every fiber of my being because it would have lead my fellow alliance and bloc members to the slaughterhouse.** Number of nations and score (assuming everyone is militarized), there is no subjective way to evaluate it, if you don't think you have the quality then it's your fault "We are less active and we are less competent so we're allowed to be more" is something I've heard from a certain block in the past 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benfro Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Micchan said: Number of nations and score (assuming everyone is militarized), there is no subjective way to evaluate it, if you don't think you have the quality then it's your fault "We are less active and we are less competent so we're allowed to be more" is something I've heard from a certain block in the past Additionally, Quack opted to include HedgeMoney in the happenings, creating an already imbalanced front against us. So can't just lean on "well Swamp was less active and less experienced." RoseLot joined because of a silent paperless MDP that had no need other than feeling left out. And yes I skipped some posts. I'm trying to keep this relatively on topic instead of dealing with Fist's personal attacks against Parti. Edited November 26, 2020 by Benfro 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 5 hours ago, Micchan said: Number of nations and score (assuming everyone is militarized), there is no subjective way to evaluate it, if you don't think you have the quality then it's your fault "We are less active and we are less competent so we're allowed to be more" is something I've heard from a certain block in the past I will step back a bit and admit that I don't know how Kaz was evaluating the Swamp. In any case, just because some players are more casual doesn't mean that they should be considered less competent. However, their less active nature must be accounted for during wars. 2 hours ago, Sval said: Your desperation sustains us. They may not be desperate, but I still thought this was funny :-p. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 2 minutes ago, Phoenyx said: I will step back a bit and admit that I don't know how Kaz was evaluating the Swamp. In any case, just because some players are more casual doesn't mean that they should be considered less competent. However, their less active nature must be accounted for during wars. You can account for it in your planning, sure. But to expect outside parties to downsize despite you having more numbers in the first place, because "otherwise they are a hegemony" is absolutely ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 26, 2020 Author Share Posted November 26, 2020 Just now, Prefonteen said: You can account for it in your planning, sure. But to expect outside parties to downsize despite you having more numbers in the first place, because "otherwise they are a hegemony" is absolutely ridiculous. You may have noticed, but I have never been all that interested in all this talk of hegemony and size. I think in terms of threat- it seems to me that HM, TCW, Swamp and Roes all thought that your Coalition was becoming too threatening. Had you tried to find out if HM/TCW/Swamp were really going to attack you or if Boyce had misunderstood things, I think this war could have been avoided. Would another one have happened in the not too distant future? Possibly. However, such a war might have been a lot different than this one. In any case, I think we can all agree that FA is pretty important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Micchan Posted November 26, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 26, 2020 2 hours ago, Phoenyx said: but I have never been all that interested in all this talk of hegemony and size. How many threads would you make if you were interested? 1 13 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayor Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 Fist escaped the seniors care home in Pantheon and is not on his prescribed medication. Insane Old man at large in Orbis community. Seriously though, everyone just don't engage fist or quote him, I don't even think he knows what he is rambling on about all the time. I hated TKR and tS for so long, but now with Fist hating them as well... it's just not so cool anymore imho. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakai Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 On 11/22/2020 at 4:49 PM, Phoenyx said: I have switched Alliances a few times, but I have always been in the Swampy Rose Hedge. I believed and continue to believe that you guys are in the right in this war. However, it saddens me that our side doesn't seem that interested in clearing things up. Today, I spoke to a HM Leader. Not #1, second in command. Anyway, they seemed skeptical that Tyrion and Kaz were being honest when they said that they had no knowledge of any plan to attack Quack first. What is particularly irritating about this is that it was a Hedge Leader who made the statement that Ronny took to mean that yes, Swamp did want to attack first, although apparently even he believes that the plan probably fizzled out quickly. Now some know that I spoke briefly to Tyrion before he posted here and said that we hadn't said much and that was completely true. Since then, we have talked a bit more. I won't go into most of this, but one thing I felt I have to say at this point is that I brought up Ronny's HM leader source and Tyrion believes that this source may in fact have just been talking about the Swampy Rose Hedge defensive Coalition that actually happened. HM should really get on this, find out and at least talk to Tyrion about this. Because the way I see this, Tyrion and Kaz (TFP) have really not been given a fair shake here. It's been a while since I found a good source of manure for my garden that doesn't cost a fortune. You seem to exude it on command and in vast quantities. If you live in or near a heavily agronomic community you could make a fortune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 6 minutes ago, Malakai said: It's been a while since I found [long line of insults] Whenever you want to talk peace, we'll be here for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TRM Posted November 28, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 28, 2020 32 minutes ago, Phoenyx said: Whenever you want to talk peace, we'll be here for you. We? Lmao 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenyx Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 50 minutes ago, Orcinus Orca said: We? Lmao You really think I'm the only one on our side who's a bit tired of this war? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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