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A sad truth about the Swampy Rose Hedge...


Phoenyx
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38 minutes ago, Phoenyx said:

 

I care because I care about the truth. I think that Swamp has really gotten a bad rap with all this talk that we were planning on attacking Quack first. 

There is no "truth" which will ever satisfy either side. One side felt threatened by the looming hegemony of the other and took collectivist measures to defend themselves  and/or maintain their own security. The other side got wind of such measures and launched an attack. Trying to find some semblance of "truth" in what is a series of Realpolitik decisions made by parties on both sides is just a futile waste of time since it has no relevance or value. Both sides were correct in their actions since both sides were placing the welfare of their members first and foremost. The rest is history.

The moralist rubbish being peddled about is nothing more than strawman justification for whatever narrative is being pushed by either side.

 

Edited by Charles Bolivar
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Just now, Charles Bolivar said:

There is no "truth" which will ever satisfy either side. One side felt threatened by the looming hegemony of the other and took collectivist measures to defend themselves  and/or maintain their own security. The other side got wind of such measures and launched an attack. Trying to find some semblance of "truth" in what is a series of Realpolitik decisions made by parties on both sides is just a futile waste of time since it has no relevance of value.

 

 

I am only looking to clarify one specific point- whether or not Swamp had planned to initiate a first strike on Quack. I firmly believe that all the good evidence strongly suggests that they weren't, but many still remain unpersuaded, so I have pointed to people, in this case a certain HM leader and Boyce, where more evidence should be available one way or the other.

 

I agree that the forces currently fighting Quack felt threatened by Quack and that this is why they took collectivist measures to defend themselves against them if attacked. The key here is that they were -defensive- measures. I firmly believe that no sphere had a serious plan to attack quack first. 

 

As to why I think it has value, I'd say that this war was started based on false information and it is continuing because people continue to believe said false information. There is a way of verifying if the information is false or not, though, and that's to go back to the sources of the information. 

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The war is ongoing because of different considerations by either party, and will continue to go on regardless of how much effort you try to pour in. Because many if not most of those said considerations are independent from that subject matter.

You could write a thesis for your graduation on this subject, and it'd not move the needle the slightest bit.

Which is part the reason why people have told you to quit your self-assigned Messianic task. It's a waste if time that won't lead anywhere.

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1 minute ago, Shiho Nishizumi said:

The war is ongoing because of different considerations by either party, and will continue to go on regardless of how much effort you try to pour in. Because many if not most of those said considerations are independent from that subject matter.

You could write a thesis for your graduation on this subject, and it'd not move the needle the slightest bit.

Which is part the reason why people have told you to quit your self-assigned Messianic task. It's a waste if time that won't lead anywhere.

 

We may have to agree to disagree on that.

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42 minutes ago, Phoenyx said:

We may have to agree to disagree on that.

Alright bub, you're persistent I'll give you that. At some point, you really will have punched clean through to the far side of "absolute pest" and become something truly impressive... and annoying. But impressively so. That'll take a heckuva long time though, but I'm pretty sure it can be done (since I've done it myself 😎)

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3 hours ago, Vein said:

Guys, who is this wall you guys are talking to? 

punches Phoenyx wall.

Vein inflicted 5 damage to the wall.

Guys! this is more efficient and fun! Hit his ass no balls https://politicsandwar.com/nation/id=242299

not enough infra

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No one unites both sides of this war the same way Phoenyx does. Good on you sir and/or madam for bringing together folks on both sides of the conflict to facepalm at your comments together.

Cheers to peace.

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3 minutes ago, Hodor said:

 

Now, here me out: let's take a shot for every time Phoenyx says "Tyrion" and then, being in an utterly inebriated state, we can manufacture a better, more entertaining narrative, stumble upon peace through deep and personal talks in the ladies restroom, and settle everything over late night pizza.

I don't drink.

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13 hours ago, Phoenyx said:

I care because I care about the truth. I think that Swamp has really gotten a bad rap with all this talk that we were planning on attacking Quack first. 

No, that's not it.  You care because you like to hear yourself talk, and/or out of a desire to warp the truth to your preconceived views (aka whatever Tyrion told you to believe)

Tyrion.... Oh yes, that's a fun one.  You see, after NPO was eliminated, after that utterly toxic war was over, TI came to Quack, asking us to merge our spheres into a super hegemony.  We refused his offer, out of an interest in a multi-polar world, and hence TI turned around and founded Swamp.  Tyrion has ambitions.  Because we didn't join him, he considered us to be "in the way," and hence this plot was formulated.

Swamp attacked TCW and hit Arrgh in aggressive conflicts prior to this war.  It's clear the path Swamp, TI, and Tyrion intend to take.  It is not a defensive path.  Nor is it rooted in any desire for a genuine multi-polar world, as Quack mistakenly thought achievable.

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15 minutes ago, HeroofTime55 said:

No, that's not it.  You care because you like to hear yourself talk, and/or out of a desire to warp the truth to your preconceived views (aka whatever Tyrion told you to believe)

Tyrion.... Oh yes, that's a fun one.  You see, after NPO was eliminated, after that utterly toxic war was over, TI came to Quack, asking us to merge our spheres into a super hegemony.  We refused his offer, out of an interest in a multi-polar world, and hence TI turned around and founded Swamp.  Tyrion has ambitions.  Because we didn't join him, he considered us to be "in the way," and hence this plot was formulated.

Swamp attacked TCW and hit Arrgh in aggressive conflicts prior to this war.  It's clear the path Swamp, TI, and Tyrion intend to take.  It is not a defensive path.  Nor is it rooted in any desire for a genuine multi-polar world, as Quack mistakenly thought achievable.

Good.

I hope Tyrion shakes things up. We need some ambition around these parts to give the status quo a good shaking.

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punches wall

Vero deals 0 damage

it would seem this wall has a brain thicker than steel and won't accept the fact he's irrelevant

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Cry harder

Wanted dead or alive for the following crimes:

Thoughts of attempting rebellion, leaking, being a femboy, being a weeb

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16 hours ago, Phoenyx said:

 

I care because I care about the truth. I think that Swamp has really gotten a bad rap with all this talk that we were planning on attacking Quack first. 

Forgot to comment on this before but Swamp has had a bad rap before this war started so try again pal. Also if you care so much about the truth try being objective for once instead of sucking off TyrionÂ đŸ˜¶

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Cry harder

Wanted dead or alive for the following crimes:

Thoughts of attempting rebellion, leaking, being a femboy, being a weeb

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1 minute ago, Vero said:

Forgot to comment on this before but Swamp has had a bad rap before this war started so try again pal. Also if you care so much about the truth try being objective for once instead of sucking off TyrionÂ đŸ˜¶

-.-

 

I think I may have figured it out now. Basically, I think that the HM leader who talked to Ronnie about Swamp wanting to "counter Quack's growth" was just talking about the defensive Coalition that Swamp fully admits happened. Ronnie misinterpreted this and said what he said. He actually said that he believed that the plan fizzled out after he hadn't heard about it again, when it was more that the plan he had in mind was just a misinterpretation. At this point, he may have realized his mistake but doesn't want to admit it as he may think it makes his leadership look weak or something to that effect.

 

Partisan may still believe Boyce's claim that HM/TCW/Swamp was probably going to attack Quack in early December in theory, but in practice, he doesn't really seem to be defending him, so I'm thinking he may have doubts at this point. That's pretty much it.

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