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A (Not So) Brief Note on the Narrative


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21 minutes ago, Grave said:

Ah yes, another  "we'll continue to twist your words even after being proven wrong. " 

You are preaching to the choir, everyone sees right through your BS.

 

Of course, because your unwarranted aggression has proven that that we should've just been open about us protecting eachother from getting rolled out of the game by Quack all along. /end sarcasm 

@Lord TyrionPlease clarify which of you two is representing TI's view on things. Are you bs-ing us or is your dog off his leash?

Edited by Prefonteen
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25 minutes ago, Prefonteen said:

@Lord TyrionPlease clarify which of you two is representing TI's view on things. Are you bs-ing us or is your dog off his leash?

I may be mistaken, but it -seems- as if Grave is just trying to say that the reason they weren't exactly running to the rooftops to proclaim that they had established a mutual defense pact against Quack is that they suspected that if they did, Quack would come after them. Which kind of seems to have happened anyway.

 

Now I grant you, Sphinx' log really does make it seem like Swamp, TCW and HM were going to hit you guys first, but the more I've read, the more I think that at best, Sphinx misunderstood what these Coalitions were actually trying to do (a protective pact, not an offensive one) and at worst was being purposefully deceitful. Still hoping that RSD's fellow HM leader could clarify what he heard from Swamp and perhaps even who he heard it from. To date, however, we don't have -anyone- from Swamp saying they were actually contemplating an offensive pact.

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5 minutes ago, Phoenyx said:

Now I grant you, Sphinx' log really does make it seem like Swamp, TCW and HM were going to hit you guys first, but the more I've read, the more I think that at best, Sphinx misunderstood what these Coalitions were actually trying to do (a protective pact, not an offensive one) and at worst was being purposefully deceitful. Still hoping that RSD's fellow HM leader could clarify what he heard from Swamp and perhaps even who he heard it from. To date, however, we don't have -anyone- from Swamp saying they were actually contemplating an offensive pact.

Gotta jump in here to say - are you, @Phoenyx, intending to have alternating posts until this thread dies? You seem to come in and restate the same questions regardless of what is said.

But you are right. Wouldn't it be nice if someone from HM's leadership or Swamp's leadership could come and publicly state their views to clarify how all of this happened? And, again, as it feels like half of my allied leadership has stated recently, a defensive and offensive pact are amorphous and almost identical in execution. Even more valuable here is the silent agreements. We have fought many a lengthy war over secret ties and they never end well.

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15 minutes ago, Shiho Nishizumi said:

Grave.

I suppose that, through what I can only assume to be unrestrained imagination and rampant internal propaganda applied in equal measure, we've done a full circle, and are back to Quack = IQ.

I wasn't around when this IQ group was around, but it seems that most if not all don't really mean that. However, there is no time like the present to try to mend fences.

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16 minutes ago, Benfro said:

Gotta jump in here to say - are you, @Phoenyx, intending to have alternating posts until this thread dies? You seem to come in and restate the same questions regardless of what is said.

But you are right. Wouldn't it be nice if someone from HM's leadership or Swamp's leadership could come and publicly state their views to clarify how all of this happened? 

 

I agree, I am honing in on the same questions and issues again and again because I think that the answers to these questions and the resolution of these issues would resolve this war.

 

Anyway, I hadn't previously known that Tyrion, as the leader of the Immortals Alliance, was also in the Swamp- and given the fact that his Alliance is the largest one in Swamp (also the second largest in the game period points wise), as Partisan pointed out, it stands to reason that he would be one of the strongest voices in Swamp, if not the strongest.  

 

Here is the last thing he said in the forums, back on Tuesday:

On 11/10/2020 at 3:06 PM, Lord Tyrion said:

I thought we established over a week ago we had a defensive agreement in place with Rose for Quack aggression?  ...

 

In a private conversation with him that I had more recently, Tyrion seems amicable to the idea of peace, but he doesn't seem to think that the parties are ready for that yet.

16 minutes ago, Benfro said:

And, again, as it feels like half of my allied leadership has stated recently, a defensive and offensive pact are amorphous and almost identical in execution. Even more valuable here is the silent agreements. We have fought many a lengthy war over secret ties and they never end well.

Sure, defensive pacts can turn into offensive ones, but I think it's safe to say that the moment Coalitions start attacking other Coalitions just because those Coalitions are making those types of pacts, well, I think that most Coalitions would agree that seems to be a fairly aggressive move. I certainly see it that way at any rate. 

Edited by Phoenyx
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2 minutes ago, Phoenyx said:

 

I agree, I am honing in on the same questions and issues again and again because I think that the answers to these questions and the resolution of these issues would resolve this war.

 

Anyway, I hadn't previously known that Tyrion, as the leader of the Immortals Alliance, was also in the Swamp- and given the fact that his Alliance is the largest one in Swamp (also the second largest in the game period points wise), as Partisan pointed out, it stands to reason that he would be one of the strongest voices in Swamp, if not the strongest.  

Here is the last thing he said in the forums, back on Tuesday:

 

In a private conversation with him that I had more recently, Tyrion seems amicable to the idea of peace, but he doesn't seem to think that the parties are ready for that yet.

 

Don't frame it like we've been talking a lot.  You wrote to me for the very first time yesterday trying to get info and literally all I responded with was:
"Peace talks will only occur when all blocs are ready to come to the table, it won't be brokered separately or by one party.  I think we're still a little bit away from those talks occurring based on what I'm seeing, but we'll get there at some point." 

I didn't write you any further than that, so don't suggest otherwise.  You also minutes after my response to you going and posting to the forums about it, so not really somebody people will want to share info with when you do that.  I don't know why you're trying to play mediator for the parties.  I've stated our position on what happened here and privately in DMs to the Quack leadership.  Peace will happen when all parties (beyond Swamp/Quack) are ready to work on it.  

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14 minutes ago, Lord Tyrion said:

Don't frame it like we've been talking a lot.  You wrote to me for the very first time yesterday trying to get info and literally all I responded with was:
"Peace talks will only occur when all blocs are ready to come to the table, it won't be brokered separately or by one party.  I think we're still a little bit away from those talks occurring based on what I'm seeing, but we'll get there at some point." 

I didn't write you any further than that, so don't suggest otherwise.  You also minutes after my response to you going and posting to the forums about it, so not really somebody people will want to share info with when you do that.  I don't know why you're trying to play mediator for the parties.  I've stated our position on what happened here and privately in DMs to the Quack leadership.  Peace will happen when all parties (beyond Swamp/Quack) are ready to work on it.  

 

I hadn't intended it to sound as if we'd spoken a lot. As to why I want to play mediator, it's a role I like to play. I certainly understand the wish for private mediation, but I just feel that when it comes to public mediation, Swamp had essentially dropped off the map since Tuesday with your last post. Anyway, I'm glad that you made this appearance, even if you were not quite happy with the way I presented things. I also agree that peace will come when all the parties are ready. But speaking as one very small member of the Swamp Coalition, I want to do my part to hasten that event. You of all people should appreciate this scene from Game of Thrones:

 

Edited by Phoenyx
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1 hour ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

Okay bub, you've now crossed the line from "confused newbie looking for answers" to "busybody getting involved in things way above your head" and in fact graduated to "actual annoyance".

For your own sake: Cease and desist.

Well, I suppose it was about time that the other side got upset with me for things I've said. Anyway, if people don't want to listen to what I have to say, that's their choice to make.

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4 hours ago, Prefonteen said:

@Lord TyrionPlease clarify which of you two is representing TI's view on things. Are you bs-ing us or is your dog off his leash?

I for one, would like an actual response to this question. It seems like you two have contradicted one another, one confirming and one denying.

Peace in our time

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5 hours ago, Prefonteen said:

@Lord TyrionPlease clarify which of you two is representing TI's view on things. Are you bs-ing us or is your dog off his leash?

 

I've already said that I do not speak for Swamp or TI. Just a concerned citizen of the game that understands this is just an attempt to create a pity party for your own echo-chamber

All your mention shows is that you have no counter to my argument 

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9 hours ago, Orcinus Orca said:

 

So what you have here is SRD asking if you can agree that Quack is the strongest sphere in the game. Instead of agreeing to it, you sidestep him and point to the fact that "muh 5 more c10s in Swamp", therefore agreeing to his statement regardless. 

 

It's pretty obvious I was disagreeing, not that my opinion matters. It's a fact that Swamp is larger than quack regardless of what you, SRD, or I think. That's the funny thing about facts.

"Most successful new AA" - Samuel Bates

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49 minutes ago, Grave said:

 

I've already said that I do not speak for Swamp or TI. Just a concerned citizen of the game that understands this is just an attempt to create a pity party for your own echo-chamber

All your mention shows is that you have no counter to my argument 

image.png.920aea65ec694427b2d6cbb43cbc0c55.png

:thinking:

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1 hour ago, Grave said:

 

I've already said that I do not speak for Swamp or TI. Just a concerned citizen of the game that understands this is just an attempt to create a pity party for your own echo-chamber

This, I suspect, is part of -why- you don't speak for TI :-p. We both agree that Quack shouldn't have attacked here. However, I don't agree with your second sentence. I'm not saying that Quack doesn't do this type of thing too (for instance, when they accuse us of lying), and I admit I may have done it a bit of this insult type thing (though not too much I think), but I think this is precisely the type of thing that keeps the war going. I believe that Quack believes their arguments and I think I've always made that clear. I think we should try to focus on why we disagree instead of making insulting assumptions about the other side.

Edited by Phoenyx
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8 hours ago, Grave said:

 

I've already said that I do not speak for Swamp or TI. Just a concerned citizen of the game that understands this is just an attempt to create a pity party for your own echo-chamber

All your mention shows is that you have no counter to my argument 

Yeah no. You're high gov. Fa even iirc? Correct me if I'm wrong on that please. 

Either way, you represent your alliance whether you want to or not. And right now you're doing so in a way that is undermining your boss' diplomatic efforts. 

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11 hours ago, Phoenyx said:

Well, I suppose it was about time that the other side got upset with me for things I've said. Anyway, if people don't want to listen to what I have to say, that's their choice to make.

Hey, i’m in neither side yet you’re still annoying me. I was enjoying reading everything said by both parties til a clueless phoenyx came out of nowhere, pal. Peace isn’t that simple, you’re not getting anyone peace nor will you be involved in anything important opsec regarding this. It’s time to stop.

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11 hours ago, Grave said:

I've already said that I do not speak for Swamp or TI. Just a concerned citizen of the game that understands this is just an attempt to create a pity party for your own echo-chamber

All your mention shows is that you have no counter to my argument 

 

2 hours ago, Prefonteen said:

Yeah no. You're high gov. Fa even iirc? Correct me if I'm wrong on that please. 

Either way, you represent your alliance whether you want to or not. And right now you're doing so in a way that is undermining your boss' diplomatic efforts. 

I thought you were being funny, but he actually does appear to be high gov (head of MA). Legitimately funny to have high gov running their mouth on the forum with a disclaimer that they don't represent the alliance that they represent.

Edited by Zephyr
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2 hours ago, Vein said:

Hey, i’m in neither side yet you’re still annoying me. I was enjoying reading everything said by both parties til a clueless phoenyx came out of nowhere, pal. Peace isn’t that simple, you’re not getting anyone peace nor will you be involved in anything important opsec regarding this. It’s time to stop.

I will grant that when I started, I was indeed pretty clueless. I think I've learned a lot since I started. Anyway, so long as I get enough positive feedback, I'll continue, though I may do so at a slower pace now. 

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13 hours ago, Shiho Nishizumi said:

Yea, no. You're govt, and your word carries a certain amount of weight as a result.

Hence, the clarification Partisan was looking for, but which was not forwarded.

 

13 hours ago, Itz said:

image.png.920aea65ec694427b2d6cbb43cbc0c55.png

:thinking:

 

5 hours ago, Prefonteen said:

Yeah no. You're high gov. Fa even iirc? Correct me if I'm wrong on that please. 

Either way, you represent your alliance whether you want to or not. And right now you're doing so in a way that is undermining your boss' diplomatic efforts. 

 

2 hours ago, Zephyr said:

 

I thought you were being funny, but he actually does appear to be high gov (head of MA). Legitimately funny to have high gov running their mouth on the forum with a disclaimer that they don't represent the alliance that they represent.

Doing a great job at Proving my echo chamber comment wrong I see.

Luckily for me, you don't get to decide if what I said is said on behalf of my alliance. I don't even get to claim I speak for the alliance, I don't even get to start wars, just win them. You seem to be intermixing FA and MA 

I know you have everyone not willing to use your propaganda gagged, along with everyone who has their own opinions And anyone who doesn't downvote for you  (remind you of anyone?) 

 

But TI allows a little more personal freedom.

Edited by Grave
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