Vexz Posted November 1, 2020 Author Share Posted November 1, 2020 Just now, Lord Vader said: First lap ain't over yet Nice to know you acknowledge my lane is correct, have a nice day. 1 5 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 (edited) Your lane has been correct, but you failed to stayed in it during the first lap. 🤔 Stepping out of the analogy: Is there any reason besides your secret agreement why you've involved yourself? Edited November 1, 2020 by Prefonteen 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vexz Posted November 1, 2020 Author Share Posted November 1, 2020 7 hours ago, Prefonteen said: Your lane has been correct, but you failed to stayed in it during the first lap. 🤔 Stepping out of the analogy: Is there any reason besides your secret agreement why you've involved yourself? Invalid question, care to try again? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smith Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 10 minutes ago, Vexz said: Invalid question, care to try again? I can see why Rose usually avoids the OWF 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abbas Mehdi Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 29 minutes ago, Smith said: I can see why Rose usually avoids the OWF Perfectly reasonable response to someone Smith. 1 1 Quote I am not a member of Guardian p&w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smith Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Abbas Mehdi said: Perfectly reasonable response to someone Smith. No CB DoW's and a refusal to explain didn't seem perfectly reasonable a year ago to Rose 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 Quack man bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abbas Mehdi Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 We made a declaration similar to how partisan does with the exception of his most recent declaration in recent history. You would like to discuss our CB, more than welcome to use the numerous channels of communication we have. 2 1 Quote I am not a member of Guardian p&w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smith Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Abbas Mehdi said: We made a declaration similar to how partisan does with the exception of his most recent declaration in recent history. You would like to discuss our CB, more than welcome to use the numerous channels of communication we have. To clarify how far back are you citing here as an excuse not to give a public CB lol. 4 years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 36 minutes ago, Abbas Mehdi said: We made a declaration similar to how partisan does with the exception of his most recent declaration in recent history. You would like to discuss our CB, more than welcome to use the numerous channels of communication we have. Im literally known for my Walls of Text on CB justification Abbas. Miss me with that sh. lmao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurdanak Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Smith said: I can see why Rose usually avoids the OWF Gifs take a lot out of a man, forgive me for my absence. Anyways, been a while, hi! Something something, dolla dolla bills, something something ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Edited November 1, 2020 by Kurdanak 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redarmy Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 Are we pod racing? Quote "Though it starts with a fist it must end with your mind." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooper_ Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 You know things are desperate when Vexz makes a post with a Taylor Swift song and not Selena Gomez. A Rare sight indeed. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMorf Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 Still waiting to hear an actual CB! Should I get comfortable? How long will I be here? 3 1 Quote The Knights Radiant Ghostblood Babsk of Foreign Affairs Journey before Destination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bezzers Posted November 1, 2020 Share Posted November 1, 2020 Its because @Redarmy went to TKR instead of Rose isn't it. You can tell me, nobody will know. 4 2 Quote Roll Squeegee pact with Redarmy and Ameyuri Blues Brothers pact with Redarmy Leader of the Elyion Resistance. If it's backed by NPO, you know it's evil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Redarmy Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Bezzers said: Its because @Redarmy went to TKR instead of Rose isn't it. You can tell me, nobody will know. Clearly this how it went down. 6 3 Quote "Though it starts with a fist it must end with your mind." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurdanak Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Bezzers said: Its because @Redarmy went to TKR instead of Rose isn't it. You can tell me, nobody will know. Finally, someone on the right track here. Geographically, we're so very close. But emotionally? The distance is vast. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayor Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 3 hours ago, Bezzers said: Its because @Redarmy went to TKR instead of Rose isn't it. You can tell me, nobody will know. Seriously though, 100% valid CB. Any day, any time. We will get Red back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Cooper_ Posted November 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) This declaration is probably the defining point of this war, perhaps of the entire post-IQ era. Unfortunately, I think this is true for the wrong reasons. The war was expected to be a HM/Swamp v Quack. I'm not sure who would've won, but it would've been close. But my qualms aren't limited to what could’ve been the makeup of an excitingly competitive war, they mostly lie with the lasting repercussions on the meta. A lot of the ideas that Rose suggested y'all stood for have been abandoned here. At one point, you seemed to believe in the ideas of a balanced, multipolar world and fighting in wars for the sake of the meta. Now, that's no longer the case. Things have changed. There's an interesting juxtaposition you can create between the declaration here and the declaration at the beginning of Dial-Up. In one, you were outnumbered, outgunned, and fighting against a plot to gang up on a smaller sphere. Today, you are outnumbering, outgunning and fighting with a plot to dogpile another sphere. In the first case, the claims about fairness and the meta made a lot of sense, and earned you a lot of fans like many of us in Quack. Yet here we are where we're faced with the same set of justifications that ring hollow in a set of circumstances that belies your cause to enter. It's hard to make better wars from the former as you stipulate in the OP when this scenario is reminiscent of the same former chicanery in past wars, entering without a CB and without regard for the consequences on the meta. The situation is further complicated by the stances y'all have taken for months if not years preceding this war on what the meta should look like. Outwardly, there seemed to be Rose buy-in to the concept of a world with many powers that isn't constrained by consolidation. Inwardly, those principles weren't applied. Rose's entry has solidified the resolve of Quack. Many of us were expecting significant changes in the composition of spheres and a serious shift in power as a consequence of the war with HM/Swamp. This might've (perhaps was even likely to have) resulted in the breakup and restructuring of Quack and/or Swamp, the two largest spheres in the game. Personally, that's where I saw value. There were a lot of moving parts and numerous opportunities to see the dynamic in Orbis radically change, a true expression of elusive dynamism in Orbis. It’s going to take a lot for that to be considered again. I don't know what the political result of this will be. The entry has mortared any cracks in Quack internals and effectively isolated us from the rest of the game. The expectation that we'll see a significant restructuring after this is now in flux. This is the most disappointing part. It's also where I see the most hypocrisy for any real motivations about the meta, sphere size, or any sort of principles. Bipolarity and stagnation is something I fear, and the necessary ingredients were assembled here. Heck, it even defeats the purported CBs and reasons behind the other sphere's war too. The corruption of these values is full-thickness. And maybe that doesn't mean much to most people. To the born-and-bred TKR guy, this is everything. I’m struggling with understanding how you see us moving forward from here, Quack and Orbis. I don’t want this to happen. No one in Quack wants this to happen. A move to bipolarity and stagnation like we saw in the past is demonstrably harmful, yet it’s seeming more and more inevitable. The conditions are already unfavorable, and we’re going to need to see change (and a lot of it) if we hope to stop this. Yet despite all of this, we still don't have a reason behind the entry–if there really even is one. The series of shifting rationales we've been given haven't added up. The few lines we've been given here aren't effective either. For such a large-scoping decision and for all of the good faith we have–I have–afforded you, this merits more. The future of Orbis that you've catalyzed deserves at least some better explanation for the decision made here. I hope you consider this. I hope the damage is reparable. Edited November 2, 2020 by Cooper_ 4 8 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) @Cooper_ it 100% would not have been close and the only people claiming it would have been are the same people dodging their own attempts to go 350 v 1000. The blitz in this hypothetical world you speak of would have continued and KOd hedge (save some super whale stragglers you can now harpoon at your leisure), leaving essentially a Quack v Swamp 1v1. Wherein the majority of Swamps upper tier is already dead (TCW) or is not exactly anything more than a speed bump. As has already been established elsewhere, no one, not even swamp themselves, thinks they could actually win a 1v1 against Quack. Indeed it has already been explained that the only way your claimed matchup would be a toss up, is with you as the actual defender. Infact that's true of any offensive situation bar the ones where you end up fighting literally every sphere either by hitting them intentionally or by way of the reality we walk now. Please quitthe disingenuous "it would've been so fair though!" Crap, nobody believes it, or even thinks you believe it. You think anybody here actually believes the likes of Shiho and Theo and TKR cause I actually don't really know your Milcom atm, believe that they stood any actual chance of defeat after, by their own word, "taking out the most dangerous link first?" Of course not. You knew what the results would be if it played that way, and that was the entire intent and point, itself proven by how beat up HM actually got anyway despite Rose and Swamp both coming in. It's perfectly fine that you knew that, it means you have milcom that is aware of how many toes they have which is a rarer skill than you'd think. Edited November 2, 2020 by Akuryo 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 10 minutes ago, Akuryo said: @Cooper_ it 100% would not have been close and the only people claiming it would have been are the same people dodging their own attempts to go 350 v 1000. The blitz in this hypothetical world you speak of would have continued and KOd hedge (save some super whale stragglers you can now harpoon at your leisure), leaving essentially a Quack v Swamp 1v1. Wherein the majority of Swamps upper tier is already dead (TCW) or is not exactly anything more than a speed bump. As has already been established elsewhere, no one, not even swamp themselves, thinks they could actually win a 1v1 against Quack. Indeed it has already been explained that the only way your claimed matchup would be a toss up, is with you as the actual defender. Infact that's true of any offensive situation bar the ones where you end up fighting literally every sphere either by hitting them intentionally or by way of the reality we walk now. Please quitthe disingenuous "it would've been so fair though!" Crap, nobody believes it, or even thinks you believe it. You think anybody here actually believes the likes of Shiho and Theo and TKR cause I actually don't really know your Milcom atm, believe that they stood any actual chance of defeat after, by their own word, "taking out the most dangerous link first?" Of course not. You knew what the results would be if it played that way, and that was the entire intent and point, itself proven by how beat up HM actually got anyway despite Rose and Swamp both coming in. It's perfectly fine that you knew that, it means you have milcom that is aware of how many toes they have which is a rarer skill than you'd think. I think that as someone who sits in our internal channels, I can safely assert that Shiho and Theo are actually realistic. They noted various concerns and risks, and we collectively sought to minimize them. They have at no point asserted that the war was a sure win, even if Rose (or swamp) stayed out. They also understood however, that fighting all, at once, was pretty much a dogpile. Doesn't mean we are going to roll over. 😃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danzek Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 lol. besides the propaganda about the HM plot, are cooper and parti actually on the same page? cause it sounds like parti started this war to preserve t$ sphere's position rather than as a tool to negotiate a more balanced orbis. anywho, love the war regardless, peace is boring, but i'm not sure why this is war is necessary to bring swamp to the table about possible downsizing. hasn't the idea of TKR/t$ split been brought up countless times before? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Borg said: lol. besides the propaganda about the HM plot, are cooper and parti actually on the same page? cause it sounds like parti started this war to preserve t$ sphere's position rather than as a tool to negotiate a more balanced orbis. anywho, love the war regardless, peace is boring, but i'm not sure why this is war is necessary to bring swamp to the table about possible downsizing. hasn't the idea of TKR/t$ split been brought up countless times before? This might be revolutionary to you, but different individuals sometimes have different motivations and thought processes. TKR has hisorically been a bit more idealistic than t$. Rose and TKR as I understand have spent a good bit of time discussing their ideals of a multisphere Orbis. Though the details of those conversations are fairly unknown to me, I deduce this from the compromises t$ has had to find with TKR to create a functioning and aligned sphere. What occurred this war does not rhyme with TKR's (and our) view of what the parties involved have thusfar propagated to stand for, and so that is being brought up. It's not that complicated. The idea of a TKR/t$ split has been brought up, yes, and there are long conversations I'm more than willing to have with you on that subject. I'll note that we took plenty of precautions to limit our size in response to the hegemonic concerns of some parties. These precautions directly handicapped us when it became apparent that y'all had it out for us anyway. So perhaps not screeching about the evils of TKR/t$ the moment NPO deleted, before we had any time to reassess what that deletion meant, or perhaps acknowledging that we were trying to play ball with your minisphere ideals would've made us more receptive to your demands for us to split up in the face of your hostility. Lastly i'll note that had we split up, both t$ and TKR would have found themselves forced to either cede complete control to other ambitious powers (HM for example would have been unbeatable in the upper tier, and swamp/rose/TCW would all have outnumbered us individually at various points in time), or latch on with one of you, creating a new dominant power bloc. I guess i'm just not seeing a realistic justification for your moral outrage over our size. Feel free to dm me if you have any serious intention to work with us, rather than isolate and roll us. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danzek Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 different opinions eh. lol fair. Though I thought blocs usually tried to have a shared FA vision. And yeah, I think it was mentioned t$ turned down e.g. Fark. can't remember the others, but wsa this done because they were incompetent, or because you were worried about becoming e.g. 4x (instead of only 3x) larger than hedge? I will say that I don't have it out for t$. though tbf your size has been problematic in the past when e.g. our prot was an IQ beachhead or some such and you countered counters. Or rolling over color issues. Or Aurora threatening to counter counters on occasion, and having to back down. etc. 404 had considered signing trying to sign with TKR at one point (as leaked in our gov logs), though politics as they were lead us to join hedge where we've grown to like. Uh, i'm probably not the best person to vent about the moral outrage. tbh I don't actually care that much, since i'm not a decision maker for those kinds of things. I'm just here enjoying the drama / war. I also love arguing, as you can probably tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 44 minutes ago, Borg said: different opinions eh. lol fair. Though I thought blocs usually tried to have a shared FA vision. And yeah, I think it was mentioned t$ turned down e.g. Fark. can't remember the others, but wsa this done because they were incompetent, or because you were worried about becoming e.g. 4x (instead of only 3x) larger than hedge? I will say that I don't have it out for t$. though tbf your size has been problematic in the past when e.g. our prot was an IQ beachhead or some such and you countered counters. Or rolling over color issues. Or Aurora threatening to counter counters on occasion, and having to back down. etc. 404 had considered signing trying to sign with TKR at one point (as leaked in our gov logs), though politics as they were lead us to join hedge where we've grown to like. Uh, i'm probably not the best person to vent about the moral outrage. tbh I don't actually care that much, since i'm not a decision maker for those kinds of things. I'm just here enjoying the drama / war. I also love arguing, as you can probably tell. If you hadn't noticed, I'm fond of arguing too 😛 I csn understand you finding our size problematic when there is a direct conflict of interest over protectorate, and I can even appreciate moving based off of that. I suppose that my point is that that is a wholly different picture than "evil quack hegemony that is strangling the game". If you sought to take out what you viewed as a threat, that's cool. We did the same after we hit those logs. The hurr durr surrounding it is something we have contested. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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