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We are here for the whales - t$ DoW


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5 hours ago, Grave said:

Economic growth? How about 1000 players that almost all of whom are active and well stocked enough militarize in 4 days and obedient enough to declare nearly 2 offensive wars per nation? 

The fact that you mention activity, good WC, and making TC/DC + having many offensive wars as something that is difficult to achieve really illustrates and enhances your blocs argument that you are not a hegemony.

For real though, you should probably reform your Econ and IA since anyone not willing to have their own WC, declare as many wars as needed, and always making sure to be online at DC is going to fail hilariously when the going gets tough.

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43 minutes ago, Mayor said:

The fact that you mention activity, good WC, and making TC/DC + having many offensive wars as something that is difficult to achieve really illustrates and enhances your blocs argument that you are not a hegemony.

For real though, you should probably reform your Econ and IA since anyone not willing to have their own WC, declare as many wars as needed, and always making sure to be online at DC is going to fail hilariously when the going gets tough.

So the official propaganda line moving forward is basically.....?

BF1A4CE671295E8F9BDEE3C48CF22BB00F6862C6

How wonderfully constructive 👍

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4 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said:

So the official propaganda line moving forward is basically.....?

BF1A4CE671295E8F9BDEE3C48CF22BB00F6862C6

How wonderfully constructive 👍

That's quite literally the line we've been fed. By lack of any other reasonable cb, we're happy to take the compliment. 

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1 minute ago, Itz said:

Precisely. So... where's Rose's and Swamps?

You would have to ask them. I'm apparently just some old washed up relic from a bygone era after all. What would I know? 🤷‍♂️

If I had to guess though, I presume their CB would be almost identical to the one utilised by tS. You know, responding to an imminent threat and all that which they are entirely allowed to do in much the same manner as tS. Goose, gander, whatever the rest of the phrase is.

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1 minute ago, Mayor said:

On Friday we received from Hedge a collection of confidential CBs related to the Syndicate family. We believe those CBs are authentic, they’re real, and they’re damning … We messaged an ally in Hedge and we asked him to send those CBs to Swamp … He shipped those CBs overnight to Swamp with a large national carrier brand … But the CBs never arrived in Swamp. Saturday morning we received word from the shipping company that our CBs had been stolen and the contents were missing. The CBs had disappeared.

By far my favorite shitposter this war. Well done.

2 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said:

You would have to ask them. I'm apparently just some old washed up relic from a bygone era after all. What would I know? 🤷‍♂️

If I had to guess though, I presume their CB would be almost identical to the one utilised by tS. You know, responding to an imminent threat and all that which they are entirely allowed to do in much the same manner as tS. Goose, gander, whatever the rest of the phrase is.

Should probably keep quiet about things you know nothing about, then. Remember what happened last time?

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2 minutes ago, Itz said:

By far my favorite shitposter this war. Well done.

Should probably keep quiet about things you know nothing about, then. Remember what happened last time?

Oh you mean when I called tS out over the hypocrisy shown towards Camelot, then had good ol fashioned fun trolling your discord ruffling a few feathers in the process before moving on to better pastures?

Sure, I remember that. But of course, feel free to spin it as you please. That's all you can do after all at this moment in time 👍

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12 minutes ago, Charles Bolivar said:

Oh you mean when I called tS out over the hypocrisy shown towards Camelot, then had good ol fashioned fun trolling your discord ruffling a few feathers in the process before moving on to better pastures?

Sure, I remember that. But of course, feel free to spin it as you please. That's all you can do after all at this moment in time 👍

Oh Charles, god emperor of T$, the man who made the alliance what it was and should be included among the greats! Yeah you really did think quite highly of yourself that day and grossly over-inflated your importance or influence within t$...just like another blowhard we all know and love who I have seen pop up in this topic earlier.
But would you really call that trolling when you were the one who couldnt keep your story straight and ended up pivoting your argument halfway through and then agreeing with us during the public decimation of whatever shit you were trying to sling that day. I seem to recall you then leaving the server and acting very butthurt over the incident for many days after. If that constitutes as a W in your book then so be it Charles, you are the master troll too, just one in a very fine and dignified list of accomplishments.

 

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On 11/2/2020 at 6:17 AM, Leopold von Habsburg said:

Oh Charles, god emperor of T$, the man who made the alliance what it was and should be included among the greats! Yeah you really did think quite highly of yourself that day and grossly over-inflated your importance or influence within t$...just like another blowhard we all know and love who I have seen pop up in this topic earlier.
But would you really call that trolling when you were the one who couldnt keep your story straight and ended up pivoting your argument halfway through and then agreeing with us during the public decimation of whatever shit you were trying to sling that day. I seem to recall you then leaving the server and acting very butthurt over the incident for many days after. If that constitutes as a W in your book then so be it Charles, you are the master troll too, just one in a very fine and dignified list of accomplishments.

 

God emperor doesn't sound bad actually. Old relic emperor might be better though, hard to tell 🤷‍♂️ there is one title I am missing out on though and I am wondering on how I can get it. 

Any advice on how to get the " I sold out to NPO and all I got was my allies rolled and this lousy t-shirt?" That was the subject of our conversation that night and apparently I was terrible and silly for not knowing the finer details behind a bunch of sell-outs well...selling out?

But hey...good luck with the war👍

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2 hours ago, Itz said:

Sure. As dumbed down as possible.

1. We receive leak from Boyce.

2. Given HM's hostility with us, we take the chance that they're already involved and mil up to hit on our own terms.

3. We approach Swamp (who has been rather friendly to us until now) and Rose letting them know we're not intending to hit them.

4. Rose shows signs via responses and military movements that they're readying up.

5. Swamp remains an enigma. 

6. We hit. Rose and Swamp both counter blitz with completely formed offensives (thus proving the collusion was already there, it takes more than a few days to suddenly decide everyones going to hit Quack lmao).

7. Rosesphere gov reveals Swamp and Rose have a sooper sekrit MDP, and Rose proper has nothing to give as even a remotely valid cb.

8. Keegoz drops all bullshit (shoutout for being semi-straight) and reveals HM had a similar deal with Swamp.

9. All this culminates in proving there were already backroom discussions happening and alluding to the 3v1 dogpile being planned, albeit us ruining the plans a bit by pre-empting.

I won't touch too much on TCWs involvement because it's already been gone over.

 

That all said - this was inevitable. The only factor was who attacked first,  and unfortunately for CoTL's city circles we aren't the type to sit on our hands and go out on someone else's terms.

 

It boils down very simply to this: t$ and TKR (and the rest of the sphere, but mentioning us specifically since that's the main point of contention) are historically good at recruiting, training, and retainment. The other spheres see our competence as a threat, and if they had just admitted that at the get-go instead of making up convoluted bullshit about use becoming a hegemony (like... still have yet to see any actual proof of us heading that way? Lmao). Frankly I don't care too much about the dogpile itself. It's fun, it's a challenge. But at least be straight up and say you all worked together and it's because our combined competence is scary (shoutout to those who already have xoxo). 

Alright thanks for the breakdown, just one question before I proceed:

Regarding the leaks, are these same ones seen in this thread? Namely, Vader and Boyce's conversation?

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Arric II Vysera said:

Alright thanks for the breakdown, just one question before I proceed:

Regarding the leaks, are these same ones seen in this thread? Namely, Vader and Boyce's conversation?

 

 

 

Correct.

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4 minutes ago, Itz said:

Correct.

Thought so.

Quote

Sure. As dumbed down as possible.

1. We receive leak from Boyce.

2. Given HM's hostility with us, we take the chance that they're already involved and mil up to hit on our own terms.

3. We approach Swamp (who has been rather friendly to us until now) and Rose letting them know we're not intending to hit them.

4. Rose shows signs via responses and military movements that they're readying up.

5. Swamp remains an enigma. 

6. We hit. Rose and Swamp both counter blitz with completely formed offensives (thus proving the collusion was already there, it takes more than a few days to suddenly decide everyones going to hit Quack lmao).

7. Rosesphere gov reveals Swamp and Rose have a sooper sekrit MDP, and Rose proper has nothing to give as even a remotely valid cb.

8. Keegoz drops all bullshit (shoutout for being semi-straight) and reveals HM had a similar deal with Swamp.

9. All this culminates in proving there were already backroom discussions happening and alluding to the 3v1 dogpile being planned, albeit us ruining the plans a bit by pre-empting.

I won't touch too much on TCWs involvement because it's already been gone over.

So you received a leak from Boyce saying tCW, Hedge and Swamp intend on attacking in November and are even confident Rose wants in on the dogpile:

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As far as I can tell you believe this to be the absolute truth, So lets go with that viewpoint. You get ready to open a can of whoop-ass on Hedge and then decide to let Hedge's co-conspirator and Rose know you're going to attack Hedge, but not them because they've been friendly to you... never mind that they too are plotting against you WITH Hedge... they're friendly.

Am I missing something? Is there a reason Quack found Swamp to be exempt from the ass-beating that HM was about to receive? Are you sure you just didn't want to roll Hedge regardless?

Then D-day arrives and you hit Hedge hard, only to find Swamp and Rose have almost immediately countered. You find out that Hedge, Swamp and Rose have been in kahoots with each other specifically to position themselves against you. You take this as confirmation that the 3v1 was all planned.

That's a non sequitur. You literally can't prove anything with that, especially if there's already been existing rhetoric among them that Quack is getting "too big" for a while now. Does Hedge, Swamp or Rose have a secret alliance with tCW to even tie them to this conspiracy aside from hearsay?

Quote

That all said - this was inevitable. The only factor was who attacked first,  and unfortunately for CoTL's city circles we aren't the type to sit on our hands and go out on someone else's terms.

 

It boils down very simply to this: t$ and TKR (and the rest of the sphere, but mentioning us specifically since that's the main point of contention) are historically good at recruiting, training, and retainment. The other spheres see our competence as a threat, and if they had just admitted that at the get-go instead of making up convoluted bullshit about use becoming a hegemony (like... still have yet to see any actual proof of us heading that way? Lmao). Frankly I don't care too much about the dogpile itself. It's fun, it's a challenge. But at least be straight up and say you all worked together and it's because our combined competence is scary (shoutout to those who already have xoxo). 

This part is beyond me, I know nothing about "seeing your competence as a threat", I respect that you guys are killing it and doing well for yourselves. I'm just a guy who's seeing his pixels burn for wishy-washy reasons and getting very sus justifications for it.

 

 

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8 hours ago, KingGhost said:

Bro you went to war with Arrgh and bled 30b, I finally understand why you guys were claiming it was war experience. More experience dogpilling.

As an addendum, Arrgh and Swamp are still very much at war

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1 minute ago, Arric II Vysera said:

Am I missing something? Is there a reason Quack found Swamp to be exempt from the ass-beating that HM was about to receive? Are you sure you just didn't want to roll Hedge regardless?

Feel free to go read any of Partisan's responses. He's summed all this up rather well. That said, I'll repeat the most important point: If we were getting hit by all 3 anyways (or even 2, as we were fairly certain we were), we may as well take first punch on the most dangerous of the 3.

2 minutes ago, Arric II Vysera said:

You literally can't prove anything with that

Except, as I've mentioned multiple times now, we have government confirmation from both Rose and HM that they had backroom deals. 

4 minutes ago, Arric II Vysera said:

As far as I can tell you believe this to be the absolute truth

In reference to this, I'll simply say there was a lot of conversation given Boyce's history as unreliable. That said, there was also enough to corroborate it and the actions taken both during our militarization and during the blitz more or less prove it. If you don't see how use hitting one sphere+tCW and then getting immediately counter blitzed by the two others implicated in the logs doesn't prove it, along with gov admission, not really sure what to tell you.

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33 minutes ago, Arric II Vysera said:

Thought so.

So you received a leak from Boyce saying tCW, Hedge and Swamp intend on attacking in November and are even confident Rose wants in on the dogpile:

Untitled.png.2720e4fc488338e1e8a2bc3b28a194d3.png

As far as I can tell you believe this to be the absolute truth, So lets go with that viewpoint. You get ready to open a can of whoop-ass on Hedge and then decide to let Hedge's co-conspirator and Rose know you're going to attack Hedge, but not them because they've been friendly to you... never mind that they too are plotting against you WITH Hedge... they're friendly.

Am I missing something? Is there a reason Quack found Swamp to be exempt from the ass-beating that HM was about to receive? Are you sure you just didn't want to roll Hedge regardless?

Then D-day arrives and you hit Hedge hard, only to find Swamp and Rose have almost immediately countered. You find out that Hedge, Swamp and Rose have been in kahoots with each other specifically to position themselves against you. You take this as confirmation that the 3v1 was all planned.

That's a non sequitur. You literally can't prove anything with that, especially if there's already been existing rhetoric among them that Quack is getting "too big" for a while now. Does Hedge, Swamp or Rose have a secret alliance with tCW to even tie them to this conspiracy aside from hearsay?

This part is beyond me, I know nothing about "seeing your competence as a threat", I respect that you guys are killing it and doing well for yourselves. I'm just a guy who's seeing his pixels burn for wishy-washy reasons and getting very sus justifications for it.

 

 

The competence stuff is something we've been fed by officials in both spheres that flanked us as a supposed reason for their defense of you. 

 

That's why we laugh at it. 

 

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I for one cannot find any fault in t$’s CB, nor their choice in timing.

“Be your friend’s true friend.
Return gift for gift.
Repay laughter with laughter again
but betrayal with treachery.”

 Hávamál

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14 hours ago, BigMorf said:

Hedge: I can't believe Quack preempted us because we were planning to hit them!!! That's illegal right????

 

Perhaps don't plan to roll someone if you are going to cry about getting preempted. 

 

 

There was no plan to hit you and you still have no evidence to support this. There were rumours and murmurs but there was no official plan in place and CotL nor Hedge ever signed off on one.

I admitted that this situation in some form was inevitable but that does not mean we had it all planned out as some are trying to put forth.

4 hours ago, Itz said:

Except, as I've mentioned multiple times now, we have government confirmation from both Rose and HM that they had backroom deals. 

If you're trying to take that from the convo I had with you as some sort of confirmation, then you have mis-interpreted me. The plans against you were defensive in nature and came about when you militarised.

Considering we pretty much felt like we were the most likely target to be hit, seemed reasonable to sound out support. As mentioned earlier Swamp's support was not a surprise as we had discussed our issues quite openly and seem to be on a similar page. Rose on the other hand we had no idea what they'd do.

Edited by Keegoz

[11:52 PM] Prefontaine: But Keegoz is actually bad. [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: He's my favorite bad leader though.

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8 hours ago, Mayor said:

On Friday we received from Hedge a collection of confidential CBs related to the Syndicate family. We believe those CBs are authentic, they’re real, and they’re damning … We messaged an ally in Hedge and we asked him to send those CBs to Swamp … He shipped those CBs overnight to Swamp with a large national carrier brand … But the CBs never arrived in Swamp. Saturday morning we received word from the shipping company that our CBs had been stolen and the contents were missing. The CBs had disappeared.

This is so so good.

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1 hour ago, Keegoz said:

There was no plan to hit you and you still have no evidence to support this.

 

> coordinated 3v1 on opening night

> no evidence 

> laughingwomen.jpg

 

For all the high minded rhetoric about sustaining a multipolar meta, this war certainly doesn’t help bolster it

The Coalition Discord: https://discord.gg/WBzNRGK

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15 minutes ago, Bollocks said:

> coordinated 3v1 on opening night

> no evidence 

> laughingwomen.jpg

 

For all the high minded rhetoric about sustaining a multipolar meta, this war certainly doesn’t help bolster it

I mean, everyone has been watching Quacksphere mil up and then the subsequent reactionary arming up of everyone else cus no one knew for sure who you were gonna hit. You ended up declaring on 2 out of those 3 yourself, so the third is really the only one who "coordinated." From what I've learned in this thread, is you saw Rose as a member of our coalition anyways, regardless of us not knowing if they would actually enter if we were attacked, but Rose can read and can see quickly from this thread that they weren't seen as a neutral party by Quack and therefore entering on our side is in their best interest. My timeline may be askew, so please feel free to correct.

I also think you misunderstand the point of a multipolar era. A multipolar era requires multiple wars to actually assess its success. This war is by definition a multipolar war, because, right or wrong, the anti-Quacks view Quack as gaining an upper hand and threatening the balance, whether that is valid or not is not the point. Now, if this war ends, and the anti-Quacks wait 3 months and hit Quack again, I'd need to ssess what leads up to that, but I'm inclined to say the multipolar experiment has not succeeded.

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41 minutes ago, Hodor said:

I mean, everyone has been watching Quacksphere mil up and then the subsequent reactionary arming up of everyone else cus no one knew for sure who you were gonna hit. You ended up declaring on 2 out of those 3 yourself, so the third is really the only one who "coordinated." From what I've learned in this thread, is you saw Rose as a member of our coalition anyways, regardless of us not knowing if they would actually enter if we were attacked, but Rose can read and can see quickly from this thread that they weren't seen as a neutral party by Quack and therefore entering on our side is in their best interest. My timeline may be askew, so please feel free to correct.

That's a falsehood. We gave assurances to two parties. The deals were either set in place (as claimed by your lot) or existed (as substantiated by the logs) regardless.

Your timeline of events is misplaced. At first Rose seemed undecided, but it became apparent by the last day that they were going to join in. The statements you're referencing to here occurred after Rose's demeanor and shift of tone was apparent. That they opened with espionage ops before we had even opened on HM/you (and the pre-planned blitz which followed) just reinforces that they had plans to get involved even before it became apparent to us that they were going to, due to the time necessary to arrange the targets and other logistical needs.
 

51 minutes ago, Hodor said:

I also think you misunderstand the point of a multipolar era. A multipolar era requires multiple wars to actually assess its success. This war is by definition a multipolar war, because, right or wrong, the anti-Quacks view Quack as gaining an upper hand and threatening the balance, whether that is valid or not is not the point. Now, if this war ends, and the anti-Quacks wait 3 months and hit Quack again, I'd need to ssess what leads up to that, but I'm inclined to say the multipolar experiment has not succeeded.

Two dogpiles back to back do not show a bright future for multi-polarity.

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34 minutes ago, Shiho Nishizumi said:

Your timeline of events is misplaced. At first Rose seemed undecided, but it became apparent by the last day that they were going to join in. The statements you're referencing to here occurred after Rose's demeanor and shift of tone was apparent. That they opened with espionage ops before we had even opened on HM/you (and the pre-planned blitz which followed) just reinforces that they had plans to get involved even before it became apparent to us that they were going to, due to the time necessary to arrange the targets and other logistical needs.
 

Two dogpiles back to back do not show a bright future for multi-polarity.

1. Fair, thought I may be mistaken, I ain't gov no more, so was relying on conversations on a lesser level.

2. Eh, I'm not so sure I agree. The TCW shit was not motivated by the idea of multispheres, but I can see that the optics of it could support your claim. The idea, for me at least, is that multispheres would generate wars that don't repeat coalitions except out of necessity (ex. A and B check C's growth, the war causes A to become stronger, B and C check A's growth, etc.). For dogpiles, I thought we'd all settled that you want a bigger coalition than your enemy, and if we haven't, I'm not sure why the hell not. HM has paired with Swamp twice, that's a pattern that I'd focus on, not the dogpile.

The issue in my eyes is, Quack doesn't recognize that no matter what actions they take to make themselves look passive, being a certain size makes them a target, and if they don't take pro-active steps to point out that, frankly speaking, a close relationship between HM and Swamp is a far bigger threat, than I'm not sure what to tell you.

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