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The credits are turning the frogs gayy, lmao


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30 minutes ago, HeroofTime55 said:

The idea that Nokia "made amends" because they happened to re-roll 5 months ago by random chance, after successfully paying off 10b in debts with illegal money, that's the dumbest leap of logic in the world.  Nokia has zero regrets for buying cash, and only reported the situation because EM refused to pay another 4b of Nokia's debts.  Nothing about anything Nokia did was about "making amends."  It's about their blackmail plot not working out and choosing to take the nuclear option.  Lets seriously not paint Nokia as some sort of noble character here.

I'm done listening to this incessant screeching.  

Pch, your argument is that EM did nothing wrong because Nokia also did something indefensible? That's like 3 fallacies at once, including false comparison (Nokia =/= EM, what either is guilty of does not actually change what the other is guilty of), two wrongs don't make a right (Just because two people did indefensible things doesn't justify either), and ad hominem (nothing about Nokia is in any way relevant to EM's rulebreaking).

See, it is important to stand by your allies, of course. One must absolutely defend them... when they are defensible. One must give them the benefit of the doubt... when there is reasonable doubt. One must take great care to avoid stirring up stupid drama... even when it's difficult.

And you are making it REALLY difficult.

Edited by Sir Scarfalot
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1 hour ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

Pch, your argument is that EM did nothing wrong because Nokia also did something indefensible? That's like 3 fallacies at once, including false comparison (Nokia =/= EM, what either is guilty of does not actually change what the other is guilty of), two wrongs don't make a right (Just because two people did indefensible things doesn't justify either), and ad hominem (nothing about Nokia is in any way relevant to EM's rulebreaking).

See, it is important to stand by your allies, of course. One must absolutely defend them... when they are defensible. One must give them the benefit of the doubt... when there is reasonable doubt. One must take great care to avoid stirring up stupid drama... even when it's difficult.

And you are making it REALLY difficult.

I have repeatedly said that EM did wrong things.  Not once have I ever claimed he was innocent, he facilitated a cheater, and that is wrong, obviously.  And I've also said that he is lucky he wasn't wiped or banned (Nokia as well).  It is, in fact, the folks on the other side who continue to insist that Nokia should be absolved of their role in this nonsense, or that they were some kind of saint for coming forward.

The fact is that people are going after only EM, not because of his role in this scheme, but because it's their excuse to finally go after him.  If it was because of the scheme, they'd be going after Nokia equally.  It's the way Nokia (and George!) are being ignored in this, which proves that the motivation lies well outside this incident.

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2 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:

I have repeatedly said that EM did wrong things.  Not once have I ever claimed he was innocent, he facilitated a cheater, and that is wrong, obviously.  And I've also said that he is lucky he wasn't wiped or banned (Nokia as well).  It is, in fact, the folks on the other side who continue to insist that Nokia should be absolved of their role in this nonsense, or that they were some kind of saint for coming forward.

The fact is that people are going after only EM, not because of his role in this scheme, but because it's their excuse to finally go after him.  If it was because of the scheme, they'd be going after Nokia equally.  It's the way Nokia (and George!) are being ignored in this, which proves that the motivation lies well outside this incident.

Standard punishment for this is a nation wipe:

Nokia rerolled AFTER they bought their money, hence they gained no ingame advantage - Nation wiped. 

Gorge wiped his nation himself despite not even getting that much attention. - Nation wiped.

Noticing a pattern here?

EM is the singular person from the trio that has been proven to be linked to this entire fiasco that has NOT gone through what would be the rightful punishment for trading irl money for ingame currency. Therefore, it's quite logical to ignore people that have essentially already wiped their nations themselves and faced the punishment they should've received (motives literally do not matter, point is there was a punishment and regardless of why they did it, they have wiped their nations, negating any benefit they would have received) in favour of someone who was uncooperative from the start, only really helping once he saw he would be banned and since then has been allowed off the hook scot-free.

And I have literally never interacted with EM in anyway whatsoever to have prejudices against him.

Edited by Ex Machina
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3 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:

I have repeatedly said that EM did wrong things.  Not once have I ever claimed he was innocent, he facilitated a cheater, and that is wrong, obviously.  And I've also said that he is lucky he wasn't wiped or banned (Nokia as well).  It is, in fact, the folks on the other side who continue to insist that Nokia should be absolved of their role in this nonsense, or that they were some kind of saint for coming forward.

The fact is that people are going after only EM, not because of his role in this scheme, but because it's their excuse to finally go after him.  If it was because of the scheme, they'd be going after Nokia equally.  It's the way Nokia (and George!) are being ignored in this, which proves that the motivation lies well outside this incident.

Personally, I have done no more than blockade EM, Nokia, and the alliances that still decide to keep both around, but you've blockaded me back and called me a whiner. If you've got a problem with even that small of a gesture, it's hard to view you as a rational voice.

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12 hours ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

I honestly would have expected those numbers to be much higher... that's actually a relatively heartening statement to hear that 70-80% of banned users don't demand preference on account of their donations ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

This would be true, if more people donate. 

The majority will go through without spending a penny

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4 hours ago, Dr James Wilson said:

 

 

12 hours ago, Ex Machina said:

 


I know you guys are being intentionally dense about this.  Nokia did not pay any price whatsoever.  Nokia, the only one who actually cheated, gave 5bil to his friends and paid 5bil in debts.  The money, or any gains therein, was not in his possession when he decided, for unrelated reasons, to re-roll some five months ago.  Dressing this up as some sort of atonement is laughable.

Also, EM never cheated, he did not buy money nor did he sell money, all he did was connect a buyer and a seller, as was mentioned by Alex himself.  Should he have?  Of course not!  Should he have been honest sooner?  Of course he should have!  Was he undeserving of immunity?  You could make that argument, but not in the same breath that you claim Nokia somehow was worthy.

In fact, Nokia has no remorse whatsoever:

Quote

why would i be embarrassed i have very much enjoyed spending that money and what spending it led to was fun and i enjoy having fun more  than anything 

 

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3 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:

but nokia tho

At this point, your argument comes down to... "But nokia did a bad, so EM shouldn't be punished at all".

Even ignoring the non sequitur, there's several core issues with the logic of that idea. To parrot you a bit: not once has anyone said that Nokia should be immune, either. Mischaracterising their statements after blank quoting them is a cute manuver, but doesn't actually respond to the argument that they'd made, which is that Nokia should be punished... and has been. He sent 10b out to wherever, sure, but the punishment for his crime (buying money with IRL cash) is a nation reset... which has since happened. The letter of the law has been entirely satisfied. You could certainly make the argument that the 10b should be somehow recovered or otherwise further penalized, but that's not what you've been saying nor would such an argument have anything to do with EM whatsoever.

Meanwhile, to parrot you a bit further, EM did not pay any price whatsoever. Is he deserving of immunity? You could make that argument, but not in the same breath that you claim Nokia somehow remains unpunished.

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16 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:


I know you guys are being intentionally dense about this.  Nokia did not pay any price whatsoever.  Nokia, the only one who actually cheated, gave 5bil to his friends and paid 5bil in debts.  The money, or any gains therein, was not in his possession when he decided, for unrelated reasons, to re-roll some five months ago.  Dressing this up as some sort of atonement is laughable.

Also, EM never cheated, he did not buy money nor did he sell money, all he did was connect a buyer and a seller, as was mentioned by Alex himself.  Should he have?  Of course not!  Should he have been honest sooner?  Of course he should have!  Was he undeserving of immunity?  You could make that argument, but not in the same breath that you claim Nokia somehow was worthy.

 

"Nokia, the only one who actually cheated, gave 5bil to his friends and paid 5bil in debts" - Firstly, Nokia may have paid off debts using the money, but it can't be deleted because removing that ingame money would not be punishing Nokia but those who had absolutely no involvement in the cheating. That money can't be used to punish any of the cheaters involved at this point, and so is irrelevant.

"The money, or any gains therein, was not in his possession when he decided, for unrelated reasons, to re-roll some five months ago." - Therefore, the only logical punishment that could be given to Nokia (as doing this does not warrant an actual ban afaik), is a nation wipe, as his monetary gains were used to send funds to other people, and in the end, he himself wiped his nation. All the possible punishments that would be given for the rule infraction have been occurred.

Dressing this up as some sort of atonement is laughable. - Who, in this entire thread has ever suggested Nokia rerolling his nation was 'atonement', nobody is dressing him up as a martyr and many people (including myself) have repeatedly stated that the motives simply do not matter. It does not matter whether it was 'atonement' or not, and nobody is trying to paint it as such. Noone is claiming Nokia is either worthy of immunity or did this as atonement. He has undergone what would be the proper punishment for breaking the rules and therefore, there's no other action to be taken against him.

Also, EM never cheated, he did not buy money nor did he sell money, all he did was connect a buyer and a seller, as was mentioned by Alex himself. - I think your own friend can respond to this far better than I ever could.

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I get a little irl money as most was sent to gorge - He did not simply connect a buyer and a seller, as he himself admits, either you're defending him knowing this or your buddy's lying to you. 

Make your conclusions as you will.

Edited by Ex Machina
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7 hours ago, Ex Machina said:

809553995_ScreenShot2020-04-24at5_42_18PM.png.bcae75ad1ac92b8dc1649ec4af319b3c.png

I get a little irl money as most was sent to gorge - He did not simply connect a buyer and a seller, as he himself admits, either you're defending him knowing this or your buddy's lying to you. 

What he did was just as wrong whether or not he collected an irl cut, and the irl cut doesn't make it better or worse, because breaking an internet game's rules isn't an irl financial crime, in case you were curious.

Ironically, according to the story, he was given cash by Nokia and told to buy 10b for himself, and pocketed the cash instead.  The only smart thing he did in all this imo.  Had he actually gone ahead and bought 10b PnW money for himself, THAT would have elevated his wrongdoing to a new level (and I would be the first person yelling for it to be removed).  But he didn't.  Whether because he didn't need to, or recognized that irl money is better than PnW monopoly fun bux, is left up to your interpretation.

But, you know, I'm here posting in a thread that actually asked Alex to have access to a player's irl finances so I am not sure you understand the difference between the game and reality.

====

As an interesting side note, I am in favor of Alex "garnishing" in-game income of cheaters in cases where illicit money (allegedly) cannot be otherwise recovered.  Half Nokia's login bonus and revenues until the 10b is paid down.  How about that?

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7 hours ago, Ex Machina said:

Also, EM never cheated, he did not buy money nor did he sell money, all he did was connect a buyer and a seller, as was mentioned by Alex himself. - I think your own friend can respond to this far better than I ever could.

809553995_ScreenShot2020-04-24at5_42_18PM.png.bcae75ad1ac92b8dc1649ec4af319b3c.png

I get a little irl money as most was sent to gorge - He did not simply connect a buyer and a seller, as he himself admits, either you're defending him knowing this or your buddy's lying to you.

Real-World Transactions for In-Game Materials

Politics & War has a limited donation system to prevent the game from being "pay-to-win." In addition to limits on Credit usage, it is against the rules for players to make exchanges of real-life money or goods for in-game materials, including but not limited to: in-game money, and in-game resources. Examples of this type of behavior would include: sending someone real-life money for in-game money or in-game resources, purchasing someone a Steam game for in-game money or in-game resources, sending someone a gift-card for in-game money or in-game resources, and any other sort of real-world trade for in-game goods.

The punishment for real-world transactions for in-game materials will be a complete nation reset upon first offense, and a permanent ban from Politics & War upon a second offense.

What he did easily falls in real world transactions for in game materials.  To argue otherwise would just be obtuse.  As stated in the rules first offense is nation reset, which both NR and George did on their own.  The Known Cheater EM has not done this, not that I blame him seeing as his nation is considerably more valuable than both NR and George combined and by an additional factor of 5-10x.  The other reason you see such a push against the Known Cheater EM, is because many people believe his wealth "earned" thru Keno was done thru duplicitous means, which is fair seeing how he won the jackpot twice that has odds of 1 in 428,010,179,098

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Guest Elijah Mikaelson
2 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

What he did easily falls in real world transactions for in game materials.  To argue otherwise would just be obtuse.  As stated in the rules first offense is nation reset, which both NR and George did on their own.  The Known Cheater EM has not done this, not that I blame him seeing as his nation is considerably more valuable than both NR and George combined and by an additional factor of 5-10x.  The other reason you see such a push against the Known Cheater EM, is because many people believe his wealth "earned" thru Keno was done thru duplicitous means, which is fair seeing how he won the jackpot twice that has odds of 1 in 428,010,179,098

For someone who right now is banging on about the rules how about you follow some of your own advice?, Can you prove i cheated and Keno? if not then stop claiming i did and follow the rules? It has been made very clear without proof you can not make baseless claims.

But thank you for pointing out the only real reason is my nation size and not the crime I committed.

To everyone who has had my back I thank you for your support but it's time to stop. Agree or not I broke the game rules, yes without my information Alex would not have know who was next inline, I did not know who the seller was, just that Gorge knew someone so i told Alex everything I knew but that is not enough for some and I get it, I am a bit of a dick and people have claimed for years I have cheated in one way or another with no proof to back up said claims and this have given them all the ammo they need, they just wish for my nation to be reset as the rules state that my crime means my nation is reset, however Alex the owner who make the rules and enforced them saw fit to let me keep my nation to give up Gorge who i was willing to defend until the end.

It is true Gorge did reset his nation, but lets not think for one second it was self imposed, you all bullied him in to doing so and he might not publicly saying hell he might even disagree with this but the truth is you bullied him in to wiping his nation nothing more but simple harassment.

Nokia deleted his nation after stealing 4 billion from a bank, now you all might jump on the boat saying he was reset after he broke the rules but he reset due to stealing money from a bank and still used the 10b funds to rebuild his nation so not sure how your moral compass is on that but I would not say he has had a nation reset due to buying in game cash, he reset to make away with 4 billion. As for the debts he paid off to North-point now Children of the Corn, those was alliance debts, so if that money was removed clearly they can go after Nokia's alliance (most members from TCM are in CK).

[ooc]You might not believe me, well I know most of you won't, and that's fine, but I am sorry for my actions not just being a middle man, but I know how I've treated many of you in the past, this will be my last post on the forums for a while. Though most of you are making fake discord accounts to message me saying you hope I get COVID 19, or I should kill myself, (I have deleted my discord after reporting each time it happened) I forgive you I understand we are in hard times and the internet is all most people have right now.
 Hating me will not change anything, nor will it make me reset my nation I am sorry for my crime but will not let you bully me, harass me or make real-life threats to change the fact I will stay if you wish to keep me in a perm war then so be it.
In politics and war, my nation is all I have left, I plan on keeping it.[ooc]

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26 minutes ago, Elijah Mikaelson said:

For someone who right now is banging on about the rules how about you follow some of your own advice?, Can you prove i cheated and Keno? if not then stop claiming i did and follow the rules? It has been made very clear without proof you can not make baseless claims.

But thank you for pointing out the only real reason is my nation size and not the crime I committed.

To everyone who has had my back I thank you for your support but it's time to stop. Agree or not I broke the game rules, yes without my information Alex would not have know who was next inline, I did not know who the seller was, just that Gorge knew someone so i told Alex everything I knew but that is not enough for some and I get it, I am a bit of a dick and people have claimed for years I have cheated in one way or another with no proof to back up said claims and this have given them all the ammo they need, they just wish for my nation to be reset as the rules state that my crime means my nation is reset, however Alex the owner who make the rules and enforced them saw fit to let me keep my nation to give up Gorge who i was willing to defend until the end.

It is true Gorge did reset his nation, but lets not think for one second it was self imposed, you all bullied him in to doing so and he might not publicly saying hell he might even disagree with this but the truth is you bullied him in to wiping his nation nothing more but simple harassment.

Nokia deleted his nation after stealing 4 billion from a bank, now you all might jump on the boat saying he was reset after he broke the rules but he reset due to stealing money from a bank and still used the 10b funds to rebuild his nation so not sure how your moral compass is on that but I would not say he has had a nation reset due to buying in game cash, he reset to make away with 4 billion. As for the debts he paid off to North-point now Children of the Corn, those was alliance debts, so if that money was removed clearly they can go after Nokia's alliance (most members from TCM are in CK).

[ooc]You might not believe me, well I know most of you won't, and that's fine, but I am sorry for my actions not just being a middle man, but I know how I've treated many of you in the past, this will be my last post on the forums for a while. Though most of you are making fake discord accounts to message me saying you hope I get COVID 19, or I should kill myself, (I have deleted my discord after reporting each time it happened) I forgive you I understand we are in hard times and the internet is all most people have right now.
 Hating me will not change anything, nor will it make me reset my nation I am sorry for my crime but will not let you bully me, harass me or make real-life threats to change the fact I will stay if you wish to keep me in a perm war then so be it.
In politics and war, my nation is all I have left, I plan on keeping it.[ooc]

Nah playboi, majority of us don't care about how big your nation is :P

Majority of us just wanted all of you to get what you guys deserved.

I'm sorry that you had to endure those OOC attacks, but alas that's the nature of these communities and you'll always have those guys that go the deep end.

As far as @Azazel is concerned though, fret not playboi. Nothing Camelot and @Epi can do for us to forget his sins. We all know what happened, so you can sleep well at night knowing that your nation can go to obscurity getting clapped from time to time and having these situations come up in conversations to win arguments against ya'll :D 

Good luck and hopefully you also realize that majority of these guys will forget your sins in a few lmfao

 

 

Edit: nvm maybe hella longer since you were a bit of an !@#$ to a lot of these guys lmfao

Edited by Eumirbago
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3 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

The other reason you see such a push against the Known Cheater EM, is because many people believe his wealth "earned" thru Keno was done thru duplicitous means, which is fair seeing how he won the jackpot twice that has odds of 1 in 428,010,179,098

Me and a few others did some testing on Keno, and we actually did get some promising results that implied that careful progressive betting strategies might be profitable. I never went more advanced than just spamming minimum bets and writing down the incident rate of each number, swapping to the 'luckiest' numbers as they showed up. While not profitable, it actually did keep me going much longer than the odds would have suggested. Then I got bored. Someone could have done that kind of system but with some kind of progressive betting, and make an arbitrary amount of money. Then keno went away, which is probably for the best ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Jackpotting twice off maximum bets is ridiculous even considering that though.

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Guest Elijah Mikaelson
37 minutes ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

Me and a few others did some testing on Keno, and we actually did get some promising results that implied that careful progressive betting strategies might be profitable. I never went more advanced than just spamming minimum bets and writing down the incident rate of each number, swapping to the 'luckiest' numbers as they showed up. While not profitable, it actually did keep me going much longer than the odds would have suggested. Then I got bored. Someone could have done that kind of system but with some kind of progressive betting, and make an arbitrary amount of money. Then keno went away, which is probably for the best ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Jackpotting twice off maximum bets is ridiculous even considering that though.

Didn't win the jackpot once, got 8 numbers twice and that is not the jackpot, and only once was that betting the max amount.

last post just had to clear that up as people like Seb and Ronny D are not now for stating facts only what they believe.

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6 hours ago, HeroofTime55 said:

What he did was just as wrong whether or not he collected an irl cut, and the irl cut doesn't make it better or worse, because breaking an internet game's rules isn't an irl financial crime, in case you were curious.

Ironically, according to the story, he was given cash by Nokia and told to buy 10b for himself, and pocketed the cash instead.  The only smart thing he did in all this imo.  Had he actually gone ahead and bought 10b PnW money for himself, THAT would have elevated his wrongdoing to a new level (and I would be the first person yelling for it to be removed).  But he didn't.  Whether because he didn't need to, or recognized that irl money is better than PnW monopoly fun bux, is left up to your interpretation.

But, you know, I'm here posting in a thread that actually asked Alex to have access to a player's irl finances so I am not sure you understand the difference between the game and reality.

====

As an interesting side note, I am in favor of Alex "garnishing" in-game income of cheaters in cases where illicit money (allegedly) cannot be otherwise recovered.  Half Nokia's login bonus and revenues until the 10b is paid down.  How about that?

What he did was just as wrong whether or not he collected an irl cut, and the irl cut doesn't make it better or worse, because breaking an internet game's rules isn't an irl financial crime, in case you were curious. - Lmfao, please, at this point even you should realise how absolutely biased that point of view is. That is basically taking away from profit Alex might've made through credits in the future. An irl cut means he's profited off this, despite your own claims he simply connected people, and isn't the 'innocent' middle man you claim him to be. Claiming that an irl cut does not make things better or worse is beyond single-minded, of course making actual fricking money off this, and hence indirectly taking money from what might've been used to buy credits.

The rules do not say that the buyer and seller are punished differently, both are punished the same way and so, anyone else making irl money off it should be punished the same way

But, you know, I'm here posting in a thread that actually asked Alex to have access to a player's irl finances so I am not sure you understand the difference between the game and reality. - Take a look in the mirror, I responded to a post of yours after you started rambling on about how one of the people that profited irl are not as bad as those who made a profit ingame. 

As an interesting side note, I am in favor of Alex "garnishing" in-game income of cheaters in cases where illicit money (allegedly) cannot be otherwise recovered.  Half Nokia's login bonus and revenues until the 10b is paid down.  How about that? - Indifferent to this, honestly don't care but then wipe Elijah's nation too, or do you still intend on trying to protect someone who profited irl off this?

Regardless, considering how pointlessly obtuse you're being there's no point in me arguing beyond this, have fun o/ 

 

6 hours ago, Sweeeeet Ronny D said:

Real-World Transactions for In-Game Materials

Politics & War has a limited donation system to prevent the game from being "pay-to-win." In addition to limits on Credit usage, it is against the rules for players to make exchanges of real-life money or goods for in-game materials, including but not limited to: in-game money, and in-game resources. Examples of this type of behavior would include: sending someone real-life money for in-game money or in-game resources, purchasing someone a Steam game for in-game money or in-game resources, sending someone a gift-card for in-game money or in-game resources, and any other sort of real-world trade for in-game goods.

The punishment for real-world transactions for in-game materials will be a complete nation reset upon first offense, and a permanent ban from Politics & War upon a second offense.

What he did easily falls in real world transactions for in game materials.  To argue otherwise would just be obtuse.  As stated in the rules first offense is nation reset, which both NR and George did on their own.  The Known Cheater EM has not done this, not that I blame him seeing as his nation is considerably more valuable than both NR and George combined and by an additional factor of 5-10x.  The other reason you see such a push against the Known Cheater EM, is because many people believe his wealth "earned" thru Keno was done thru duplicitous means, which is fair seeing how he won the jackpot twice that has odds of 1 in 428,010,179,098

I am agreeing with you, i'm guessing wrong quote lol.

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I got about halfway through that post before I gave up, I can't cut through the levels of stupidity anymore.  These forums are really the bottom of the barrel in terms of intellect.  What I did manage to struggle through does not even merit a response. 

It's the second dumbest thing I've seen all week, only because the dumbest thing was Trump telling people to inject Chlorox.  Not even y'all can top that.

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17 hours ago, Elijah Mikaelson said:

For someone who right now is banging on about the rules how about you follow some of your own advice?, Can you prove i cheated and Keno? if not then stop claiming i did and follow the rules? It has been made very clear without proof you can not make baseless claims.

I didn't accuse you of anything, I said many people believe you cheated at Keno.  This is a fact, many people think you cheated at keno to accumulate your wealth.  You are welcome to deny it, just like you originally denied your involvement with the current cheating scandal.  However because you have been caught cheating and lying about the current scandal, then trying to leverage your guilt to make yourself an extra 10 billion your credibility is less than zero.  So you are welcome to protest your innocence as much as you would like, but you have already shown everyone in this game the quality of your character.

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Guest Elijah Mikaelson
On 4/21/2020 at 8:03 PM, Seb said:

first time EM cheated he spawned 14bn from Keno. There was no proof. Popular belief was he got lucky.

second time EM cheated he spawned 34bn from Keno. There was no proof. Popular belief, too much of a coincidence.

third time EM cheated he sold 10bn pw cash for 3k dollars. There is a ton of proof. Popular belief, kick the guy out of the game already.

 

Well first time was 5 billion, over a year later it was 25 billion, and as Alex made it clear but you are to dumb to understand I was the middle man for someone else selling 10 billion, in the words of Alex, talk about me all you want but at least use facts.

22 hours ago, Micchan said:

3k?

Time to rob TKR bank and make some irl money

It was 400 but seb is dumb you should ignore him tbh, he talks a lot but never says about he loaned NPO billions to keep us all at war and the fact three of his banks fail and then he buys a city

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On 4/22/2020 at 5:50 PM, Machiavelli said:

The sad thing is that it is not out of the question that EM didn't participate in the selling of ingame money and this is all fabricated, with him simply admitting to shit because he fears he's gonna be deleted if he doesn't.

However EM has been a toxic, unlikable POS for so long that nobody is willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

That being said the dudes devoid of any redeeming features so idgaf whether or not he did it, him going is an objective benefit to the community

Well I would give him that benefit of the doubt & I know that he is as non-toxic as johnson & johnson baby wash unless u gung ho take a "full swig"( which most of you guys lean very closely to doing so).

Edited by Firwof Kromwell
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                            memed-iFirwof650x150.jpeg.9a92ea222b9010f9fae97a1864a6759e.jpeg     

 I personally voice my own thought processes based on own desires of informational curiosity as well love for discussion based on questions & statements I made rather just trusting info like a collective hivemind

Onlookers whom hop aboard the brainless bandwagon refusing inter-articulation based on assumed feelings, go give yo balls a tug ya tit fugger         

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6 hours ago, Elijah Mikaelson said:

he talks a lot but never says about he loaned NPO billions to keep us all at war and the fact three of his banks fail and then he buys a city

You say us, but you abandoned the alliance you were leading and war deserted half way thru.  Just another sparkling addition to your resume.

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