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5 hours ago, Epi said:

Increase the amount of spies you can recruit, it currently takes 20 days. Make it 10 or 5.

What do you think about a domestic policy which increases the number of spies you can buy per day by 1 while the policy is active?

 

13 hours ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

Addendum: Undeployed spies cost 1/3 upkeep.

For the love of all tiny nations rolling IA, pls this.

Makes sense to me.

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2 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

What do you think about a domestic policy which increases the number of spies you can buy per day by 1 while the policy is active?

 

Makes sense to me.

That'd increase the total spies recruitable per day to 4. 60/4. Still 15 days. Keep in mind you can destroy up to 18 spies in a single op. 

I like the idea of a policy to buff this though. Additionally it might be good to reduce the number of tanks you can sabotage. It's nuts compared to other units. 

Edited by Epi
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This is in the other thread but I feel it's relevant for this one too so I'll paste

 

There's nothing wrong with the spy game. Once an alliance wins the spy war they should have free reign on spying planes, and use half of their ops to continue to pin the spies.

If you make it easier to build spies back up then you are in a cycle of never being able to actually spy military because it will always be spy vs spy.

 

If you think the spy game is a numbers game then you are very wrong....don't forget surfs up was a thing, chaos was essentially fully spy wiped by ketog, and ketog was sitting about 30 spies per nation average. Coming in to dial up our side was heavily outnumbered, 3-4:1 IQ favoured in fact, and we flipped that spy war over time.

If Alex nerfs spying because a group of people won the spy game while 3-4:1 outnumbered, then there is an overarching problem - complaining enough for the admin to change the game when it is by no means unbalanced

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Guest Elijah Mikaelson
On 2/18/2020 at 3:55 PM, Prefontaine said:

Spy Retention - You can pin down a nation’s spies too easily without letting rebuild

  • Active Duty Spies - You can deploy any number of spies up to your maximum to active duty. These spies count towards your defensive and offensive capabilities with spies.
  • Undeployed Spies - When you build spies they go to the undeployed pool. These spies do not add to your offensive or defensive capabilities until you select their deployment.
  • You can have 5 spies in undeployed status even if you’re at max spies in deployment.
  • If you have the CIA project you can have 10 spies in undeployed status even if you're at max spies in deployment. 

Not sure how effective this would be as you can lose more than 17 spies in one attack, in the last war in two attacks i went from 60 spies to like 35. having another ten in back up wont help me, being able to make spies faster would, takes 20 days to max spies.

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5 minutes ago, Bjorn Ironside said:

Not sure how effective this would be as you can lose more than 17 spies in one attack, in the last war in two attacks i went from 60 spies to like 35. having another ten in back up wont help me, being able to make spies faster would, takes 20 days to max spies.

It's not trying to address how quickly one can rebuild, it's trying to allow for a rebuild even when being regularly spied upon. As the very beginning for the OP states: "You can pin down a nation’s spies too easily without letting rebuild". The standby additional reserves do allowed for a quicker redeploy to max as you already have small amounts standing by. Once you start losing spies you can also start building more reserves. Lets say you have the CIA project, 60 spies, and 10 reserves. Over the course of 3 days you lose all of your spies. During those three days you would have been able to build 9 new reserve spies bringing you reserve count to 19. You'd be able to max redeploy 14 days rather than 20. Normally if you'd attempt to rebuild from nothing during those 20 days routine spy attacks can easily keep you pinned down at zero. This method does allow for max redeploys even when being regularly spied. To reiterate, this change is not a fix designed to make you rebuild spies faster but provide the ability to do so even while being spied regularly. Your complaint is therefore invalid. However, thank you for your concern. 

1 hour ago, dtc justice said:

This is in the other thread but I feel it's relevant for this one too so I'll paste

 

There's nothing wrong with the spy game. Once an alliance wins the spy war they should have free reign on spying planes, and use half of their ops to continue to pin the spies.

If you make it easier to build spies back up then you are in a cycle of never being able to actually spy military because it will always be spy vs spy.

 

If you think the spy game is a numbers game then you are very wrong....don't forget surfs up was a thing, chaos was essentially fully spy wiped by ketog, and ketog was sitting about 30 spies per nation average. Coming in to dial up our side was heavily outnumbered, 3-4:1 IQ favoured in fact, and we flipped that spy war over time.

If Alex nerfs spying because a group of people won the spy game while 3-4:1 outnumbered, then there is an overarching problem - complaining enough for the admin to change the game when it is by no means unbalanced

You should be able to come back eventually. If a side loses all spies whether they have a numbers advantage or not there should be an avenue for them to rebuild spies. If someone so wished they could prevent someone from ever building spies again with little cost/risk. As others have stated, it takes a long time to rebuild spies. If a side spends those 15-20 days coordinating their re-deployments of spies to have their alliance re-max spies on the same date, that's a good thing. It's encouraging a coordination and more skill based aspect of the game. 


This is not a change that is coming from "complaining to the admin". It is something that is unbalanced. You should not be able to hold down one person, or a group of persons with the ease that exists currently once they've been zeroed on spies. This change is a means to rebuild those spies without losing them over the course of 2-3 weeks. During that time they will have little to no defense against spy attacks.

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1 hour ago, Prefontaine said:

It's not trying to address how quickly one can rebuild, it's trying to allow for a rebuild even when being regularly spied upon. As the very beginning for the OP states: "You can pin down a nation’s spies too easily without letting rebuild". The standby additional reserves do allowed for a quicker redeploy to max as you already have small amounts standing by. Once you start losing spies you can also start building more reserves. Lets say you have the CIA project, 60 spies, and 10 reserves. Over the course of 3 days you lose all of your spies. During those three days you would have been able to build 9 new reserve spies bringing you reserve count to 19. You'd be able to max redeploy 14 days rather than 20. Normally if you'd attempt to rebuild from nothing during those 20 days routine spy attacks can easily keep you pinned down at zero. This method does allow for max redeploys even when being regularly spied. To reiterate, this change is not a fix designed to make you rebuild spies faster but provide the ability to do so even while being spied regularly. Your complaint is therefore invalid. However, thank you for your concern. 

You should be able to come back eventually. If a side loses all spies whether they have a numbers advantage or not there should be an avenue for them to rebuild spies. If someone so wished they could prevent someone from ever building spies again with little cost/risk. As others have stated, it takes a long time to rebuild spies. If a side spends those 15-20 days coordinating their re-deployments of spies to have their alliance re-max spies on the same date, that's a good thing. It's encouraging a coordination and more skill based aspect of the game. 


This is not a change that is coming from "complaining to the admin". It is something that is unbalanced. You should not be able to hold down one person, or a group of persons with the ease that exists currently once they've been zeroed on spies. This change is a means to rebuild those spies without losing them over the course of 2-3 weeks. During that time they will have little to no defense against spy attacks.

Okay but you have to also realize that if an alliance can get back into the spy get easier, then what's the actual purpose of spying? Because in wars we focus on wiping spies so we can spy military, but if they rebuild too quickly then we are stuck in a cycle of just killing spies and never actually killing military. By making spies rebuild quicker you would essentially make spying a thing of the past

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10 minutes ago, dtc justice said:

but if they rebuild too quickl

15 days isn't that quick.

 

It takes about 2 days to destroy someone's spies completely.

 

 

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2 hours ago, dtc justice said:

Well with the new project you build 4 per day so that helps. 

That's 15 days, yes that's what I'm saying.

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  • 4 months later...

Honestly we just need to increase the rate that spy’s can be rebuilt. Currently it takes 20 days with IA to rebuild max spy’s. That is three weeks. It is way to long. The rebuild time with IA should be 10 days maximum. Changing that would fix this problem.

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17 minutes ago, lightside said:

Honestly we just need to increase the rate that spy’s can be rebuilt. Currently it takes 20 days with IA to rebuild max spy’s. That is three weeks. It is way to long. The rebuild time with IA should be 10 days maximum. Changing that would fix this problem.

No it wouldn't you can still be held down forever and never have more than 5-10 spies.

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no on the basis that its a pre post wich means the shoddy placeholder numbers will not be changed or thought through and all the discussion in this thread past the op is void if implemented

rawr

Edited by katashimon13
rawr
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4 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

No it wouldn't you can still be held down forever and never have more than 5-10 spies.

Actually its completely the opposite lol. The reality is as long we leave the rebuild time of spys as its at(3 weeks with IA LOL) then nothing we do will solve the problem. Your enemy's could leave for a 10 day vacation come back and you still wouldn't have a chance to recover from losing the spy war. That's the reality were in. I do like your idea of spy retention and think it  should be implemented, however unless we also make spy rebuilding take a reasonable amount of time(not 3 weeks with IA LOL) then the problem will remain.

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2 hours ago, lightside said:

Actually its completely the opposite lol. 

Not at all, actually. You're just flat out wrong on this one. There is no change to rates of purchase that would make it so that you can come back from having your spies spied away every day and kept near or at 0 constantly that does not involve making it so you can buy far too many spies at once. I can see you're clearly upset by going around and downvoting everything, I'm sorry that you're upset but that doesn't make what you're saying less incorrect. 

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3 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

Not at all, actually. You're just flat out wrong on this one. There is no change to rates of purchase that would make it so that you can come back from having your spies spied away every day and kept near or at 0 constantly that does not involve making it so you can buy far too many spies at once. I can see you're clearly upset by going around and downvoting everything, I'm sorry that you're upset but that doesn't make what you're saying less incorrect. 

I disagree. As I said above if the rate spys can be rebuilt is kept the same then the problem were facing will remain the same. Even with the solution you are suggesting. 3 weeks is way too long of a rebuild time. I down voted because I disagree with a few of your ideas that i was reading through today. 

Edited by lightside
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Posted (edited)
On 6/30/2020 at 3:19 PM, Prefontaine said:

 I can see you're clearly upset by going around and downvoting everything

ty for adding emphasis on numbers in the new thread ;3

now get admin to actually absorb them xP

rawr

lol that lasted long >_>

rawr

Edited by katashimon13
rawr
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