New player focused project 2: Stimulated Economy

[Prefontaine]

Stimulated Economy: Provides a boost in income with a focus at newer nations.

Cost: $2,500,000 x Current number of cities (ex: 10 city nation would cost 25M)
Oil: 1,000 x Current number of cities (ex: 10 city nations would cost 10k oil)
Coal: 1,000 x Current number of cities (ex: 10 city nations would cost 10k coal)

Effect: Cities 1-5 gain a Gain an automatic +50% increase to commerce after commerce income has been calculated (caps at +$100,000 daily income per city). Cities 6-10 gain an automatic +25% increase to commerce after commerce income has been calculated (caps at +$50,000 daily income per city)

Note: Total daily income bonus max at 10 cities is +$750,000 daily. Caps are in place to focus on new players bonuses versus older players.

[Guest Elijah Mikaelson]

39 city nation

100m
40k x 2700 oil = 108m
40k x 2300 coal = 92m 

Total of 300,000,000 so in 400 days they make their money back passively,  750k a day

City 40 costs 2.4b say 2.6b with infra and land it brings in about 550k a day depending on build that. 

I would buy this project instead of a city thats an easy win

[Raphael]

Looks fine on the surface but I have to ask when we'll stop adding catchup mechanics?

I think the past year or two has shown that a coordinated effort by new players can already serve up a challenge to the existing community that has been playing for years.

 

PnW's population needs new blood, I agree. We can do more to retain new people, yes. I don't think adding extra catch-up mechanics will further help this goal.

[Guest Elijah Mikaelson]

2 hours ago, Bartholomew Roberts said:

Looks fine on the surface but I have to ask when we'll stop adding catchup mechanics?

I think the past year or two has shown that a coordinated effort by new players can already serve up a challenge to the existing community that has been playing for years.

 

PnW's population needs new blood, I agree. We can do more to retain new people, yes. I don't think adding extra catch-up mechanics will further help this goal.

Right now people believe that older nations have invested to much time to quit, so they are being ignored to catch up mechanics, I worry with the rate we are going out, we will make all whales and older nations feel pointless as what has taken them years with take others weeks.

[Prefontaine]

1 hour ago, Bjorn Ironside said:

Right now people believe that older nations have invested to much time to quit, so they are being ignored to catch up mechanics, I worry with the rate we are going out, we will make all whales and older nations feel pointless as what has taken them years with take others weeks.

Did you gain most of your money through Keno? You're only worried about people catching up after you caught up?

Edited February 19, 2020 by Prefontaine

[Guest Elijah Mikaelson]

11 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

Did you gain most of your money through Keno? You're only worried about people catching up after you caught up?

Really this is your only come back?, look at Vein 33 cities in 423 days, or Dryad 33 cities in 416 days did they win Keno? 

Also i spent most of that money on land not cities, but, as if you had paid attention you would have seen there are tons of people who grow quickly as they find ways, generally those who are slow are not putting in the effort, in a poor alliance with high taxes and no growth or they simply want to remain at a small city count?

Did any of these enter your mind when coming up with catch up ideas? IF people really wanted to catch up they can do so pretty quickly already, what you are trying to say is it should be easy for a guy to log in once a day make no effort and jump in city count, if this happened the game would die.

Edited February 20, 2020 by Elijah Mikaelson

[Prefontaine]

8 hours ago, Bjorn Ironside said:

Really this is your only come back?, look at Vein 33 cities in 423 days, or Dryad 33 cities in 416 days did they win Keno? 

Also i spent most of that money on land not cities, but, as if you had paid attention you would have seen there are tons of people who grow quickly as they find ways, generally those who are slow are not putting in the effort, in a poor alliance with high taxes and no growth or they simply want to remain at a small city count?

Did any of these enter your mind when coming up with catch up ideas? IF people really wanted to catch up they can do so pretty quickly already, what you are trying to say is it should be easy for a guy to log in once a day make no effort and jump in city count, if this happened the game would die.

So we should limit money gained by winning wars and making creative deals as mercs to hit people? Riiiight. The first person who jumped ahead was Steve back in the day, he did it through obsessive market deals. He wasn't punished because he was creative and put in the time and effort to do so. These sort of projects are designed for those people who play the game casually. This one specifically gives 750k max a day. That's 1000 days to make 750M. The daily bonus project will gain 50M in a perfect 100 days of logging in an not fighting. 

If you're worried about THAT level of income causing people to catch up too quickly, then I don't have words simple enough to explain it to you. I've humored your irrelevant opinions for far too long at this point. This is the last time you will ever receive any of my attention. You're ignored on both discord, in game, and on the forums from this point forward. 

[Raphael]

36 minutes ago, Prefontaine said:

So we should limit money gained by winning wars and making creative deals as mercs to hit people? Riiiight. The first person who jumped ahead was Steve back in the day, he did it through obsessive market deals. He wasn't punished because he was creative and put in the time and effort to do so. These sort of projects are designed for those people who play the game casually. This one specifically gives 750k max a day. That's 1000 days to make 750M. The daily bonus project will gain 50M in a perfect 100 days of logging in an not fighting. 

If you're worried about THAT level of income causing people to catch up too quickly, then I don't have words simple enough to explain it to you. I've humored your irrelevant opinions for far too long at this point. This is the last time you will ever receive any of my attention. You're ignored on both discord, in game, and on the forums from this point forward. 

I think the complaint that Bjorn is attempting to articulate is that the people who have invested a lot of time into this game don't want to see catch-up mechanics that make it so "casual" players can catch up to them within a few months.

 

If you're speedy and with cooperative alliance mates, you can hit city 30 within a year already. City 30 is basically the "end game" right now but we have a handful that have gone beyond that.

The main playerbase is sitting between city 12-25. We're all rapidly approaching the "end game" where there's nothing for us except watching new players get more and more catch-up mechanics.

 

Again, I'm not opposed to this particular project - but it brings up the repeat issue that the people who actually pour their time and effort into this game are being ignored and told "they have enough".

[Prefontaine]

17 minutes ago, Bartholomew Roberts said:

I think the complaint that Bjorn is attempting to articulate is that the people who have invested a lot of time into this game don't want to see catch-up mechanics that make it so "casual" players can catch up to them within a few months.

 

If you're speedy and with cooperative alliance mates, you can hit city 30 within a year already. City 30 is basically the "end game" right now but we have a handful that have gone beyond that.

The main playerbase is sitting between city 12-25. We're all rapidly approaching the "end game" where there's nothing for us except watching new players get more and more catch-up mechanics.

 

Again, I'm not opposed to this particular project - but it brings up the repeat issue that the people who actually pour their time and effort into this game are being ignored and told "they have enough".

There's nothing stopping Yarr or any other players from adopting a play style similar to what Mythic has. Just because some players have been successful within the rules (assuming they have not cheated) doesn't mean catch up mechanics are bad. They didn't even gain their cities through catch up mechanics, they grew based on the fact that there is much more money in the game now than when the first player reached 30 cities. It's easier to fund a players growth up to that point through deals, and raiding. 

This is the same thing I told NPO when they talked about problems with whales. There was nothing stopping NPO from funding 10-20 people up into the 30s and 40s city counts as a sort of whale hit squad.

It should never be impossible for a player who creates a nation today to catch up to me who has over 2000 days in the game. If the top end of the game wants to rest on it's laurels and let new players with motivation, effort, and hustle catch up and surpass their size that's not a mechanics issue, it's a gameplay style issue. 

When 15 cities was the largest in the game, a catch-up mechanic that would help people grow to 10 cities very quickly would be bad. When that is more than doubled now, I would almost say start players at 10 cities were it not for the fact that cities 1-10 is the perfect, less expensive time to grow and experience some aspects of the game.

[Guest Elijah Mikaelson]

2 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

So we should limit money gained by winning wars and making creative deals as mercs to hit people? Riiiight. The first person who jumped ahead was Steve back in the day, he did it through obsessive market deals. He wasn't punished because he was creative and put in the time and effort to do so. These sort of projects are designed for those people who play the game casually. This one specifically gives 750k max a day. That's 1000 days to make 750M. The daily bonus project will gain 50M in a perfect 100 days of logging in an not fighting. 

If you're worried about THAT level of income causing people to catch up too quickly, then I don't have words simple enough to explain it to you. I've humored your irrelevant opinions for far too long at this point. This is the last time you will ever receive any of my attention. You're ignored on both discord, in game, and on the forums from this point forward. 

blocking me wont change the fact your ideas are weak and have no effect on catch up at all, but whatever.

Just to point out most people can get to 20 cities the avg most are on within 150 days of playing.

Edited February 20, 2020 by Elijah Mikaelson

[Raphael]

1 hour ago, Prefontaine said:

There's nothing stopping Yarr or any other players from adopting a play style similar to what Mythic has. Just because some players have been successful within the rules (assuming they have not cheated) doesn't mean catch up mechanics are bad. They didn't even gain their cities through catch up mechanics, they grew based on the fact that there is much more money in the game now than when the first player reached 30 cities. It's easier to fund a players growth up to that point through deals, and raiding. 

This is the same thing I told NPO when they talked about problems with whales. There was nothing stopping NPO from funding 10-20 people up into the 30s and 40s city counts as a sort of whale hit squad.

It should never be impossible for a player who creates a nation today to catch up to me who has over 2000 days in the game. If the top end of the game wants to rest on it's laurels and let new players with motivation, effort, and hustle catch up and surpass their size that's not a mechanics issue, it's a gameplay style issue. 

When 15 cities was the largest in the game, a catch-up mechanic that would help people grow to 10 cities very quickly would be bad. When that is more than doubled now, I would almost say start players at 10 cities were it not for the fact that cities 1-10 is the perfect, less expensive time to grow and experience some aspects of the game.

I don't feel like you're addressing my questions, but I don't want to further derail your thread.

This project is decent on its own merits.