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Increase the GC penalty


Valid User Name
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People have been complaining about planes being overpowered, so perhaps we should boost the strength of Ground Control to 50%. Full disclosure, I'm saying this as someone who's currently being GC'ed, so it would weaken me too if the change went live now.

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Feeding the alliance, one conquest at a time.

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23 minutes ago, Valid User Name said:

People have been complaining about planes being overpowered, so perhaps we should boost the strength of Ground Control to 50%. Full disclosure, I'm saying this as someone who's currently being GC'ed, so it would weaken me too if the change went live now.

Obviously you're looking at this from the wrong angle.

The first thing that we need to do is quintuple the cost of aircraft.

The second thing that we need to do is implement those changes.

The third thing that we need to do is remove aircraft entirely. 

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2 hours ago, CitrusK said:

Obviously you're looking at this from the wrong angle.

The first thing that we need to do is quintuple the cost of aircraft.

The second thing that we need to do is implement those changes.

The third thing that we need to do is remove aircraft entirely. 

I agree aircraft are so 21st century. We need more tanks imo. 

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I agree that we need to increase plane cost. However I think other changes are needed to solve the current plane only meta. Specially we need to attack the source of the problem. That is planes are the only unit type that can attack other units. Thus if we add a mechanism for other forms of attack it should fix the problem.

specifically I think if a nation achieves ground control in a war then they should have the option to direct their ground forces to attack air fields. This would do less infra damage but it will destroy a small number of planes. Likewise with ground control then a nation could have the option to attack naval bases

 

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Going to respectfully decline on this one. Increasing the GC penalty will only compound the issues with this war system's balance, which is already way out of whack on beiges and Vacation Mode alone.

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49 minutes ago, dragonshardz said:

Planes are fine as they are, since they are expensive to replace. This puts greater emphasis on alliance-level economic planning and building up warchests.

Except they are actually cheap. So this logic doesn’t hold. Maxing ground is much much more expensive. 

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2 minutes ago, Clarke said:

A long overdue change is needed to be sure. I would remove the ability for airplanes to target soldiers at least. 

This isn’t needed. Because soldiers are so cheap, anyone who air strikes soldiers is lossing a lot as their gas/munition cost far outway then soldier cost

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5 hours ago, dragonshardz said:

Planes are fine as they are, since they are expensive to replace. This puts greater emphasis on alliance-level economic planning and building up warchests.

Planes are the second cheapest unit after soldiers, despite being the most powerful unit by far.

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The problem with planes is that strategically speaking, the entire updeclare mechanic is dependent on planes.

 

Right now, you roughly have a C^2.8 nation equivalency system wherein C2.8 (50% updeclare max under ideal circumstances) determines the effective nation score, provided that you don't have things like BK prots being incompetent at fighting or certain alliances being able to deploy less than 50% of their combatants due to inactivity.

 

The situation under this circumstance is that a force of more numerous smaller nations is always going to be more combat and resource effective than a concentrated force of larger nations.

 

However, if you switch it, hypothetically, to C^4 because updeclares have been hard-nerfed by busting planes, then it becomes optimum for the entire game to become Grumpy, i.e, the optimum configuration is to have few nations (militarily optimal) that have cash funnelled in from many nations (economically optimal).

 

The problem with the war system right now is triple and self-related:

 

-Wars aren't damaging enough, and take too long to prosecute.

 

These are related factors. If you can't damage the opponent effectively, you have to resort to member damage, which takes a long time because it's concomittant on getting people to say "PnW sucks, I'm leaving, my alliance sucks, I'm leaving". The typical solutions to increase damage don't even work because you end up with an equilibrium effect; alliances won't go to war unless they have war chests that enable prolonged warfare and rebuilding, and if war damage / costs are increased, people will just delay wars because they're expecting another 8-12 month Dial-Up War.

 

-Wars are extremely difficult to defend against; fighting a defensive war isn't fun or it's extremely difficult to win a defensive war (BK has the notable exception of having turned the tables in Dial-Up, but it lost most of its allies and NPO had to break its coalition with T$ to step in). O

 

-Planes are overpowered and things like tanks and ships mainly have an ancillary (tactical) purpose. But if you nerf planes, we go back to the C^2.8 problem wherein the optimum is no longer to have many nations supporting mass tiering, but a few nations in a top tier supported by peons (debt-slaves).

 

In other words, revisions to the war system are systematic because a single change will likely break the system.

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One reason planes are so powerful is that that they take a long time to rebuild.  6 days, vs 3 for soldiers, and 5 for tanks and ships.  Plus the fact that you can airstrike another unit AND take out someone's planes in the same attack.

Giving people more space to rebuild planes without them being immediately killed would help make plane battles more competitive.  Hence my suggestion here: 

 

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