Fix Moderation as a weapon

[Sardonic]

30 minutes ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

I see. So when Goons does it, then it's fine, but when anyone else does, then it's "bad faith". Goons fabricates meanings to words and reports pre-censored images, and has flooded the subforum with hundreds of bogus reports, yet one report is too many?

On top of that, you don't even address the hypocrisy inherent in your own tantruming about 'dog-whistles', preferring to give hatred and bigotry more of an audience and more legitimacy rather than take actual constructive steps to discourage it? And you declare that blind trust, in the face of indications to the contrary, is what Alex is fundamentally owed?

You are the problem. You are abusing the system, you are knowingly and intentionally spreading what you profess to hate.

There are solutions to this problem, but it is abundantly clear that neither you nor Goons nor apparently even the moderation staff are interested in constructive efforts, only hypocrisy.

Since this is the suggestion forum, a suggestion: come to terms with the fact that we're not acting in bad faith.  We want a cleaner game, not just for us, but for all who play here.  Spend some time on introspection.  Try examining the situation from a more objective angle.

[dragonshardz]

58 minutes ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

I see. So when Goons does it, then it's fine, but when anyone else does, then it's "bad faith". Goons fabricates meanings to words and reports pre-censored images, and has flooded the subforum with hundreds of bogus reports, yet one report is too many?

On top of that, you don't even address the hypocrisy inherent in your own tantruming about 'dog-whistles', preferring to give hatred and bigotry more of an audience and more legitimacy rather than take actual constructive steps to discourage it? And you declare that blind trust, in the face of indications to the contrary, is what Alex is fundamentally owed?

You are the problem. You are abusing the system, you are knowingly and intentionally spreading what you profess to hate.

There are solutions to this problem, but it is abundantly clear that neither you nor Goons nor apparently even the moderation staff are interested in constructive efforts, only hypocrisy.

We aren't fabricating a damn thing. We report ableism, slurs, and other general Bad Things Which Are Against The Rules when we see them. Also, as a note - "pre-censored" images doesn't make the image okay if it's baldly associated with Bad Things.

The solution to bigotry, dog-whistling, and other forms of hate isn't to politely ignore it and hope it will go away. The solution is to tell the people doing it to stop, then (figuratively) beat them with a clue-by-four until they get the picture.

The only problem with moderation is how little of it is done proactively. The thing you don't like is how unimpressed we are with your pseudo-intellectual BS, and just how much foully poisonous crap we've dredged up to report to Alex without even trying.

The solution to not being allowed to risk cutting yourself on your own edge is posting on Stormfro- oh, wait, they got shut down. Never mind.

[Madokami]

1 hour ago, dragonshardz said:

We aren't fabricating a damn thing. We report ableism, slurs, and other general Bad Things Which Are Against The Rules when we see them. Also, as a note - "pre-censored" images doesn't make the image okay if it's baldly associated with Bad Things.

The solution to bigotry, dog-whistling, and other forms of hate isn't to politely ignore it and hope it will go away. The solution is to tell the people doing it to stop, then (figuratively) beat them with a clue-by-four until they get the picture.

The only problem with moderation is how little of it is done proactively. The thing you don't like is how unimpressed we are with your pseudo-intellectual BS, and just how much foully poisonous crap we've dredged up to report to Alex without even trying.

The solution to not being allowed to risk cutting yourself on your own edge is posting on Stormfro- oh, wait, they got shut down. Never mind.

Obviously, you haven't heard of Parody before, I bet you'd be reporting the wiki page for being pro Nazi in that case.

Edited December 21, 2019 by Madokami
fixed link

[The Meat]

2 hours ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

I see. So when Goons does it, then it's fine, but when anyone else does, then it's "bad faith". Goons fabricates meanings to words and reports pre-censored images, and has flooded the subforum with hundreds of bogus reports, yet one report is too many?

On top of that, you don't even address the hypocrisy inherent in your own tantruming about 'dog-whistles', preferring to give hatred and bigotry more of an audience and more legitimacy rather than take actual constructive steps to discourage it? And you declare that blind trust, in the face of indications to the contrary, is what Alex is fundamentally owed?

You are the problem. You are abusing the system, you are knowingly and intentionally spreading what you profess to hate.

There are solutions to this problem, but it is abundantly clear that neither you nor Goons nor apparently even the moderation staff are interested in constructive efforts, only hypocrisy.

Have you thought of the fact that maybe, just maybe, the only one impressed with your pseudo-intellectualism is you? Of course not, because you're so damn impressed with the shininess of that polished turd that you ignore that it's still a turd.

 

You do you, Noctis Jr, and if it breaks the rules you will be punished. It's that simple.

Edited December 21, 2019 by The Meat
Durp

[dragonshardz]

2 hours ago, Madokami said:

Obviously, you haven't heard of Parody before, I bet you'd be reporting the wiki page for being pro Nazi in that case.

What even the heckle are you talking about?

[HARPER.txt]

2 hours ago, Madokami said:

Obviously, you haven't heard of Parody before, I bet you'd be reporting the wiki page for being pro Nazi in that case.

 

[durmij]

6 hours ago, Sir Scarfalot said:

I see. So when Goons does it, then it's fine, but when anyone else does, then it's "bad faith". Goons fabricates meanings to words and reports pre-censored images, and has flooded the subforum with hundreds of bogus reports, yet one report is too many?

On top of that, you don't even address the hypocrisy inherent in your own tantruming about 'dog-whistles', preferring to give hatred and bigotry more of an audience and more legitimacy rather than take actual constructive steps to discourage it? And you declare that blind trust, in the face of indications to the contrary, is what Alex is fundamentally owed?

You are the problem. You are abusing the system, you are knowingly and intentionally spreading what you profess to hate.

There are solutions to this problem, but it is abundantly clear that neither you nor Goons nor apparently even the moderation staff are interested in constructive efforts, only hypocrisy.

You've already called yourself out as a bad faith actor, with your "holding up a mirror" admission. The best argument you can currently muster is that ignoring things makes them go away, which is absolutely not the case. Which is also supposed to give way to these mythical "constructive steps." Tell me, how do you solve a problem without addressing it?

Your also misconstruing my arguments in bad faith, which is no surprise. Nowhere do I say that we need to have blind faith in Alex. I simply point out the power structure involved in the ownership of these boards and fact that the system has been the same for years.

In fact, I implied that I don't have faith in Alex's moderation. I believe good moderation requires summary bans of obvious bad faith actors, but the only accounts on the forum that have been subject to that, to my knowledge, and Chinese bots. I think Alex is far to lenient, the warn point system is far to easy to game and obvious deliberate game violations never result in a summary ban unless the nation is inactive. Or a multi.

You seem to be fixated on the fact both you and GOONS are reporting things, but there is nothing similar out of the fact that they are reports. You've fall prey to linear thinking, evaluating to things to be the same because they share an element, even after you've constructed your scenario.

Also, repeating key words of my argument back to me doesn't make a counter argument. It's just a lazy, uninspired attempt at whataboutism. 

[Michaellaneous]

5 hours ago, Madokami said:

Obviously, you haven't heard of Parody before, I bet you'd be reporting the wiki page for being pro Nazi in that case.

Blatant/Ironic bigotry, racism, sexism or abelism are parody of what, exactly?

[Noctis Anarch Caelum]

Crazy you can get a bunch of strikes for not giving serious responses to troll reports. Should give them a bunch of strikes if annoyed at the waste of time from it all.

[Micchan]

If you notice something wrong in a post, avatar, nation name, city name, etc. try to message the player fist and try to solve without covering the moderation with reports so Alex can use his time to fix the game

[The Meat]

55 minutes ago, Noctis Anarch Caelum said:

Crazy you can get a bunch of strikes for not giving serious responses to troll reports. Should give them a bunch of strikes if annoyed at the waste of time from it all.

You should teach your Scarfa-son how to properly rant.

[Sardonic]

46 minutes ago, Micchan said:

If you notice something wrong in a post, avatar, nation name, city name, etc. try to message the player fist and try to solve without covering the moderation with reports so Alex can use his time to fix the game

You can't be serious.  Yeah, let's just go ahead and open a dialog with white supremacists.  What could possibly go wrong there?

[HARPER.txt]

19 minutes ago, Sardonic said:

Yeah, let's just go ahead and open a dialog with white supremacists.  What could possibly go wrong there?

I'd actually brought this up in DM's with Quote the "white supremacists" (just quoting coz I don't get the whole skin and w/e thing at all) and they even said logically enough they'd rather not bring things up with to quote "SJW's" because of this exact reason. If people have the walls up/Ground stance/concrete view , before you even start the convo, why bother? basically asking for the trouble by trying.

Edited December 21, 2019 by Unwanted
grammarmanbad

[Madokami]

Just because one apple is bad doesn't mean the basket is

[HARPER.txt]

7 minutes ago, Madokami said:

Just because one apple is bad doesn't mean the basket is

I blame the person who picked the bad apple and put it in with the rest.

[Astryl]

Why would I reach out/engage with someone I don't want to in order to enforce the rules of a game that I don't own?

 

That's literally the entire point of moderation. If anything, Alex should get more moderators so he can focus on other things.

[HARPER.txt]

2 minutes ago, Always Fear Jazz said:

Alex should get more moderators so he can focus on other things.

Chris actually did an amazing job for the time he was here, but he burnt out very fast trying to (still 1man) moderate/admin alot of the game

Edited December 21, 2019 by Unwanted

[Madokami]

1 hour ago, Unwanted said:

I blame the person who picked the bad apple and put it in with the rest.

How would you filter them out then? Cut every apple open and check? What of the people reported for profanity? Are they automatically white supremacists too?

Edited December 21, 2019 by Madokami

[Noctis Anarch Caelum]

Just because some alternation of the words in a phrase has one meaning, doesn't mean a modification of it has the same. Eternal Goon would refer to how a Goon is always a Goon; nothing to do with Jews. lol

[HARPER.txt]

41 minutes ago, Madokami said:

How would you filter them out then? Cut every apple open and check?

To re quote myself here since as norm, ppl only read on here what they want to read/hear.

"blame the person who picked the bad apple and put it in with the rest."

I said also that Chris did an Amazing job while he was here, even just having that +1 made alot of difference, but, he burnt out, hence why you need more than 1-2 guys + some to deal with entirely Cancerous/toxic community like these games and others normally have, Pro-active admins.

The Answer is what Jazz Said here:

". If anything, Alex should get more moderators so he can focus on other things."

 Get More/New pickers to help, the apples are irrelevant/cant be blamed for being apples.

[Madokami]

2 minutes ago, Unwanted said:

Cancerous/toxic community like these games and others normally have, Pro-active admins.

I think other people would agree that after GOONS joined, toxicity increased hundredfold

[HARPER.txt]

More that is was brought into the open and people get venomous/petty/spiteful  when their Egos/pride get poked, but sure little chicken nugget ?

Edited December 21, 2019 by Unwanted

[Joi]

Hello again, mud-slinging thread -

Let me just nip the two most common complaints in this thread off in the bud here and now:

1. A red armband with a white circle and a black icon inside that circle is 100% reminiscent of Nazi iconography, even without the swastika. Please choose different colors for your 'totally-not-a-Nazi' armbands in the future, or don't use images with military figures wearing armbands at all.

2. Noctis Anarch Caelum, your ally (who for some reason hasn't joined the forums to personally defend themselves despite being on the same network as you), was asked to take down a message from their Nation description that called for the 'extermination' of real peoples. They refused and were duly warned by moderators. In response, they doubled down and put in their nation description that 'the eternal Goon must be EXTERMINATED.' Not only were they just told by moderators not to call for 'exterminations' of peoples any more, they were also using a very specific phrasing that was last used by Nazis in relation to Jews. Their hateful page of inflammatory text was taken down yet again, and now their nation description is calling the people who moderate and play this game Nazis. Noctis, you need to stop blaming the moderators for doing their jobs and spend more time keeping your ally's rule-breaking outbursts in line before they get their third strike and are banned.

[Noctis Anarch Caelum]

Wow, you got offended he called for extermination of an in-game group in his description for a warn. More reason the meme should stick that you cried to the mods over it with false equivalencies.

[Joi]

You completely misread, Noctis Anarch Caelum. No one is getting offended over the word 'extermination.' It is literally against the rules to advocate genocide and to promote racist ideologies. Here are the steps laid out for you again.

1) Your ally was calling for the extermination of real world people and was asked nicely to to change it or delete that one specific word, 'extermination,' since advocating genocide is against the rules. He was warned that if he didn't remove that one word, he'd get in trouble with the moderators. He didn't change his nation description and he got in trouble.

2) Immediately after getting in trouble for using the word 'exterminate' in his nation description, he doubled down and in his nation description began calling for an all-caps 'EXTERMINATION' of people, people he called an 'eternal' problem to a 5-year old browser game, despite the fact that those 'eternal' people have only been in this game for less than half a year. Their hateful screed within their Nation description (now removed, check the game reports forum to read it) also was disrespectful to the moderators and to all other people playing the game. He got in trouble for the whole thing, not just one word or phrase.

3) Your ally is yet again breaking the rules via his nation description, as I pointed out earlier with my link to his nation page. Help convince them to change their nation description to something appropriate soon or it will most likely get them banned from the game.

People are going to the mods because this ally of yours continues to break the rules and gets even more indignant when they are called out and asked to alter their poor behavior.