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peace talks


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I guess the point of my post was to bring yet another perspective to this situation regardless of what you hold to be true.  And you're absolutely right about my focus on TKR, simply because tallying up the number of posts and attributing it to each aa/coalition would be an onerous task indeed........I've got better things to do with my time ? But without tallying it up, I would suggest that the percentages of comments attributable to people in a position to negotiate on behalf of their aa's/coalition A, and the rest may well be similar. 

At the heart of it is my view that your gnashing of teeth and frustrated comments in attempting to explain your surrender term is wholly self inflicted and avoidable.  As I have demonstrated, it seems statistically viable that you have spent the vast majority of your time engaging with individuals who are not suitably informed or authorized enough to negotiate the future of this war.  By simply engaging with our leaders in the appropriate forum, rather than taking it to the masses, clarity of position most likely would have been established and possibly even agreement (at least on some points). As leaders of large aa's, you expose yourselves by being triggered and reacting at each and every aggravating post from the masses.

@Shadowthronebelieve it or not I was not really trying to deflect anything here, though I'm intrigued and a little flattered that you think I was ?

Edited by Etatsorp

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Guest PhantomThiefB
9 hours ago, Buorhann said:

Just a OOC reply.  When's the last time anything about IRL mattered about a game?  Let alone this one?

IC: Yes, your leaders did.

>let the adults handle it

Anybody want to correct him on this?

Possibly the fact that the game's called Politics and War? Politician's lie all the time, and deflect blame. Sort of like this game. Crazy huh? Almost like the game may be based off the Politics human's invented throughout the ages..

And no, we still didn't. Notice how no one bothered to correct me? Almost like I have a point or something. Who knows. ?‍♂️

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13 hours ago, Akuryo said:

The better compromise is that both Coalition A and B surrender to Coalition G who gives terms to both of them.

I agree that everyone would be better off if they surrendered to GOONS.

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9 hours ago, Etatsorp said:

Here's a curious notion, there are 20 posts (2.3%) out of the 854 replies in this thread from TKR Gov/FA (3 people in fact) who may have anything to do with actual negotiations.  IMO none of these could be construed as inflammatory.  Unless representing in a clear manner a difference of opinion is considered inflammatory of course.  The posts from other TKR members equals a grand total of 97 (11.3%).  (I'll put in here a +/- 0.2% accuracy disclaimer - there was a lot of posts to sift through ?)

I would argue the angst and knotted knickers we seem to be dealing with here, and associated Coalition B FA policy development, could be attributed to a large portion of the remaining 86.4% of posts.

If negotiation is what coalition B wants, then it needs to happen elsewhere.  Hearts, minds and common ground are not being won here.

I'd only have enough energy to get through about 3 pages of counting before I got tired and gave up, so I have about 8.6% of the stamina as you do for making a count like this.

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9 hours ago, GreatWhiteNorth said:

Possibly the fact that the game's called Politics and War? Politician's lie all the time, and deflect blame. Sort of like this game. Crazy huh? Almost like the game may be based off the Politics human's invented throughout the ages..

And no, we still didn't. Notice how no one bothered to correct me? Almost like I have a point or something. Who knows. ?‍♂️

No one bothered to correct you because:

A. The first part in your post. Everyone tries to deflect blame everywhere else like outside politicians, like this game is based of human created politics, huh Crazy.

B. Almost every NPO mouthpiece is at least decently good at avoiding gotcha posts. whether confirming your statement or denying it, one way or the other someone is going to use it against them later on. Especially if they can prove (Or have the patience to go digging all over these very forums) they did. And to them it's better to just let points they don't like or insignificant points to drop and not defend or attack them. Because they get lost in the fray of one line "wit" or WoT they and others type.

C. They like it better when others respond against you because it's easier to make that responder, and everyone they're tied to an enemy. Or a villain. Not that everyone doesn't already do a good enough job of that themselves. -Gestures Vaguely at Everything-

 

OOC question. When's the last time your IRL government told you the truth or was honest on a world scale?

What do you mean? The government never lies. There is no global warming, The Mueller Report was a witch hunt, and Epstein most definitely killed himself in a guarded cell while on suicide watch.  /s.

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42 minutes ago, Pasky Darkfire said:

Almost every NPO mouthpiece is at least decently good at avoiding gotcha posts. whether confirming your statement or denying it, one way or the other someone is going to use it against them later on. Especially if they can prove (Or have the patience to go digging all over these very forums) they did. And to them it's better to just let points they don't like or insignificant points to drop and not defend or attack them. Because they get lost in the fray of one line "wit" or WoT they and others type.

I’m almost offended. 

 

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1 hour ago, Epi said:

@Etatsorp I think you're underestimating the value of these forums. Bk-NPO and Kertog are all too keen to abandon them when their situation is disadvantageous. But without them we wouldn't be able to post public statements or engage with the 'entire' enemy coalition, leaders and members alike.

If i post something here, i get a proper and political explanation, rather than a meme or a short response such as i would get on discord. Sure the thread has at times dragged on and i'd prefer we move to greener pastures; different and more entertaining topics. But it has contributed to the talks. Maybe we'll see peace tomorrow because of it, that's up to you guys.

I don't think its beneficial for Chaos/KETOG to enter into talks where their surrender is a given & can't be used as a bargaining chip at all; with only additional terms for them to be negotiated from there. Entertaining the idea of such terms in public I think just makes it seem like they are contemplating surrender and not really useful toward anything.

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8 hours ago, Epi said:

@Etatsorp I think you're underestimating the value of these forums. Bk-NPO and Kertog are all too keen to abandon them when their situation is disadvantageous.

Maybe you can speak for BK/NPO, but I don't think you really speak for KETOG.

-------

On topic:  The reason why peace hasn't been achieved in any manner is because there's multiple reasons as to why the war still exists.  It's not just a matter of pride, but that is one of many factors.  It'd be absolutely stupid to give in, as it'd simply cement the power base of IQ 2.0 when they're the cause of the war the begin with.  Simply look at them consistently dragging more alliances in (Even going so far to continue hitting previous allies, such as OWR and Carthago now).

Is that what you want?  To pretty much give up to that?

Older vets can say whatever about Syndisphere back in the day and our dominance then, but we never pulled that shit (Other than Mensa bullying Vanguard, but even those that surrendered/white peaced out were never dragged back into the same war).

 

Let's put it this way.  There's quite a few of you rumor mongering around saying, "Just surrender and rebuild, then go back at it again".  What you're forgetting is that 'rebuilding' gives them time to consolidate their new numbers (Just look at GPWC and GOONS adding into this).  Their current allies wouldn't give up their spot riding on the coattails, because they'd risk being put through the traumatic experience of getting their asses handed to them again.  So you got IQ 2.0 + GPWC + GOONS + whoever else cowers to them.

>"But we got top tier advantage if we rebuild!"

You won't for very long.  And it wasn't that much of an advantage when some of the upper tier nations simply sat on their ass and not attempt to even dive down to make use of their higher city counts, or even attempted to fight when they got attacked.  If you're not willing to fight a war, don't count yourself as part of an advantage.  Leave the war decisions to vets, or go hide off into some obscure place and build up pixels.

Don't get me wrong though, there are some upper tier nations still making use of their city count with their raids.  Those are the real MVPs.

>"The war is boring though"

That is literally the only way to lose.  You cannot be pinned down.  It's easy and cheap to rebuild.  The only way to actually lose is by being bored of the game and the war itself.  Congrats, you as a player, lost.

And if you're one of those players, congratulations again - you've just contributed to regressing the game back into stagnation.  If you think there will be big changes in the game after the war, well, you won't be wrong on that simple line of thinking - but you'll be wrong in what you want to happen.

>"There's no reason why we're fighting"

There's very clearly a huge reason to fight.  Just go dig through the Alliance section of the boards and look at the initial DoWs, or hell, the big leak that came from TCW.  If NPO/BKsphere were willing to plot together to roll the two smaller spheres - what makes you think that wouldn't happen again?  It's already been verified that NPO/BK won't fight each other, so who else would they go after once their membership base got bored and wanted a fight?

This isn't a matter of Roq claiming that it's in NPO's best interests to join in due to some fear of a MegaTKRsphere, it's their fear of losing BK as an ally despite severing that MDP tie.  Which is dumb, considering how alliances in KETOG and Chaos have fought each other more times than NPO/BK has been in any kind of conflict within the past few years (Or even supported them too in Knightfall).

>"But I don't like to fight"

Why are you playing then?  Just hop in VM and contribute to the forums.  This is almost as bad as the players who whined about Baseball being their life.

>"I don't know how to fight/raid"

Talk to your local pirate or milcom player.  Every alliance has them.

>"I just need a break"

Take a break.  There will be plenty of targets and plenty of rebuild opportunities when you get back.

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Guest PhantomThiefB
14 hours ago, Pasky Darkfire said:

No one bothered to correct you because:

A. The first part in your post. Everyone tries to deflect blame everywhere else like outside politicians, like this game is based of human created politics, huh Crazy.

B. Almost every NPO mouthpiece is at least decently good at avoiding gotcha posts. whether confirming your statement or denying it, one way or the other someone is going to use it against them later on. Especially if they can prove (Or have the patience to go digging all over these very forums) they did. And to them it's better to just let points they don't like or insignificant points to drop and not defend or attack them. Because they get lost in the fray of one line "wit" or WoT they and others type.

C. They like it better when others respond against you because it's easier to make that responder, and everyone they're tied to an enemy. Or a villain. Not that everyone doesn't already do a good enough job of that themselves. -Gestures Vaguely at Everything-

 

OOC question. When's the last time your IRL government told you the truth or was honest on a world scale?

What do you mean? The government never lies. There is no global warming, The Mueller Report was a witch hunt, and Epstein most definitely killed himself in a guarded cell while on suicide watch.  /s.

Okay so I'm home now so I can respond properly. (As I mentioned in my ingame msg, I unfortunately can't seem to use the forums on mobile outside of reading/reacting.)

A. That's what I was getting at. Which is true, glad we agree on some things.

B. Thanks I guess, while I wouldn't suggest I'm well versed in Orbis politics (as aside, I had a much better understanding of CN politics between 06-10.) I don't really disagree with the rest of your assessment so yeah, pretty much.

C. Also don't fully disagree. Thought for the record anyone from KERCHTOGG or w/e they're called side I don't view as villains at all, they're defending their own actions and interests, just as we are and I don't fault that. That said eventually it'll be time to let bygones be bygones and move on.

And lastly, I laughed. Good humor Pasky. ?

 

@Buorhann I might get to your recent post later, but I apologize for the "child" comment the other day, I had a rough week and shouldn't have went that far/taken that out on you. (And that's not a good excuse, therefore the apology.)

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Guest PhantomThiefB
8 minutes ago, Epi said:

Out of curiosity when do talks begin, it's already the 1st in my timezone :dab: On that note tho, all of you have your halloween decorations up too late now, muhahaha

What's it like being in the future Epi?! Actually gimme the lotto numbers, I need 'em. Or the game scores. Proline works too.?

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4 hours ago, Epi said:

Out of curiosity when do talks begin, it's already the 1st in my timezone :dab: On that note tho, all of you have your halloween decorations up too late now, muhahaha

Disliked for the dab

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