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[NPO Call to Arms]$yndicate RoH and Treaty Activation


Prefonteen
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1 hour ago, Aragorn, son of Arathorn said:

1: Polar had stated several times we did not consider the war over, it is your gov that continued to ghost her despite being very active in other FA efforts that led to this. TEst was not in any way at peace with us and that had been made clear multiple times.

2: We wanted surrenders and guarantees that they would not immediately use their infra in the middle of a war time to start funding their allies. Given the character of those involved having a protector guarantee that alliances they protect abide by a peace agreement is not unreasonable. Negotiation is in bad faith when your leader ignores our representative for considerable lengths of time, and deemed it necessary to return to open combat. 

3: T$ escalated this by aggressively attacking BK who was continuing hostilities in the current war. As for coalitions, T$ also called Sans and Typhon before BK called any allies of their own, indicating that you were escalating to full coalition warfare in aid of the enemy side.

1. That's a misrepresentation and you know it. Talks with Leopold were ongoing at the time of BK escalation.

2. You demanded t$ act as a guarantor for terms lasting a year. You also struck mid-negotiations while t$ was mulling your ludicrous demands. 

3. No. BK did so by opening fire mid-negotiations. t$' responses throughout have been measured and of similar force to BK's escalations.

1 hour ago, Malal said:

1.  I was using ranges as an example.  And we don't actually know if it's a separate legal entity.  They could just be poaching members for their bank AA to make it look legit or they're just rebuilding to send war aid or even re-join the war proper. Because of this potential issue we required proof of TEst independence.

 

2.  These four nations claimed that they had no intention of returning back to the war and re-joining Arrgh so we simply asked them to confirm that by promising not to aid our enemies or re-join arrgh for a period of time.

The fact that the term was not accepted is proof in everyones eyes that they both wanted to and were going to provide assistance to our enemies and/or they had the full intention of returning to aargh extremely soon. 

 We only wanted TS to prove that those two options were not the case by promising to ensure that those specific four nations upheld the terms. TS refusing to do so means could very likey mean that they were aware of these four nations plans to assist our enemies soon and/or re-join aargh.

 

3. As has been stated numerous times, TS was well aware that we considered these nations active combatants and that we were going to continue our defensive war against them if they did not properly exit the war via a surrender. In return for our generosity TS choose to stall the surrender negations for over two weeks. Peace was never agreed because T$'s FA leader kept refusing to engage in the talks forcing us to discuss with the IA minister instead.

2. the period of time was of a retarded length, and as I mentioned above, you struck mid-negotiations while t$ was mulling the demands. It looks like you sought escalation from the get-go.

3. t$ was involved in diplomatic negotiations to resolve the matter, and BK struck mid-negotiation. The IA "minister" was a triumvir, and if he was speaking to you he was empowered to represent t$. This in part due to the FA leaders' real life. You were made aware of this. Even if negotiations stalled initially, they were ongoing and active when you decided to strike. if you were going to strike due to stalling, you would have done it before Leopold took over the baton. Your argument is bullshit.

3.5- Again- the matter is one of you escalating a conflict on t$ and NPO opting to hit t$ protectorates in defense of you, rather dan defending t$ whom it holds a triggered treaty with.

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3 hours ago, Malal said:

It's the same conflict, T$ choose to enter into it to assist nations that declared war on us nearly 4 months ago now

Pardon my implicit bias. Assuming you are going to war with TEst for harboring enemies, I can possibly see it as an extension of the conflict. If you willfully escalated in diplomatic talks, its a separate entity just as TEst is a new and separate entity. In the former, t$ is activating an oA, in the latter, its an MD. And either way, NPO isn't going to destabilize the coalition which includes a number of non-allies because it would mean KERTCHOGG or w/e would gain a significant advantage.

Either way, the CB on either side really need a proper investigation with some sub peonaed logs and some actual definition of terms such as war dodger, and clarification on how you decide which nations (as opposed to alliances) you decide you're at war with.

There seem to be nice strong arguments on either side. popcorn.jpg

Hey Krampus, the signature edit is under account settings. Actually, here's the link.

https://forum.politicsandwar.com/index.php?/settings/signature/

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43 minutes ago, Prefonteen said:

1. That's a misrepresentation and you know it. Talks with Leopold were ongoing at the time of BK escalation.

2. You demanded t$ act as a guarantor for terms lasting a year. You also struck mid-negotiations while t$ was mulling your ludicrous demands. 

3. No. BK did so by opening fire mid-negotiations. t$' responses throughout have been measured and of similar force to BK's escalations.

2. the period of time was of a retarded length, and as I mentioned above, you struck mid-negotiations while t$ was mulling the demands. It looks like you sought escalation from the get-go.

3. t$ was involved in diplomatic negotiations to resolve the matter, and BK struck mid-negotiation. The IA "minister" was a triumvir, and if he was speaking to you he was empowered to represent t$. This in part due to the FA leaders' real life. You were made aware of this. Even if negotiations stalled initially, they were ongoing and active when you decided to strike. if you were going to strike due to stalling, you would have done it before Leopold took over the baton. Your argument is bullshit.

3.5- Again- the matter is one of you escalating a conflict on t$ and NPO opting to hit t$ protectorates in defense of you, rather dan defending t$ whom it holds a triggered treaty with.

1. If they are active enough to intervene in our war to get owr/cathage peace they are active enough to respond in a timely matter.

 

2. No aid to people we're fighting is normal. Considering the fact that we fully expect arrgh to continue their dumb policy of fighting forever and never signing a nap it made perfect sense to demand their war dodging gov to promise not to rejoin for a good long while.

 

3. If you didn't want us to hit you should've agreed faster. We would've asked for fairly mild terms originally but after several weeks of getting the run around of course we would raise them due to the lack of shown respect.

 

4. As discussed numerous times, NPO is in-fact fulfilling the terms of their /Non-chaining/ treaty by having not attacked you. Their treaty was not activated since, even if TS was entering in the defense of, it was a proct treaty chain-in. All alliances that hit T$ otoh have no such non-chaining clauses in their treaties and all chained in normally.

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Orbis Wars   |   CSI: UPN   |   B I G O O F   |   PW Expert Has Nerve To Tell You How To Run Your Own Goddamn Alliance | Occupy Wall Street | Sheepy Sings

TheNG - My favorite part is when Steve suggests DEIC might have done something remotely successful, then gets massively shit on for proposing such a stupid idea.

On 1/4/2016 at 6:37 PM, Sheepy said:
Sheepy said:

I'm retarded, you win

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9 minutes ago, Malal said:

1. If they are active enough to intervene in our war to get owr/cathage peace they are active enough to respond in a timely matter.

 

2. No aid to people we're fighting is normal. Considering the fact that we fully expect arrgh to continue their dumb policy of fighting forever and never signing a nap it made perfect sense to demand their war dodging gov to promise not to rejoin for a good long while.

 

3. If you didn't want us to hit you should've agreed faster. We would've asked for fairly mild terms originally but after several weeks of getting the run around of course we would raise them due to the lack of shown respect.

 

4. As discussed numerous times, NPO is in-fact fulfilling the terms of their /Non-chaining/ treaty by having not attacked you. Their treaty was not activated since, even if TS was entering in the defense of, it was a proct treaty chain-in. All alliances that hit T$ otoh have no such non-chaining clauses in their treaties and all chained in normally.

 

1. Is that what this is about? BK seeing a chance to exert revenge for losing Carthago/OWR?

 

Look. These alliances have been stuck in your ego-induced shitfest for months on end now. Can you blame them for seeking out?

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If nothing else, this should cement who was winning the *other* global war when NPO-BK-TC-Cit/etc have that much spare capacity to take on whatever this is.

Also, people should make sure they do proper background checks when admitting or protecting members who haven't arranged individual peace after leaving an ongoing war. It's a tactic that's so common here but makes no sense and is asking for problems.

 

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Just now, Placentica said:

If nothing else, this should cement who was winning the *other* global war when NPO-BK-TC-Cit/etc have that much spare capacity to take on whatever this is.

Also, people should make sure they do proper background checks when admitting or protecting members who haven't arranged individual peace after leaving an ongoing war. It's a tactic that's so common here but makes no sense and is asking for problems.

 

It was intentional. tS wanted to move on and make a new sphere and having Boyce and co was a good pick up for them and letting their own member who ghosted CoS back in was the decision they felt was right as well.

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 What people tell their own members doesn't actually matter.  To explain the inns and outs of the system is too complicated for 90% of the players so there's no reason to waste time explaining it especially since most of them don't actually remember or really care.

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Orbis Wars   |   CSI: UPN   |   B I G O O F   |   PW Expert Has Nerve To Tell You How To Run Your Own Goddamn Alliance | Occupy Wall Street | Sheepy Sings

TheNG - My favorite part is when Steve suggests DEIC might have done something remotely successful, then gets massively shit on for proposing such a stupid idea.

On 1/4/2016 at 6:37 PM, Sheepy said:
Sheepy said:

I'm retarded, you win

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1 minute ago, Malal said:

 What people tell their own members doesn't actually matter.  To explain the inns and outs of the system is too complicated for 90% of the players so there's no reason to waste time explaining it especially since most of them don't actually remember or really care.

This was a public statement.

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4 minutes ago, Malal said:

 What people tell their own members doesn't actually matter.  To explain the inns and outs of the system is too complicated for 90% of the players so there's no reason to waste time explaining it especially since most of them don't actually remember or really care.

Changeup is a member of TKR

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6 minutes ago, Malal said:

What people tell their own members doesn't actually matter.  To explain the inns and outs of the system is too complicated for 90% of the players so there's no reason t waste time explaining it especially since most of them don't actually remember or really care.

Snorts and chortles "You mean the ignorant masses who fed you all up-votes are unable to comprehend the basic function of the world you got them from?" Rolls laughing "Oh my.. this is precious."

 

V̢ͭ̔ͣͯͫ͐ͥ̄͗ͬ̄ͭ͏̹͖̺̲͕̦͉̣̙́i̡͕͙̺̗̻̹̘͇̋̽̆ͮ̈́́ͭ͢͢͞n̢̛̫̘͎̝̪̪͔̙̗̘͚͇͚̣̦ͫ̊ͩ͊͌͘͜͝i̡̱̭͉͔̘̖̠̲̺̍͐ͯ̌̈̾̾́̔͑̋ͬͯ̑̚͠ ̸̷̨̜̦͓͖͖̹̫̹̖̮͙̻̻̹̺̞͍̙ͥ̏̃ͨ̓͑̏͊̀ͯ̉ͯ̒͒͗̄̚V̢̢̡̙̻̳̘͖̖̟͚̣̬̏͐ͮ͒̎̈̽̽̾̂̔̅ͩͪͦ̑̿̏̍ͅͅi̶͍̮͈͇̰̫̯͉̜͒́̉̊̓̚͘̕ḑ̸͈̟̫̹̟͓̹̠͇̗͖̤̥̰̲̬ͮ̉ͫi̴͔̪͍͇͌̋̆̃͆̈̔ͧ͆̎̋ͥͫͫ́͢͠ ͕̞̠̯͍̫͚̪̺͓̣̦̖ͧ̓ͬ̎̀͝ͅV̴̨̤̙͔̥͍̟̦̥̺̟̯͔̤̫ͬͮ͑͌i̞͎̹͇̻͎̘̳̮̤͙̯̩ͪ̂͌̐ͪ͐̓̃ͧ̈̓͛̎̄̈͞͡ͅd̸̵̬̫͔͙̀̓͐̈́͜͡e͍̝̗̱̝͈̣̤̜̳͑̓͂̈ͯͤ̕͡v̸̖̰̟͈̠̰̣̮̦ͭ̆̑ͮͮ̾͊ͤ̒̊̊ͯ̈́ͬ͌ͭ̚͜ȏ̧͊̿͑ͯ̚͏̲̣̩̼͙ṙ̴̴̠̗̼̥͈̣̌͋̃̔̎̿ͨͥ͗̈̋̋̆̐̀ͩͦ̕͘͜ͅá̵̦͎̣͇̦̙͙͖̟̣̲̳̘̣̣̳̝͊̈́̐̇̑̔̈̉͒̆ͬv̵̨̭̝̯̫̞̜̭̭̘ͦͧͭ͋̂ͣͨͮ̑ͪͤ͌ͣ̒̽̾̾͢͠͡î̛̞̟̤͍̰̂ͪ͛̒̍̅͒̉̅ͥͯ̌̽̈́̾̈͛̏͡ț̷̲̟͎̰̟͇͖͖̻̼̰̞͎̯͚͚ͩͧͨ̆͗̕͢.̵̢̦̭̳̗͖͙̼̜̩̖̹̤͓͔̈́ͫ̂͊ͩͮͤ̕͢͡ͅ ̴̡̰̙̙͕̩͈̩̻͕̰̠͑̅̔ͩ͛ͩ͆̂̀̋ͬ͂̑̔I̶̢͇̖͖̥̠̳̘͚̓͋ͮͮ̊̽ͯ̈̽̒̓ͮ͂ͨ́͠f̶̴̥̗̙̳̫̜̥̗̞̳̍̅̎̍̒̒ͮ̇̈̊̿̚̕ ̸̢͕͇̜̙̩̭̮̱̈̓͆ͨ̄ͥͮ̽ͧ́́͘ͅy̡̱͚̺͈̳̤̺̞͎̻̮̣̤̘͖̥̗̬͒̊̉̅̆ͧ́͛̌̑ͣ̿̾͋̊̀͜͟͡o͚̳̯͙̬̦͉͚͙̦ͣͥ̿̏̌ͩ͗͌̎̆ͫ̌̿ͫͩͥ̕͝ͅu̷̲̘̖̯͈ͪ̔̇ͥͧ̈́̓ͬ̓͑ͨ̋̓̃̅͜͜ͅ ̸̢̖͇̜͖̺̙̲͙̻̫̝̣̗̈ͦ́͞a̶̢̢̰̻̰͍͎͙̺̪̪ͯͯ̄̋ͮ̒͛̅ͬ͆͐ͧ̃ͬͤ͛ͯ͟r̷̟̦͈͈̥̤̖̤͔͎̤͉̜̼͇͇ͭ͂ͩ̔ͥ̀͋ͨ̈́̊͐̈̆͒̓̃̎́̕͘͝e̶̱͓̜͙ͩ͒ͪ̂͛̋͆̈̂̌̌̒̂̐ͪ͗̓͐͠͞ ̴ͦ̉̏̓ͨͬ̐̓͛ͦ̽ͮ̎̎̓͟͏̶͏͖̩͙͕̗̘͉̯̫̹̱̺̻̞͇á̴̧̮̹̜͓͕͒̽̈ͤͪͮ͋̊̑̔ͤ͂̉͑͛̚͜t̛ͪͮ̈́̋̉͏̮̫͓͙̲͔̼ ̴̵͎̫̝̼͈̰͇̑͋ͤͩͮ͘w̵̡̥̫͉̯̯̭̪͈̜͎̤͇̙͎͖̳̝͛̄̔ͯ͐̓̅ͩ͑̃ͤͥ̕͢a̵̡̡ͦͫ͊ͣ̍̓͐͒̈̒ͧ͌̉͛͏͖͕̜͉͉r̵̛̘̞͙͕̉̄̔́̉̓ͯ͌̾̓̄͞͡ ̨͊̇̊͏̛͓͕̘̤͟͞w̢͚͎̥̙̜̠̻̫̹̮̦͛̑͒͋̏͗̊͜͞i̸̶̧͖͈̥͚̭̰̦̞̫̥̬̰̝͍̬̗̦͚̲ͨͨ̉͟t̸̵̵͖̦͉͕̱͇̐͑ͧ̋͆̀̔ͯͨ͌͆̚ḧ̵̛͎̫̬̣̩͇̥̞̭̼̜̩͕̈̐̂̌̍̎ͬͭ͌͠ ̛̘̫͔̹͓̻̗̻̲͉̞̞͚̩̯̮ͪ̔̌̿̍ͦ̀ͥ̍̎̿ͨ̽̀́͢͠m̶̶̡̭͎͎̤̩̹̩̞͇̦̼̳̝̑̅̑͛̽ͭ̅̓̆̍ͫͮ́̄͘ͅeͬ̊ͨ͂̿ͨ̊͝҉̸̺̰̯̤͚̖͜ͅ,̡͎̖͇̙͎̿ͨ̆ͤ̑́͡ ̷̸̫̲͕̻̫̰͇̖̳̗̙ͮ́̓̉ͯͭ̀́͜ͅp̆͐ͥ̐͒ͦ̐͊̂̓̈̊̽ͫ͊̊̇ͨ͠͏̸̼̘̦̺͈̠̰̤͚̝͙̰̺̩̰r̛͙̩̭͚̞͇̩̥̼̦ͯ̇̃̐̂̔ͫͯͫ̏ͭͤ̑̀̽̾͗ͫ̓̀̕͡ͅe̛̳͖͚͇͎͑͑̓̍̓͗͗̓̄ͦ͠͝͡p̸̘̮͉̼̯̲̻͔͕͇͖͖̟̗̭̹̘͚̗ͩ͗͛̉͒ͥ̀̌̆ͩͤ̃ͨ̽̿͒ͨ͠͠a̸̷͒̒̍̀͗͑͜͏̱̘̘̲̮̯̳̘̀r͙̜̝̲̯̝͔̦̺̗͉͚͉͙͍̠̓ͦ͊̿ͬ̈ͪ͂̌̚͟͡͡ͅe̶̪̱̪̟̣͉͉̹͈̫͇̝̪̮̙ͯ͂̈̈̓ͦ̍̂̾̏ͪ̏ͭͧ͛ ̷̧̭̝̺̗̟ͬ̾̏ͫ̕t̷̵̡͓͔̜͙̘͈̲͈̳ͦ̊̇̽̅̄̀ͮ̒ͪ͆̑̓͊́͝ͅǫ̶͈̞͚̹̻̤̲̙͖̪̍̃̐̏ͦͪͦͤͩ̽̿̿ͮͪ̿̀͂̀͡ ̡̤̹̲̜̪̞̽̽̓ͥ̒ͨ͊̐ͫ͗ͫ̐̈́̑ͥ̕͢͡b̴̨̨̛̦͇̪̠̺͔͙̤̜̉͐̓̌̀͟ͅͅë̢̼͔̗̰̦̼̘̯̟̩͚́͗͆͒͋̀͆̑̋ͩ̉̒͊ͬ͊̃ͪ̆͊͟͡ ̵̡̛̳̜̦̱͎̞ͤͣ̏͒ͯ̇̈́͗ͮ̇̎ͬͧc̴͍̞̼̹ͨͭ̇̒͌͗̉ͥͥ͗̓̎̌̅͒ͭ̇̅́o̧̧̤̘͕̬̰̣͔͖̘̥͖̜̐ͥ́ͤ̒̔͘͠ͅņ̶̛͔͎͍͉ͪ̾̃ͦ͛̈́̒̅̒s̶̷̸̙͍̹͎̬̜̦̞̤̥̦̙̞̥͚͈̬̋̃͒ͮ͒ͪ̆ͩͯ̒͋̾̒̾͋̅͌̓͡ǔ̶͚͈̠̭̻̜̉ͪ́̓ͩͤ̅̌̌̈̍ͤ̾̌͛ͥ͗ͦ͟͜͞m̛̯̪̘͍̜͕͕̞̤͖͉͉͔̞͙͈͓̐ͦͯ̽ͬ͒̾ͣ̓̒̔͛ͤ̎̏̈͜͝è̵̱̜̯̙͔̜̝͙̼̬̤̥̒̒ͣ͒̈́͊̀́̕͟ḑ̧̅͂̈͌̔ͧͤ̋ͤ́́̒̂̋͗͆ͮ̚҉̙͚̬̻͎͚̤͞.̴̨̺̜̟̯̹̪͋̋͆ͫͧ̐̔ͩ̉͌̋͋͞

 

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49 minutes ago, Filmore said:

But choking the life out of games is what NPO does best. Just look at NationStates and CN for starters. 

lol we killed NS now too? It's one thing for Smith to make ignorant posts about CN without even bothering to consult its wiki, but this is a level of stupid above that. I challenge you to find a single informed person who believes NPO killed NS, even setting aside the fact that it's pretty hyperbolic to say NS is dead is in the first place.

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20 minutes ago, Prefonteen said:

snip

Partisan just give it up mate, arguing over if someone was aggressive or not doesn't change anything. Fact is t$ took in people we regarded as enemies then rejected any talks so we had unfinished business with TEst. Also that 2nd screenshot contradicts the first, when TEst rejected them they became legit targets. So if your trying to use my late night ramblings as "evidence" for your attempts to spin things in a way that suits you. Then you're clearly out of your depth.  

10 minutes ago, Pasky Darkfire said:

Changeup is a member of TKR

Which doesn't actually refute his point, 

2 minutes ago, Edward I said:

lol we killed NS now too? It's one thing for Smith to make ignorant posts about CN without even bothering to consult its wiki, but this is a level of stupid above that. I challenge you to find a single informed person who believes NPO killed NS, even setting aside the fact that it's pretty hyperbolic to say NS is dead is in the first place.

NPO is the cause of all the worlds problems obviously.

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1 minute ago, Edward I said:

lol we killed NS now too? It's one thing for Smith to make ignorant posts about CN without even bothering to consult its wiki, but this is a level of stupid above that. I challenge you to find a single informed person who believes NPO killed NS, even setting aside the fact that it's pretty hyperbolic to say NS is dead is in the first place.

NS ever really count as alive? Don’t think they ever got war working, but didn’t play it.

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3 minutes ago, Edward I said:

lol we killed NS now too? It's one thing for Smith to make ignorant posts about CN without even bothering to consult its wiki, but this is a level of stupid above that. I challenge you to find a single informed person who believes NPO killed NS, even setting aside the fact that it's pretty hyperbolic to say NS is dead is in the first place.

I thought they killed CN, are we changing that, or just declaring they killed both?

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30 minutes ago, Prefonteen said:

Well I'll be damned.

Solar is allied to BK, so I don't have to declare on them.

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           Imperial Decree   

The Order has always sought to honor its defensive obligations where they may exist to the letter of the treaty. Our good friends in the Syndicate have decided to call upon us in their quest to secure safe passage for pirates to Treasure Island. Does it matter that they no longer felt obligated to the Order at all? No.  Pigeons have terrorized Orbis for over 5 years at this juncture and we will do what we can to stop them. Even though the odds are against us and we will likely fail at this endeavor, we cannot allow the reign of terror TheNG and underlordgc have unleashed upon Orbis to continue without us standing up to their tyranny. They delight in chasing players out of the game. The Syndicate's philanthropic efforts for the benefit of  the innocent Frontiersmen in Sanreizan only raised the ire of the purveyors of purple drank and their feathered friends.  We cannot simply let this slide. They have committed numerous sins and the Syndicate are a brotherhood of saints who could never harm even the smallest of animals.

Pursuant to article II in our treaty with the Syndicate, the New Pacific Order declares war on Acadia and the United Purple Nations.

May Alex have mercy on your souls for we shall have none.

 

                                                              

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