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Global War Peace Terms - Discussion

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11 hours ago, Justin076 said:

Going on February and this war from October still ongoing? What a fricking pathetic disgrace all sides of this war are. Like seriously? Four fricking months? This is setting a terrible precedent for the future of this game. People talking about this game getting a second life but holy shit this is probably the lowest of all time. People who complained about a 6 month nap, well how about one side of a global sitting on the other for four months. IQ/Syndi(not all of Syndi cause I know some want out) suck a dick. TKR/TCW, swallow your pride and accept terms because you’ve been clearly beat. 

 

*waits for movement from bobber, places rod in holder and cracks a beer*

(OOC)

This is why I'm almost always in favor of settling things with white peace or just an admission of defeat.  Terms usually lead to standoffs where the terms themselves aren't really significant or a major issue, but neither side wants to back down because they'd lose face.  It extends wars well past the point where it is fun for most people and ends up driving players from the game who get sick of it.  As someone who has been on both sides, it is tedious for both sides.  For the first year or two of this game white peace/admissions of defeat were generally the norm, we should go back to that.  Shorter, more frequent wars are a lot more fun and interesting.

(/OOC)

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4 hours ago, Azaghul said:

(OOC)

This is why I'm almost always in favor of settling things with white peace or just an admission of defeat.  Terms usually lead to standoffs where the terms themselves aren't really significant or a major issue, but neither side wants to back down because they'd lose face.  It extends wars well past the point where it is fun for most people and ends up driving players from the game who get sick of it.  As someone who has been on both sides, it is tedious for both sides.  For the first year or two of this game white peace/admissions of defeat were generally the norm, we should go back to that.  Shorter, more frequent wars are a lot more fun and interesting.

(/OOC)

What's more interesting is more drama and chaos to fuel it. You don't get any of that with bone-headed brats who refuse to admit they lost at checkers.

Everybody tiptoes around afraid to lose at checkers. I'm preparing to intentionally lose at checkers just so I can do it in an interesting way. 

Stop being afraid to lose, to accept losing, stop literally sawing your own arm off just to lose s little less of your pride and feelings right now instead of sucking it up and playing actual politics by planning and striking revenge at your leisure. 

Stop protecting everything that breathes and speaks enough English to ask. Stop forming these groups that require most of the game to effectively break down. 

Everyone is at fault, everyone claims to be virtuous but you're all sinners and posers. Even myself, until a day comes I have the ability to really prove otherwise. 

Get a head start on me and prove yourselves sooner not later.

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Kadin would have surrendered by now. 

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"bone-headed" "stupid"

 

From a channel somewhere, unnamed, from a person also unnamed. It's more fun because the code bugged out.

	why do you even care										I don't understand why any of you care about these shit games																I feel like you need to be somewhere on the autism spectrum to play these nation simulators																					oh no this guy said something mean to someone with a fake government rank about me																				let's get revenge																I have no life and can be on here 24/7 so I deserve to have a status of importance
Edited by A Boy Named Crow

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12 minutes ago, The Mad Titan said:

Ah yes, like the white peace/just admission of defeat TGH/KT got. 

So edgy. Glad we beat you so bad the salt is still there.

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7 minutes ago, Keegoz said:

So edgy. Glad we beat you so bad the salt is still there.

I was actually referring to TKR and you guys...

You should purge those inactives though you’re looking a little fat. 

Edited by The Mad Titan
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@PrefontaineIt's been well known that Adrienne had long-since ceased giving a shit about peace months ago, so i'm honestly not surprised TKR would be the on holding things back. 

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1 minute ago, Akuryo said:

@PrefontaineIt's been well known that Adrienne had long-since ceased giving a shit about peace months ago, so i'm honestly not surprised TKR would be the on holding things back. 

Well pretty soon they’ll be the only one in their coalition in the top 50. Such great allies. 

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14 hours ago, Azaghul said:

(OOC)

This is why I'm almost always in favor of settling things with white peace or just an admission of defeat.  Terms usually lead to standoffs where the terms themselves aren't really significant or a major issue, but neither side wants to back down because they'd lose face.  It extends wars well past the point where it is fun for most people and ends up driving players from the game who get sick of it.  As someone who has been on both sides, it is tedious for both sides.  For the first year or two of this game white peace/admissions of defeat were generally the norm, we should go back to that.  Shorter, more frequent wars are a lot more fun and interesting.

(/OOC)

 

Saving this for the next time TKR demands or is in a coalition that demands anything other than white peace/surrender.

Edited by Shadowthrone
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At some point, though, they'll run out of money. TKR takes 250mn of damage daily, Grumpy 50 million, Guardian 150mn, and TCW 50mn. That's 500mn of damage daily to core alliances, or that every 30 days, 15 bn is destroyed. The total rebuilding cost for 5000 cities to 2k infra is 100 bn.  To 1.5k infra is 30 bn.

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1 minute ago, A Boy Named Crow said:

At some point, though, they'll run out of money. TKR takes 250mn of damage daily, Grumpy 50 million, Guardian 150mn, and TCW 50mn. That's 500mn of damage daily to core alliances, or that every 30 days, 15 bn is destroyed. The total rebuilding cost for 5000 cities to 2k infra is 100 bn.  To 1.5k infra is 30 bn.

Not if the NPO and BK run out of money first ;) 

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1 hour ago, The Mad Titan said:

I was actually referring to TKR and you guys...

You should purge those inactives though you’re looking a little fat. 

My bad thought you were referencing ac and the NAP.

They serve their purpose 😀

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Your Ellie appears to have misread the signs. Please report to Yui for further direction.

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Before you guys start throwing blame around, maybe you should ask the question if they’re ok with the situation they are in.

While they may look broken, this game is built to where you can build just enough and still be effective in fighting on the cheap.

The days of pinning nations down is long gone.

1 hour ago, A Boy Named Crow said:

At some point, though, they'll run out of money. TKR takes 250mn of damage daily, Grumpy 50 million, Guardian 150mn, and TCW 50mn. That's 500mn of damage daily to core alliances, or that every 30 days, 15 bn is destroyed. The total rebuilding cost for 5000 cities to 2k infra is 100 bn.  To 1.5k infra is 30 bn.

You have to keep in mind that most of those alliances have sat on their hands for over a year without any major conflict.

They can afford this.

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2 hours ago, Shadowthrone said:

 

Saving this for the next time TKR demands or is in a coalition that demands anything other than white peace/surrender.

(OOC)

Please do.

I've consistently pushed this view within TKR and while I am only one non-FA voice on the matter, I know there are others that share my view on it.  As far as I know, TKR usually, if not always, doesn't ask for any terms when the coalition it is in is putting together a list of terms to give to the other side.   More often, we've stood by allies who wanted to demand terms, rather than fracture the coalition with a separate peace or burn lots of political capital trying to get them to drop their demands.  But that is not the same as being one of the parties within a winning coalition pushing to impose terms.

There's a reason I labeled this OOC.   This isn't meant to be partisan or a dig at IQ, but something I would say to all players of the game about future wars.  I've had the exact same thoughts about previous wars where TKR was on the other side.

It's actually not even really about this war because the genie is already out of the bottle.  The winning side has asked for terms and that can't be rescinded as if they were never asked.  It's already at that point where the terms themselves aren't really what people care about, but pride and saving face.  My point is that from a OOC perspective these kind of standsoffs aren't fun for most people involved and are bad for the game.  In an ideal world, we'd avoid them entirely because we would go back to the norm of winning coalitions not asking for anything except maybe an admission of defeat.

(/OOC)

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3 hours ago, The Mad Titan said:

I was actually referring to TKR and you guys...

You should purge those inactives though you’re looking a little fat. 

Not as fat as your and IQ's ego now that you've managed to win a dog-pile with the help of skilled, capable fighters(Sydni, TEst, CoS).

 

1491756811336 

Edited by Justin076
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5 hours ago, Prefontaine said:

 

You can blame TKR-side leadership for a lot of the slow down. There's been a plethora of times where there has been no activity in the peace talks channel for weeks at a time. They've also accepted terms, and then gone back and said no they don't accept those terms without anything changing from there. It's been made clear several times that the terms are not going to be removed, and the things which have held up talks the most are effing ridiculous. Protecting the "honor" of VM-ers because you're such a delicate pile of garbage that you don't like them being labeled as "war dodgers" and want to protect their VM-protected infra while sacrificing rebuild time/resources of hundreds. Wanting to keep your trade bot active and still requiring art for to return trades because of "tradition" is a bad joke. If TKR was not in these peace talks I'm confident the war would have ended at least a month ago, if not 2.

 

The fault for all of this rests on Adrienne. You're largely inactive in peace talks. Days and weeks go by without you making further effort. You cling to trying to protect your trash while doing disservice to the rest of the members. You're alliance has never really lost before, and are apparently incompetent as to how it works. As someone who has played these shit games for way too long, there are no harsh terms in the original surrender. Honestly the GoB one was the harshest of them, but even the child like reasoning skills of SRD were able to find a solution working with Ripper. But not Adrienne, you god damn dumpster fire of a leader. Step down. Give someone else the charge, you have 97 other members one of them is bound to have a brain because you sure as shit do not. 

 

To Justin's point you can assign blame to either side, and while I might be biased some there lies a major issue. This is IQ's first time winning, really. Lets say they flinch and give in to white peace after making such a point about terms, it shows anyone can just stick it out if they really don't want the terms. You  can claim the same is TKR's side can be shown to give in to terms, but that's a part of losing. There was a hiccup in the TEst-Guardian term where we wanted them to write a couple paragraphs about something deity-flavored, they decided they didn't want to do the cosmetic/joke sort of term so we offered them 5B to get out of it or they could present a counter option in flavor with what was originally there. They simply chose to go with the original term. But that shows how quickly some of the speed bumps and stops can be resolved. Honestly it could have been done in a day or twos time should leadership been more active about it. 

 

tl;dr Yes it's stupid things have gone on this long. The fault largely rests with TKR. I hope their allies leave them to burn in the trash heap they've left them to burn in for extra months. 

You also forgot that time where everyone agreed to a scheduled peace talk meeting and TKR decided to ghost 😇

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4 hours ago, The Mad Titan said:

You should purge those inactives though you’re looking a little fat. 

Come get em.

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4 hours ago, Keegoz said:

My bad thought you were referencing ac and the NAP.

They serve their purpose 😀

I see those brownies finally kicked in

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3 hours ago, Azaghul said:

(OOC)

Please do.

I've consistently pushed this view within TKR and while I am only one non-FA voice on the matter, I know there are others that share my view on it.  As far as I know, TKR usually, if not always, doesn't ask for any terms when the coalition it is in is putting together a list of terms to give to the other side.   More often, we've stood by allies who wanted to demand terms, rather than fracture the coalition with a separate peace or burn lots of political capital trying to get them to drop their demands.  But that is not the same as being one of the parties within a winning coalition pushing to impose terms.

There's a reason I labeled this OOC.   This isn't meant to be partisan or a dig at IQ, but something I would say to all players of the game about future wars.  I've had the exact same thoughts about previous wars where TKR was on the other side.

It's actually not even really about this war because the genie is already out of the bottle.  The winning side has asked for terms and that can't be rescinded as if they were never asked.  It's already at that point where the terms themselves aren't really what people care about, but pride and saving face.  My point is that from a OOC perspective these kind of standsoffs aren't fun for most people involved and are bad for the game.  In an ideal world, we'd avoid them entirely because we would go back to the norm of winning coalitions not asking for anything except maybe an admission of defeat.

(/OOC)

Pride is worthless and so is honor. Take all your whiny garbage about that utter bullshit and shove it. 

Honor especially just turns a competent leader into an asshat in seconds. Time for you to catch up on what the rest of the game learned long ago.

Drama is good and so are the salted wounds screaming for revenge. Even your pathetic honor can't hold out on that forever. It will succumb, every sinner has a past, be it more sin or sainthood.

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6 hours ago, A Boy Named Crow said:

At some point, though, they'll run out of money. TKR takes 250mn of damage daily, Grumpy 50 million, Guardian 150mn, and TCW 50mn. That's 500mn of damage daily to core alliances, or that every 30 days, 15 bn is destroyed. The total rebuilding cost for 5000 cities to 2k infra is 100 bn.  To 1.5k infra is 30 bn.

Judging by the fact most of TKR and allies are beiged at once from what I've seen. You give them like 6-10 days of sitting in beige. That's like 5-9 million dollars if you take into account the daily bonus, plus whatever revenue they make. I'm sure they can rebuild back up to 900 or so. 

I'm not saying that this covers their damage. But it reduces it by a decent margin. 

 

Also, who cares if they run out of money, they're taking this path. Let them burn their cash. You should be happy with continuing to increase your stats, even if it's not by much.

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1 minute ago, Zyphy said:

Judging by the fact most of TKR and allies are beiged at once from what I've seen. You give them like 6-10 days of sitting in beige. That's like 5-9 million dollars if you take into account the daily bonus, plus whatever revenue they make. I'm sure they can rebuild back up to 900 or so. 

I'm not saying that this covers their damage. But it reduces it by a decent margin. 

 

Also, who cares if they run out of money, they're taking this path. Let them burn their cash. You should be happy with continuing to increase your stats, even if it's not by much.

Alot of them have and make no money, actually, on account of 150 or less average infra for weeks.

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