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Global War Peace Terms - Discussion

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6 hours ago, Akuryo said:

The complaint about the Arrgh one is TKRs protectors. Even though I’ve personally known from day one that this was expected and that it would be changed if asked because it’s perfectly damned reasonable.

They haven't gotten to that one yet.

6 hours ago, Keegoz said:

Not entirely sure why you'd want a treaty with GoB at this point. So I'd just void the article by saying no treaties exist.

Does the trading bot matter that much at this point?

I mean you can still counter arrgh...

The consensus is its an attempt to control the FA direction of Grumpy. People from TKR and other alliances aren't happy with Article VI and VIII so until we as a unified front are in agreement the terms cannot be accepted, talks are still on-going so maybe something may result from them soon. But until then the war continues. I'd hope we can at least get to $1 trillion in total damages before the war ends though.

8 hours ago, ComradeMilton said:

#14 and falling.

 You clearly have no concept of what influence is and isn't.

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1 hour ago, Sphinx said:

They haven't gotten to that one yet.

The consensus is its an attempt to control the FA direction of Grumpy. People from TKR and other alliances aren't happy with Article VI and VIII so until we as a unified front are in agreement the terms cannot be accepted, talks are still on-going so maybe something may result from them soon. But until then the war continues. I'd hope we can at least get to $1 trillion in total damages before the war ends though.

 You clearly have no concept of what influence is and isn't.

What FA direction. Aren't they supposedly paperless? Seems like an easy answer to me if so. SRD's a charming old bloke i'm sure he can woo some new friends.

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Paperless doesn't exist, except that there's a lot less "legal" ties forcing an alliance to defend its allies. But then again, as TFP shows, an alliance, even when treatied, could ignore or be asked to ignore a MDP pact.

 

In practice, all paperless have relationships, some of which are de facto secret treaties. The paperless commitment basically adds ambiguity, as none of their de facto allies are officially obliged to protect them, and to the casual observer it's unknown who their de facto allies are. It also increases their ability to attack other alliances, as since every war they attack in is a bandwagon, it becomes less of a bandwagon when they engage.

 

I see the GoB treaty term as hypocritical, but enforceable and reasonable. The paperless alliances are basically asking Grumpy to cease being considered a paperless alliance, in effect kicking them out from paperless.

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2 hours ago, Sphinx said:

The consensus is its an attempt to control the FA direction of Grumpy. People from TKR and other alliances aren't happy with Article VI and VIII so until we as a unified front are in agreement the terms cannot be accepted, talks are still on-going so maybe something may result from them soon. But until then the war continues. I'd hope we can at least get to $1 trillion in total damages before the war ends though.

It doesn't control their direction, it controls the means in which they do it. If their FA direction depends on hiding their treaties then I suggest you oust them now.

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6 minutes ago, Inst said:

Paperless doesn't exist, except that there's a lot less "legal" ties forcing an alliance to defend its allies. But then again, as TFP shows, an alliance, even when treatied, could ignore or be asked to ignore a MDP pact.

 

In practice, all paperless have relationships, some of which are de facto secret treaties. The paperless commitment basically adds ambiguity, as none of their de facto allies are officially obliged to protect them, and to the casual observer it's unknown who their de facto allies are. It also increases their ability to attack other alliances, as since every war they attack in is a bandwagon, it becomes less of a bandwagon when they engage.

 

I see the GoB treaty term as hypocritical, but enforceable and reasonable. The paperless alliances are basically asking Grumpy to cease being considered a paperless alliance, in effect kicking them out from paperless.

Paperless absolutely exists, not sure what you're talking about.

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23 minutes ago, Inst said:

Paperless doesn't exist, except that there's a lot less "legal" ties forcing an alliance to defend its allies. But then again, as TFP shows, an alliance, even when treatied, could ignore or be asked to ignore a MDP pact.

 

In practice, all paperless have relationships, some of which are de facto secret treaties. The paperless commitment basically adds ambiguity, as none of their de facto allies are officially obliged to protect them, and to the casual observer it's unknown who their de facto allies are. It also increases their ability to attack other alliances, as since every war they attack in is a bandwagon, it becomes less of a bandwagon when they engage.

 

I see the GoB treaty term as hypocritical, but enforceable and reasonable. The paperless alliances are basically asking Grumpy to cease being considered a paperless alliance, in effect kicking them out from paperless.

Paperless does exist. GoB is a form of fake-paperless, the kind with secret treaties.

TEst is actual paperless. Yes, they're friendly with t$. However, under Pre's leadership and probably still even now, they'd be friendly towards Guardian as well, who they happen to have blitzed. Paperless alliances are friends with you but not your ally. Everyone in TEst and CoS including leadership likes Guardian, and that fact only made them more happy to be the ones hitting them. 

A wise man once said, just because they're your friend, doesn't mean you can't fight them.
I'd count SK as actual paperless too. Sure, they're not quite like TEst or CoS, their situation came about from their allies disintegrating, and i'm sure they have people they're friendly with. They're not allied to anyone though, nobody is obligated to help them nor they help anyone.

The same cannot be said of GoB. So what's really being asked, is for GoB to just be honest and blatant about its treaty situation, to either admit and showcase its treaties or to admit having none saying it is ACTUALLY paperless and then act as if it is so.

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3 hours ago, Sphinx said:

 You clearly have no concept of what influence is and isn't.

Loss in number of members, loss in score, people ignoring their demands and communications is hardly the same level of power as antebellum.

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The only influence that matters is baseball influence!

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5 hours ago, Sphinx said:

 You clearly have no concept of what influence is and isn't.

While you are correct that rank doesn't matter that much, alot of TKRs influence did in fact come from being #1 and the overall power of the sphere they have. Where in fact this war has has been crippling their influence, with due respect to tcw, they have basically been neutered, and that being TKRs main ally hurts TKR's "influence". Lets not even mention Tesla as im sure that must be a sore subject. Piled on with a 47 member loss totaling 500 cities, with the potential for another 400-500 cities (worse case, if all current inactive quit) post war they really wont be taken as seriously as they have been in the past. 

If you want evidence of this, just look at the peace talks, TKR and Co are not being allowed to wiggle out of any of the terms fully. Their political capa is spent, gone, vanished and no ones allowing them to go into debt. Dont take that as me saying they cant work their way back up, I know they can and I bet they will (if they put in the effort) however I dont think the actual influence they hold will ever be the same as it was before this war. Lastly sure yalls core remains strong, but it does not take much to fracture especially if this war is dragged out for a lot longer.

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6 minutes ago, Pestilence said:

While you are correct that rank doesn't matter that much, alot of TKRs influence did in fact come from being #1 and the overall power of the sphere they have. Where in fact this war has has been crippling their influence, with due respect to tcw, they have basically been neutered, and that being TKRs main ally hurts TKR's "influence". Lets not even mention Tesla as im sure that must be a sore subject. Piled on with a 47 member loss totaling 500 cities, with the potential for another 400-500 cities (worse case, if all current inactive quit) post war they really wont be taken as seriously as they have been in the past. 

If you want evidence of this, just look at the peace talks, TKR and Co are not being allowed to wiggle out of any of the terms fully. Their political capa is spent, gone, vanished and no ones allowing them to go into debt. Dont take that as me saying they cant work their way back up, I know they can and I bet they will (if they put in the effort) however I dont think the actual influence they hold will ever be the same as it was before this war. Lastly sure yalls core remains strong, but it does not take much to fracture especially if this war is dragged out for a lot longer.

I thought Tesla only have like 20 members in the beginning...

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37 minutes ago, TheRebelMan said:

Ye. Ik that. 

I like how they arent slotted. 

Where tf are your low tier allies ffs. 

Tesla are also almost entirely 18-22 city nations, so yes, that's about ~400 cities just gone. 

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2 hours ago, TheRebelMan said:

Ye. Ik that. 

I like how they arent slotted. 

Where tf are your low tier allies ffs. 

They're so broke they aren't really worth raiding, especially when juicer targets like TFP are open.

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As a Horseman (home of the dishonorable slot thieves) I would just like to express my complete appreciation for being allowed to sometimes fight in this war.

Sorry about those couple of times we beiged those people we weren't supposed to but without us occasionally pre-beiging an opponent, we would have to wait until Friday (instead of Thursday) to reach 1 trillion in total damages.

It's like my dearly departed Dad used to say: "Son, sometimes you gotta beige a Bastard before they rip you limb from limb and your Mother is a whore."

That may have been my cousin that said that but irregardless, the advice is sound.

As for peace, well i'm sure it will happen at some point and when it does i look forward to being blindsided by a vengeful blitz within 3 to 6 months.

 

Edited by Mikalus II
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2 hours ago, Mikalus II said:

As a Horseman (home of the dishonorable slot thieves) I would just like to express my complete appreciation for being allowed to sometimes fight in this war.

Sorry about those couple of times we beiged those people we weren't supposed to but without us occasionally pre-beiging an opponent, we would have to wait until Friday (instead of Thursday) to reach 1 trillion in total damages.

It's like my dearly departed Dad used to say: "Son, sometimes you gotta beige a Bastard before they rip you limb from limb and your Mother is a whore."

That may have been my cousin that said that but irregardless, the advice is sound.

As for peace, well i'm sure it will happen at some point and when it does i look forward to being blindsided by a vengeful blitz within 3 to 6 months.

 

3 - 6 months? That is what I call being optimistic.

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On 1/11/2019 at 2:47 PM, TheRebelMan said:

Ye. Ik that. 

I like how they arent slotted. 

Where tf are your low tier allies ffs. 

Tesla is completely broke, the well ran dry long ago...

Edited by Princess Seshat

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Still the single most alliance bank I've looted I think, even though I started only after that well was like 3/4th dry :( 

 

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Wait, did Polaris really get 13bn looted off by Arrgh? What the hell was that?

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11 hours ago, Inst said:

Wait, did Polaris really get 13bn looted off by Arrgh? What the hell was that?

If I'm not mistaken that's standard Polaris procedure.

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