Edward I Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Memph said: I do think one important distinction between the wars you're referencing, and this one, is that in those wars, the loser was the aggressor, and wanted pre-mature peace before our side had a chance to take out their whales through submarine warfare (this was at a time when our side was outnumbered about 3:1 in the upper tier). In the wars that did not end in white peace, the additional terms were essentially in exchange for sparing their whales' infra and tanks. I'm not sure which wars you're referring to, since as far as I know you've always been in Guardian, and this is the first war in years where Guardian hasn't fought in a coalition with overwhelming upper tier superiority. If the only terms you're talking about are reparations, then you're right. The Great VE and Silent Wars were lost by the aggressors, and are the only instances I'm aware of in which anyone received monetary reparations. But peace terms in general have definitely not been restricted to losing, aggressive coalitions. And, in the sense that these terms are designed to address things that can't or aren't being addressed purely by war - terms to deal with VM usage, secret treaties, etc. - they actually represent a continuity, not a break, with the past terms you brought up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegoz Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 25 minutes ago, Edward I said: I'm not sure which wars you're referring to, since as far as I know you've always been in Guardian, and this is the first war in years where Guardian hasn't fought in a coalition with overwhelming upper tier superiority. If the only terms you're talking about are reparations, then you're right. The Great VE and Silent Wars were lost by the aggressors, and are the only instances I'm aware of in which anyone received monetary reparations. But peace terms in general have definitely not been restricted to losing, aggressive coalitions. And, in the sense that these terms are designed to address things that can't or aren't being addressed purely by war - terms to deal with VM usage, secret treaties, etc. - they actually represent a continuity, not a break, with the past terms you brought up. I mean, their own allies attempted it in the last war lol. Just because we managed to get out of it doesn't mean they didn't try to impose terms as an aggressive coalition upon us. They certainly weren't dropped out of compassion or empathy towards not enforcing terms on a side on the defensive side of a war. 1 Quote [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: But Keegoz is actually bad. [11:52 PM] Prefontaine: He's my favorite bad leader though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowthrone Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Keegoz said: I mean, their own allies attempted it in the last war lol. Just because we managed to get out of it doesn't mean they didn't try to impose terms as an aggressive coalition upon us. They certainly weren't dropped out of compassion or empathy towards not enforcing terms on a side on the defensive side of a war. Definitely such magnanimous victors! Joke term and admission of defeat. Definitely not the TKR and friends standards whatsoever. They’d have gotten away with it too if it wasn’t for the dreaded sheep and his crew! I mean it’s just funny TKR folk are giving us a lecture on acceptable terms when for the past three years or more, they’ve supported and written and enforced similar terms on a consistent basis. But do go on, it’s fun to watch your continued lectures. Edited January 29, 2019 by Shadowthrone 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dane Hunter Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, Edward I said: I'm not sure which wars you're referring to, since as far as I know you've always been in Guardian, and this is the first war in years where Guardian hasn't fought in a coalition with overwhelming upper tier superiority. Didn't their coalition have upper tier superiority when Knightfall started? Edited January 29, 2019 by Dane Hunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 13 minutes ago, Dane Hunter said: Didn't their coalition have upper tier superiority when Knightfall started? Roughly equal in upper tier, they were superior in whale tier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastor Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 He's talking about when they fought Rose/Paragon, and Rose and friends had like 10-15 nations with a 3-4 city advantage on Syndisphere's biggest guy so that's what he's referring to. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memph Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 2 hours ago, Kastor said: He's talking about when they fought Rose/Paragon, and Rose and friends had like 10-15 nations with a 3-4 city advantage on Syndisphere's biggest guy so that's what he's referring to. We were outnumbered around 120-60 in the upper tier and 40-10 in the whale tier by ParaCovenant during those wars (Proxy War, Oktoberfest, 168 Day War, NPO's First Time) and were still outnumbered in the upper tier during Silent War although not quite as much. ParaCovenant lost their upper tier advantage because Rose joined our sphere, most of VE's upper tier left to form Grumpy and were joined by several of UPN's upper tier, others joined Pantheon and GPA where they got rolled, and others fell behind because they had to rebuild their alliances' mid tier, took heavy damages themselves, or didn't manage their growth properly, and some quit the game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapnZaq Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 It's been a hundred days. This is the largest, most costly, longest war anyone has seen in PnW. Why has peace not been achieved yet? I'm not asking for six month peace treaty. I don't understand why this war is continuing. Have I missed an important detail? Is TKR just that stubborn and won't accept they've been blasted out of the water? Some of the proposed articles are a little rough, yet that can't be the only reason Knightfall continues. Let me farm my pixels without worrying about another nuke blowing me up. Here's a picture of my dog so no one can say mean things to me. What evil fiend talks crap when there's a dog? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Who are you, Tulles? How long have you been around in the game? Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 TKR is just stubborn. So stubborn they'll happily kill their ally over it. TCW is on track to reach 70% member loss, by admission of TCW itself. That's not fat trimming, that's hacking off limbs. They're staying in the war for you, partly because if they left separately they may lose their allies, and they'd die from that. Ironically at this rate staying by your side is what will end them. This whole fat trimming thing is a really old and shitty face saving measure. Inst a few days ago said TKR was at 40% loss. Counting your red and purple inactives out, it's actually more like 50%. Those are some serious wounds, and 70% is a look at ones mortality. Honestly the fact they have allies at all after this is ridiculous. You're just dragging the corpse around and becoming one yourself. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatorcock Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 26 minutes ago, Buorhann said: Who are you, Tulles? How long have you been around in the game? What a bully. 4 minutes ago, Akuryo said: TKR is just stubborn. So stubborn they'll happily kill their ally over it. TCW is on track to reach 70% member loss, by admission of TCW itself. That's not fat trimming, that's hacking off limbs. They're staying in the war for you, partly because if they left separately they may lose their allies, and they'd die from that. Ironically at this rate staying by your side is what will end them. This whole fat trimming thing is a really old and shitty face saving measure. Inst a few days ago said TKR was at 40% loss. Counting your red and purple inactives out, it's actually more like 50%. Those are some serious wounds, and 70% is a look at ones mortality. Honestly the fact they have allies at all after this is ridiculous. You're just dragging the corpse around and becoming one yourself. I don't see why any of us should complain about an alliance choice to let themselves die. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Zyphy said: What a bully. I don't see why any of us should complain about an alliance choice to let themselves die. For a variety of reasons that shouldn't be hard to see, but I overestimate people here all the time so I'm not surprised. Surely major, active alliances committing suicide and hemmoraghing active players is not a bad thing at all, no siree Bob. Well, once active, the suicide has made them fall off the face of the Earth. Oh and of course when their suicide is done such a way as to screw over the entire game by freezing it around their asisine act of self destruction, that too sounds bad. Some people also care about shitting on Takes would-be Noble attitude with their own hypocrisy, or anybody's attitude for that matter. You wanna commit suicide with your alliance do it quietly and internally like every trash micro. Don't freeze the whole game over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatorcock Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Akuryo said: For a variety of reasons that shouldn't be hard to see, but I overestimate people here all the time so I'm not surprised. Surely major, active alliances committing suicide and hemmoraghing active players is not a bad thing at all, no siree Bob. Well, once active, the suicide has made them fall off the face of the Earth. Oh and of course when their suicide is done such a way as to screw over the entire game by freezing it around their asisine act of self destruction, that too sounds bad. Some people also care about shitting on Takes would-be Noble attitude with their own hypocrisy, or anybody's attitude for that matter. You wanna commit suicide with your alliance do it quietly and internally like every trash micro. Don't freeze the whole game over it. That's iconic. Your side can take white peace and end it. But you're also not putting that as an option. Put your ego aside and also note that both parties are equally contributing to the horrible meta atm. Don't bully micros, they're always competent ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memph Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 2 hours ago, Akuryo said: TKR is just stubborn. So stubborn they'll happily kill their ally over it. TCW is on track to reach 70% member loss, by admission of TCW itself. That's not fat trimming, that's hacking off limbs. They're staying in the war for you, partly because if they left separately they may lose their allies, and they'd die from that. Ironically at this rate staying by your side is what will end them. This whole fat trimming thing is a really old and shitty face saving measure. Inst a few days ago said TKR was at 40% loss. Counting your red and purple inactives out, it's actually more like 50%. Those are some serious wounds, and 70% is a look at ones mortality. Honestly the fact they have allies at all after this is ridiculous. You're just dragging the corpse around and becoming one yourself. The amount of damage I'm doing has only been increasing in the last couple months as I'm fine tuning my strategies, and Guardian's activity has also gone up in the last couple weeks. At this point my weekly net damages are about 5x what my weekly income was before the war. I'm curious to know why you devote so much time to arguing why TKR should surrender. You seem really pressed about the fact that they haven't. 2 hours ago, Akuryo said: For a variety of reasons that shouldn't be hard to see, but I overestimate people here all the time so I'm not surprised. Surely major, active alliances committing suicide and hemmoraghing active players is not a bad thing at all, no siree Bob. Well, once active, the suicide has made them fall off the face of the Earth. Oh and of course when their suicide is done such a way as to screw over the entire game by freezing it around their asisine act of self destruction, that too sounds bad. Some people also care about shitting on Takes would-be Noble attitude with their own hypocrisy, or anybody's attitude for that matter. You wanna commit suicide with your alliance do it quietly and internally like every trash micro. Don't freeze the whole game over it. Are you saying that IQ are frustrated at the fact that we haven't surrendered but just don't want to admit it for fear of looking soft? I just don't understand what you're getting at. Alliances not involved in the war can feel free to go on about their business. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 2 hours ago, Akuryo said: You wanna commit suicide with your alliance do it quietly and internally like every trash micro. Don't freeze the whole game over it. No one is freezing the game from this war. Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Buorhann said: No one is freezing the game from this war. Yes when most of the active game is at war for 100 days everything proceeds as normal as if no war were there. Except that it doesn't. Also how the hell is a 13k infrastructure TCW nation the second highest net income wtf XD Edited January 30, 2019 by Akuryo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lu Xun Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Spheres unaffected: TGH-KT bloc, VG-bloc. Arrgh can be said to be partially unaffected because they're in permanent war. So the longer this war goes on, the more TGH-KT will be in expansion mode, and VG to a lesser extent given VG's smaller size. Quote . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
丂ħ̧i̧₣ɫ̵γ͘ ̶™ Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 You know this thread has gone on long enough that people are flexing over victories won years ago and you've got even obscure players coming out of the woodwork to comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mad Titan Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 5 minutes ago, ?ϟħ̧i̧₣ɫ̵γ͘ ̶™? said: You know this thread has gone on long enough that people are flexing over victories won years ago and you've got even obscure players coming out of the woodwork to comment. But did you know @TheNG made Arrgh surrender? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Memph said: The amount of damage I'm doing has only been increasing in the last couple months as I'm fine tuning my strategies, and Guardian's activity has also gone up in the last couple weeks. At this point my weekly net damages are about 5x what my weekly income was before the war. I'm curious to know why you devote so much time to arguing why TKR should surrender. You seem really pressed about the fact that they haven't. Are you saying that IQ are frustrated at the fact that we haven't surrendered but just don't want to admit it for fear of looking soft? I just don't understand what you're getting at. Alliances not involved in the war can feel free to go on about their business. Yes I'll just go ahead and gather the rest of my membership and the investors I have planned and their money too of course and all the noobs I don't have that's down either to bad luck or being small and recruiting during a war. I'll also keep planning my various schemes despite the fact that after any war, especially this severe things typically start shifting around alot. Good to hear, so that makes... Everything I've got useless, basically? Cool I'll go about doing my business then since it's all literally impossible. I mean, surely you could imagine why anyone might be a tad upset at this point, especially when they already dislike your brand of prideful moron anyway, I daresay it's rather obvious why they are 'pressed' about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Memph Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, Akuryo said: Yes I'll just go ahead and gather the rest of my membership and the investors I have planned and their money too of course and all the noobs I don't have that's down either to bad luck or being small and recruiting during a war. I'll also keep planning my various schemes despite the fact that after any war, especially this severe things typically start shifting around alot. Good to hear, so that makes... Everything I've got useless, basically? Cool I'll go about doing my business then since it's all literally impossible. I mean, surely you could imagine why anyone might be a tad upset at this point, especially when they already dislike your brand of prideful moron anyway, I daresay it's rather obvious why they are 'pressed' about it. Sorry to hear that. Too bad you guys are too proud to change your surrender terms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevanovia Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Memph said: Sorry to hear that. Too bad you guys are too proud to change your surrender terms. Akuryo is not involved in the war, much less IQ/t$ Coalition Leadership Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, Kevanovia said: Akuryo is not involved in the war, much less IQ/t$ Coalition Leadership Nope, I'm just an angry jackass. 2 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
丂ħ̧i̧₣ɫ̵γ͘ ̶™ Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Kevanovia said: Akuryo is not involved in the war, much less IQ/t$ Coalition Leadership Not unless Memph decides to 767 into Akuryo. Edited January 30, 2019 by ?ϟħ̧i̧₣ɫ̵γ͘ ̶™? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buorhann Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 2 hours ago, Akuryo said: I mean, surely you could imagine why anyone might be a tad upset at this point, especially when they already dislike your brand of prideful moron anyway, I daresay it's rather obvious why they are 'pressed' about it. I'm actually curious as to why people are upset about it. For one, IQ/Syndi want this war to continue. So does TKR/Guardian. Second, who else plans on doing anything during this time anyways? If you want to do something, then do it. This isn't going to stop you, nor should it. 5 Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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