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Let Absolute Chaos Reign


Buorhann
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Remove War Slot limitations

Remove Nation Score limitations

Remove Improvement Slot limitations (IE: Remove the 5 Barracks per city limitation)

Only apply beige to Defenders

Apply a percentage of loot/infra damage penalty depending on how much bigger/smaller you are to your opponent.  If a larger nation declares on a much smaller nation, for example, have it where the loot/infra damage gained is nullified by 50% naturally.  The percentage will flunctuate through an algorithm, anywhere from 0% to 75% nullified I'd think. This still would allow larger/smaller nations to be fully capable of assisting in wars when it comes to inflicting damage on an opponents military.

 

Pure chaos.

 

This is a half-hearted suggestion, but if you think about it - it works on multiple levels.

More military = more upkeep necessary. 

No war slot limitations will have players weigh the options of extending or not. 

No nation score limitation will give purpose to growing high or not. 

No Improvement Slot limitations will give players an opportunity to focus their production, while also juggling pollution/crime through it (Those who go full slot RAWs would still be hindered by massive Pollution and/or Crime from it.  You may need to adjust the penalties on Pollution/Crime as well to counteract this, make Police Stations/Hospitals more valuable). 

Only beige to defenders will allow them a peace period whenever a much more difficult opponent beiges them from an opportunistic declaration.  So while you may benefit as a larger nation wrecking several nations, you won't benefit if you eventually get zeroed out and defeated by the defenders - therefore making you weigh the options of picking a fight you could possibly lose more than what you gain.

In general, this gives more free will decision making to the player on how they want to operate in the game, and gives all alliances more flexibility.

Edited by Buorhann
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10 hours ago, Soxirella said:

I don't mind this, but as long as current game mechanics remain, micros can never gain over whales... assuming other whales come to the rescue. The latter would always have more troop count.

It's called diplomacy.

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26 minutes ago, Buorhann said:

It's called diplomacy.

True! Whatever you may call it though, it still doesn't change the fact that this idea may most likely not work as intended. In addition, not everyone likes chaos and most prefer some order, and thus this idea may be worse for the game.

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meh, it was only half serious, though it does have one point i could truely get behind, and that is that attacking nations that lose should not go biege, they attacked and failed they don't deserve a shield because that was either their intention or they are just a terrible strategist and picked the wrong person to Fu With.


it also gave me another great idea that will never be implemented into the game, and that is a change to the way war slots work; Make it to where there is no longer defensive war slots and instead you can only declare war on someone if the combined score of all their aggressors is under 2 times their score.

for example:

The Defender's score is 1000, so 1 person with 2000 score can attack, 2 with 1000, 4 with 500, and 20 with 100.
if your score added to the current aggresors would place it above his war score cap then you cant attack.

Edited by ukunaka
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That won't work either. You are only going to dissuade micros from making an attempt to take down a whale.

 

Also, in your last suggestion, technically a player with 300,000 troops can attack five (offensive limit) with just 3,000 troops. There are some games where this sort of an aggression is OK, not sure whether Alex would be Ok on this.

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2 hours ago, Soxirella said:

True! Whatever you may call it though, it still doesn't change the fact that this idea may most likely not work as intended.

It won't because players expect hand-outs from the Admin to control things that the players are too lazy to do themselves.

1 hour ago, Soxirella said:

That won't work either. You are only going to dissuade micros from making an attempt to take down a whale.

 

Also, in your last suggestion, technically a player with 300,000 troops can attack five (offensive limit) with just 3,000 troops. There are some games where this sort of an aggression is OK, not sure whether Alex would be Ok on this.

And several nations can take their Planes, regardless of the number they have, and suicide strike that player down then work on zeroing him out.

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1 hour ago, Soxirella said:

Also, in your last suggestion, technically a player with 300,000 troops can attack five (offensive limit) with just 3,000 troops. There are some games where this sort of an aggression is OK, not sure whether Alex would be Ok on this.

300k to 3000? most with less than 5k soldiers aren't even 150 score how could a 300k soldier count nation attack them if their war score cap would be 300

Edited by ukunaka
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Guest Curufinwe

So allowing 6k score people to declare on an unlimited number 50 score noobs? With unlimited war improvements?

What could possibly go wrong?

Removing beige for attackers is an okay idea (although reducing beige times in general would also work) but the rest pretty much just guarantees an unlimited number of massive downdecs by whales with an absurdly larger military, infra and resource base on lower tier folks.

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Curufinwe said:

So allowing 6k score people to declare on an unlimited number 50 score noobs? With unlimited war improvements?

What could possibly go wrong?

Removing beige for attackers is an okay idea (although reducing beige times in general would also work) but the rest pretty much just guarantees an unlimited number of massive downdecs by whales with an absurdly larger military, infra and resource base on lower tier folks.

 

And those whales in turn could have unlimited declarations done on them.

You're also forgetting the damage reduction aspect given the difference in scores.

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Guest Curufinwe
5 hours ago, Buorhann said:

 

And those whales in turn could have unlimited declarations done on them.

You're also forgetting the damage reduction aspect given the difference in scores.

Unless I'm misreading your OP, your proposed damage reduction would only apply to infra/loot, not military units.  Given that whales tend to have higher infrastructure (and therefore more space for military improvements), what you're proposing essentially just gives whales an easier method of militarily zeroing lower tier opponents without the risks associated with selling down.  Plus, of course, 'unlimited updecs' are not particularly useful when some guy with twice as many cities can instantly counter you despite having significantly more infra and units (and therefore a ridiculous military advantage).

Fixing beige so there's less disincentives to winning wars is a good idea, but the rest is just a recipe for whales beating the crap out of people they normally couldn't hit due to the current range restrictions, which would make 'assisting' in a meaningful way harder, rather than easier, for lower tier players.

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This is how I know you guys aren't really knowing how useful your current strategy is, or the extent of what you're capable of.

You are aware there is a very limited amount of rebuys in a day, correct?  Enough suicide hits, and you'll start draining said player.  You're also overlooking the lift on Improvement Restrictions, which would cater far more towards lower city nations that are specifically used for certain roles.

Whales would have to compete more on military upkeep and, if they so chose to expand their wars, would have to draw in more from loot to make it worthwhile (And with the reduction in infra/loot, that's awfully hard).

Sure, you're right, Whales could hit lower city counts with near impunity - but at a greater risk.

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10 minutes ago, Curufinwe said:

Unless I'm misreading your OP, your proposed damage reduction would only apply to infra/loot, not military units.  Given that whales tend to have higher infrastructure (and therefore more space for military improvements), what you're proposing essentially just gives whales an easier method of militarily zeroing lower tier opponents without the risks associated with selling down.  Plus, of course, 'unlimited updecs' are not particularly useful when some guy with twice as many cities can instantly counter you despite having significantly more infra and units (and therefore a ridiculous military advantage).

Fixing beige so there's less disincentives to winning wars is a good idea, but the rest is just a recipe for whales beating the crap out of people they normally couldn't hit due to the current range restrictions, which would make 'assisting' in a meaningful way harder, rather than easier, for lower tier players.

You do realize even a 32 city nation can fight off only so many 14 cities at once. Even if this 32 city has divine reflexes, and could somehow gain ground control, or air superiority or whatever they want on every one of his potentially dozens of attackers, it really does not matter. In the end, even with GC on all of them, his planes will be outnumbered by who knows how much, but for simplicity let's just say 10:1. If these 14 city nations fully militarize, too, which they should in such a scenario, note said 32 city nation will be completely outmatched across the board. 

You do understand in such a hypothetical system that NPO alone could gut Grumpy, Spanish Armada, and The Coalition simultaneously, right? Both sides would be capable of levying all of their forces against each other, and no matter how you try to look at that, NPO will outmatch the whales every single time. 

Actually, such an update would be beneficial to IQ in general, it makes them capable of a true swarm strategy, given that they currently outnumber opposing spheres by a massive margin. Those being of TKR and Rose, TKR's is quite small, but Rose, as demonstrated by the last war, and anti IQ in general, amount to 531 nations. IQ and friends, come out to 882. Imagine a world where IQ wouldn't need an upper tier because they well and truly swarm them with a death of 1000 cuts, and then try and tell me this would be nothing but good news for the whales.

Not even the very best fighters, no matter their size, can win something like that.

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1 hour ago, Lairah said:

for simplicity let's just say 10:1. If these 14 city nations fully militarize, too, which they should in such a scenario, note said 32 city nation will be completely outmatched across the board. 

You do understand in such a hypothetical system that NPO alone could gut Grumpy, Spanish Armada, and The Coalition simultaneously, right? Both sides would be capable of levying all of their forces against each other, and no matter how you try to look at that, NPO will outmatch the whales every single time. 
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Those being of TKR and Rose, TKR's is quite small, but Rose, as demonstrated by the last war, and anti IQ in general, amount to 531 nations. IQ and friends, come out to 882. 

 

Are you saying that a 32 city nation can take on 10 14 city ones? Even if we say one big nation can handle two, then under current game mechanics, this still wouldn't work IMO. 531:882 = 1:1.66. Just like we can have 32 city v/s 14 city, it'd go all the way down to 25 city v/s 10 city, 15 city v/s 3 city, etc.

 

The only time when a micro can win against a whale would be when two, may be three, micros are in a position to land four GAs together in the same turn, and one of those GAs end up in a victory. That'd mean that the whale would need to find a buddy to help defend him, cause even if they had more troops than any one of the micro aggressors, attacking them would make them loose more troops and be open to further GA defeats.

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14 hours ago, Curufinwe said:

So allowing 6k score people to declare on an unlimited number 50 score noobs? With unlimited war improvements?

What could possibly go wrong?

Removing beige for attackers is an okay idea (although reducing beige times in general would also work) but the rest pretty much just guarantees an unlimited number of massive downdecs by whales with an absurdly larger military, infra and resource base on lower tier folks.

 

 

 

When you create your nation, get a grace period of 30 days(or X days) or until you have 5 cities(or X cities), or X score. 

 

Why would a 6K player attack a noob player anyways? The extra cost of having an army is going to be more expensive than the loot he would be getting.

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