Pheonix Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 22 minutes ago, Lairah said: That's interesting, given that several of the wiki mods who police the wiki specifically to eradicate bias happen to be in IQ alliances, and even fighting in this war. I've heard of low self esteem before, but taking down 600 people for the ride just cause you don't like yourself sounds a bit extreme, and somehow i don't think that's the case. I find it far more probable that, given the only stats provided thus far have been from involved parties in the war, that these involved parties are inevitably, and even unintentionally, adding in their own bias. The only for this not to be true is if you think you are perfect, and if you think that, you clearly suffer delusions which require the aid of a mental health professional as soon as you are able to see one. Infact given new points made by others, it seems a general incompetent error is more likely. Typically adding bias to make yourself good doesn't work when you fudge your own side. First of all I don't hate myself?? Like dafuq?Sounds like your personal issue not mine. Also I ahve no clue what you mean with the 600 nations thing. I'm still looking for where the numbers on the wiki came from, can't find any sources... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quichwe10 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Pheonix said: First of all I don't hate myself?? Like dafuq?Sounds like your personal issue not mine. Also I ahve no clue what you mean with the 600 nations thing. I'm still looking for where the numbers on the wiki came from, can't find any sources... It's based on Frawley's calculations for infra and military losses via money, and Johan's calculations for resources worth looted. Micchan's confirmed at the very least that figures are accurate for TKR, suggesting that the the method used to get said info is fairly accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) I suppose folks like Moonshadow have a quota of one to each side. Non IQ has Moon Shadow original, and IQ has Pheonix, Moon Shadow lite. You will note that while the original bases their salt off of conspiracy theories, the lite version flourishes on flaming people with their salt, and being utterly incapable of properly comprehending the written english language. Frankly, both of you ought be hit with a gag order, you're making your respective alliances look bad. Edited April 16, 2018 by Lairah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Curufinwe Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Buorhann said: Sure, you could account for those too. I'm pretty sure they'll be doing well even then. You seem to be hitting that picture pretty hard. I've been enjoying those easy Ws though, thanks! Some of them have had some decent loot/cash on hand to keep me going, even in Attrition. You'd think some people would learn from Arrgh tactics. Well I mean how much do you really need to keep one ship going? I imagine even on attrition you can loot that every once and a while, even if you're otherwise zeroed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogar Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 58 minutes ago, Pheonix said: And what does that do... Destroy precious 4 infrastructure. When your zeroed and have 5k soldiers as your entire military, you know you have lost I averaged about 450 infra damage per naval attack against NPO in the six defensive wars I fought, that damage is not exactly cheap to recover from, unless you're running well below what you should be at per city. Quote if you carry your childhood with you, you never become older Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frawley Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 24 minutes ago, Valdoroth said: Point being, that tracking sheet is 100% useless for basing anything since everyone's data is wrong in one way or another. You can try to blame Alex for his stat tracker not working correctly, but ultimately you're the one using it. That's on you. If you want accuracy, you simply measure daily infra and military levels, then net those values. That's about all you really needed to look at. If you wanted to look at a very generalized, you track whole AA totals instead of individual players. The numbers of both should add up with errors being VM-ers and deletions. That is not an accurate way of measuring anything, people rebuy infra/military, different people do the damage in different orders (earlier infra is worth more etc) I could maintain a zero net under that just by spending a fortune rebuying my infra daily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Lairah said: I suppose folks like Moonshadow have a quota of one to each side. Non IQ has Moon Shadow original, and IQ has Pheonix, Moon Shadow lite. You will note that while the original bases their salt off of conspiracy theories, the lite version flourishes on flaming people with their salt, and being utterly incapable of properly comprehending the written english language. Frankly, both of you ought be hit with a gag order, you're making your respective alliances look bad. This is why we try to avoid this cancerous place, no matter how much logic we stuff into people, they still don't get it. I was really just dicking around but this is actually making me dumber, I can't possibly wrap my mind around the fact that KT & co believe they are winning, anyway, it's 2:40am and I gotta go so let's end it with some amazing logic... >Wars aren't won by your military >Any stat that shows IQ in a positive way is biased/incorrect >Having a few whales who are untouched by the war, will make us win >Beiging people while being zeroed is an effective strategy to take down BK >The Wiki is the most reliable place to get information, even though it doesn't link any sources >Our Alliance is getting obliterated but that's ok because we have whales that provide us with unlimited monies >Dont worry, our alliance members believe we are winning even though are leaders have been begging for peace for 3 weeks >Let's call this BK member a piece of shit because they used some actual brain cells >Our coalition has less than a third of the planes IQ does, and most of our planes are in our whales! But don't worry everyone, IQ will continue to bomb the shit outta us from the skies, and we will win! Somehow... Magically... Gn everyone Edited April 16, 2018 by Pheonix 5 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPants Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 58 minutes ago, Shiho Nishizumi said: Guess that explains why you have two wars with me and you're attacking me on both. I mistakenly attacked you on the duplicate one without realizing it but you managed to finish all 12 maps. It okay to see a bug and report it, but to actively exploit having double the MAPS with the duplicate war already starting with 12 MAPS is ridiculous. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 17 minutes ago, Mogar said: I averaged about 450 infra damage per naval attack against NPO in the six defensive wars I fought, that damage is not exactly cheap to recover from, unless you're running well below what you should be at per city. It's also not cheap to dish out, if you destory anything below 1k infra you loose more money than they do, and I highly doubt people buy higher than 1k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiho Nishizumi Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Just now, ForgotPants said: Guess that explains why you have two wars with me and you're attacking me on both. I mistakenly attacked you on the duplicate one without realizing it but you managed to finish all 12 maps. It okay to see a bug and report it, but to actively exploit having double the MAPS with the duplicate war already starting with 12 MAPS is ridiculous. You could've just zero'd my air faster with those two wars. It goes both ways. If anything, you can get more out of it than I do, because you're killing planes while I'm hitting armies and navies that don't exist. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPants Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 Just now, Shiho Nishizumi said: You could've just zero'd my air faster with those two wars. It goes both ways. If anything, you can get more out of it than I do, because you're killing planes while I'm hitting armies and navies that don't exist. Uh right, exploit a bug to zero your air. No thanks, like I said in my PM to you. I'll leave the exploiting to you and will wait for Alex to sort it out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiho Nishizumi Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 1 minute ago, ForgotPants said: Uh right, exploit a bug to zero your air. No thanks, like I said in my PM to you. I'll leave the exploiting to you and will wait for Alex to sort it out. Not a bug since, at most, it's human error, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Whatever helps you sleep at night bud. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPants Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Shiho Nishizumi said: Not a bug since, at most, it's human error, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Whatever helps you sleep at night bud. I don't think you know what a bug means really if you think bugs are only caused by non-human actions. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quichwe10 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 6 minutes ago, Pheonix said: This is why we try to avoid this cancerous place, no matter how much logic we stuff into people, they still don't get it. I was really just dicking around but this is actually making me dumber, I can't possibly wrap my mind around the fact that KT & co believe they are winning, anyway, it's 2:40am and I gotta go so let's end it with some amazing logic... >Wars aren't won by your military >Any stat that shows IQ in a positive way is biased/incorrect >Having a few whales who are untouched by the war, will make us win >Beiging people while being zeroed is an effective strategy to take down BK >The Wiki is the most reliable place to get information, even though it doesn't link any sources >Our Alliance is getting obliterated but that's ok because we have whales that provide us with unlimited monies >Dont worry, our alliance members believe we are winning even though are leaders have been begging for peace for 3 weeks >Let's call this BK member a piece of shit because they used some actual brain cells >Our coalition has less than a third of the planes IQ does, and most of our planes are in our whales! But don't worry everyone, IQ will continue to bomb the shit outta us from the skies, and we will win! Somehow... Magically Gn everyone Stats were taken from the previous thread. A big portion of why I'm calling bullshit is that calculations from Frawley showed a 30 Billion difference in net damages between alliances around 10-11 days ago, with 85 Billion in damage taken by us, and 113 billion taken by IQ. This war's lasted almost a month by now, and the most juicy and most damaging losses were already caused in the opening first few rounds of fighting. I find it hard to believe that there's been an almost 40 billion in damage difference between the two coalitions in the last 10 days. And we aren't even looking at resource losses yet. That stuff pushed us into the 50 billion damage difference between coalitions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, Quichwe10 said: Stats were taken from the previous thread. A big portion of why I'm calling bullshit is that calculations from Frawley showed a 30 Billion difference in net damages between alliances around 10-11 days ago, with 85 Billion in damage taken by us, and 113 billion taken by IQ. This war's lasted almost a month by now, and the most juicy and most damaging losses were already caused in the opening first few rounds of fighting. I find it hard to believe that there's been an almost 40 billion in damage difference between the two coalitions in the last 10 days. And we aren't even looking at resource losses yet. That stuff pushed us into the 50 billion damage difference between coalitions. One word... Rose And the fact that we are absolutely steam rolling everyone.. Edited April 16, 2018 by Pheonix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPants Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 23 minutes ago, Pheonix said: This is why we try to avoid this cancerous place, no matter how much logic we stuff into people, they still don't get it. I was really just dicking around but this is actually making me dumber, I can't possibly wrap my mind around the fact that KT & co believe they are winning, anyway, it's 2:40am and I gotta go so let's end it with some amazing logic... >Wars aren't won by your military >Any stat that shows IQ in a positive way is biased/incorrect >Having a few whales who are untouched by the war, will make us win >Beiging people while being zeroed is an effective strategy to take down BK >The Wiki is the most reliable place to get information, even though it doesn't link any sources >Our Alliance is getting obliterated but that's ok because we have whales that provide us with unlimited monies >Dont worry, our alliance members believe we are winning even though are leaders have been begging for peace for 3 weeks >Let's call this BK member a piece of shit because they used some actual brain cells >Our coalition has less than a third of the planes IQ does, and most of our planes are in our whales! But don't worry everyone, IQ will continue to bomb the shit outta us from the skies, and we will win! Somehow... Magically... Gn everyone Please don't use logic here. The people who think the pinnacle of their propaganda is posting "Cultural Victory" everywhere are feeling uncomfortable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zei-Sakura Alsainn Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, ForgotPants said: Please don't use logic here. The people who think the pinnacle of their propaganda is posting "Cultural Victory" everywhere are feeling uncomfortable. You know, you say that, and yet, logic shows us that the stats here conflict utterly with stats elsewhere. Not just on the wiki, but even Frawley's own, and he himself of course being a member of NPO is subject to the same consideration of potential bias. The difference is, the source in this thread deviates by an extreme margin from the corroborated story of other sources, who places thing in a range that lie far above what the numbers presented here would suggest. Using the logic you decry is missing, and lies slain by people in this thread we can see, well. You are right, it is slain. The murderer however, lies on your side of town, i'm afraid. 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForgotPants Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Lairah said: You know, you say that, and yet, logic shows us that the stats here conflict utterly with stats elsewhere. Not just on the wiki, but even Frawley's own, and he himself of course being a member of NPO is subject to the same consideration of potential bias. The difference is, the source in this thread deviates by an extreme margin from the corroborated story of other sources, who places thing in a range that lie far above what the numbers presented here would suggest. Using the logic you decry is missing, and lies slain by people in this thread we can see, well. You are right, it is slain. The murderer however, lies on your side of town, i'm afraid. A lot of what Phoenix posted has very little to do with stats. With people claiming planes do not matter to rejoicing at victory on their 1 ship attacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roquentin Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, Lairah said: You know, you say that, and yet, logic shows us that the stats here conflict utterly with stats elsewhere. Not just on the wiki, but even Frawley's own, and he himself of course being a member of NPO is subject to the same consideration of potential bias. The difference is, the source in this thread deviates by an extreme margin from the corroborated story of other sources, who places thing in a range that lie far above what the numbers presented here would suggest. Using the logic you decry is missing, and lies slain by people in this thread we can see, well. You are right, it is slain. The murderer however, lies on your side of town, i'm afraid. The source used for the topic is the one people traditionally went off of in previous wars. While there are attempts to refine stat collecting which use different formulas, they're not fully fleshed out as of yet and have been in contention. Over time, the efforts of those currently trying will culminate in a different standard, but there's no reason for people to say this one is an attempt to obscure reality. Edited April 16, 2018 by Roquentin 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexio15 Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 @Frawley thanks for taking the time to compile stats. It's clear there are some discrepancies across the board. However that is neither here nor there, it happens and can always be hard to get the closest thing to real damages down. Although I applaud you for your hard work in doing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Buorhann Posted April 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Pheonix said: This is why we try to avoid this cancerous place, no matter how much logic we stuff into people, they still don't get it. >how much logic WE stuff into people Woo boy. 2 hours ago, durmij said: >Doesn't list the near 100 nations deleted >BK absorbed 3 Alliances now @Pheonix - Explain this. I just want to know what your logic tells you. Edited April 16, 2018 by Buorhann 3 4 2 Quote Warrior of Dio https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfPCFQfOnLg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rozalia Posted April 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, LeotheGreat said: lol the only one there that was a coalition member when the war started was OWR. Cerbwas dead before and the other are sub 50 micros that fought for a few days then left. If you defeating Kingsmen and Horsemen and Typhon means you defeated IQ you are in for a rude shock. Acadia is at 38. United Purple Nations is at 28. Polaris is at 29. The United Empire of ZahAharon is at 30. Orange Defense Network is at 28. Total nations = 153 How alliances can continue when BK top guys pronounce their alliances to be "flies" and "irrelevant" I do not know. Very low self respect I guess. As Who Me at BK previously said, alliances unlike yours just exist to be swatted, which sounds great when most of your allies are such alliances. IQ may well be the worse Bloc ever with the sheer lack of care for their minions, I mean friends, I mean minions. You have NPO who doesn't care but is smart to keep it's mouth shut so some doubt exists. Then you have BK who are fools who can't learn to close it and so take away any such doubt that might exist. Edited April 16, 2018 by Rozalia 13 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prefonteen Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 My penis is bigger. Seriously though. Be careful how you speak about your allies. That shit tends to boomerang. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roquentin Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) He can correct me, but fairly sure he meant sub-rank 50, not sub 50 member count. The point he made was that most of the alliances that peaced out weren't having an overall impact on the war since they were mostly very low city count. For most of them, no one was planning on having them join the war, but they volunteered to do so once it was under way. Edited April 16, 2018 by Roquentin 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozalia Posted April 16, 2018 Share Posted April 16, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Roquentin said: He can correct me, but fairly sure he meant sub-rank 50, not sub 50 member count. The point he made was that most of the alliances that peaced out weren't having an overall impact on the war since they were mostly very low city count. For most of them, no one was planning on having them join the war, but they volunteered to do so once it was under way. We'll see what he says then. If he can smarten up a bit he'll take your view of such things rather than the one of those under him. Regardless, demeaning anyone not named Cerebus on that list (for obvious reasons that they flipped instantly) is ill advised as things such as "they weren't having an effect" easily applies to others. Edited April 16, 2018 by Rozalia 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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