Jump to content

Old FA vs Current FA


Jodo
 Share

Recommended Posts

Totally.

Building inroads and establishing secure ties with other alliances that make up the current "hegemoney" has never, ever worked before.

That's no way to establish security or gain influence. No way, no how.

The alliances won't sign you, it's not just me. They, across the board won't sign any alliances that aren't in Syndisphere. It's literally impossible.

 

For example, Lordaeron approached one alliance in Syndisphere of good standing, it's in the top 20, and was told for us to sign them we'd have to drop Acadia and NPO because they didn't want treaty issues down the road. This has happened on more than one occasion.

  • Upvote 1

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh, forgot this bit. I want to roll Lordaeron just because of you being annoying, honestly. Like super annoying. Asking questions that you know you're not going to get answers to since, obviously, our alliances are not on friendly terms.

 

Maybe want to learn that side of politics, Kastor.

 

I'll also be straight up honest - the only reason why I haven't pushed the Mensa community to roll Lordaeron (yet) is because of Rose. That treaty tie literally kept you safe when you annoyed us with your pestering questions in regards to our militarization. This is why I find you preaching about the politics here amusing.

As I said before, you can roll us or not, it doesn't matter and I don't care. You can roll us and our allies, and it won't matter. Rolling Lordaeron will literally bring you nothing nor will it hurt you, either way you rolling us doesn't matter. I told you that before, and I'll say it as long as you keep bringing this up.

 

EDIT: And if anyone wants the logs of that, I'll give them, as long as Hippo doesn't mind. All I did was suggest Mensa was hitting SK then he got super pissed and threatened to roll Lordaeron and their allies.

Edited by Kylo Ren

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So your answer is for every single alliance on Orbis to join your paper blob, that's your answer for shaking things up?

No, I'm not offering answers, but it is certainly an alternative option. And not a completely impossible one.

One must imagine Sisyphus happy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mensa-synd effectively won the game at this point, lol.

Not necessarily.

I predict Mensa to have troubles with their "friends" soon enough. Its amazing what dealings happen when listening to Knights and Businessmen.

Edited by The King in Yellow
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Did I mention spies in the OP? I mean, I'm tired, but I don't think I did?

 

Play the game how you want. Please do. All I'm doing is offering my personal insight on why that may or may not work out so well. Thanks for letting me know how horrid I am I guess? You seemed to enjoy it at the time. I guess I was distracted with hanging out with the members playing games, hearing about their families, growing up, or blowing up charities with the boys for low income school kids. I still got the thank you cards. I don't recall you being around much then. Or... well, much of ever.

 

Ah well. I'm only rubbish.

 

You forgot hypocrite. 

 

Look at you trying to humble-grab about RL aspects when the only thing talked about was ingame aspects. Attempt to redirect your failings as a leader in game with "I'm totes a good guy irl", way to try and bring it outside the realm of the game, because man, that would end badly for you. 

 

As for the spies, I only brought them up because I did complain about that being an exploit, thus I did complain about an aspect of the war. Considering I was talking about complaining it was relevant. Sorry that reading comprehension failed you. But like you said, you are trash. 

scSqPGJ.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mensa-synd effectively won the game at this point, lol.

This. Within two weeks every alliance that could possible oppose the Sydnisphere will be in rebuilding. Meanwhile tS and friends are coming off an econ project that significantly bolstered their alliances. 

 

This is basically another git gud thread. Except you're telling us to do with less while you have only gained more. You've earned your hegemoney so if you want to keep it, do so, but know that it has ramifications on the game, and lack of competition is going to be one. 

Edited by Pangui
  • Upvote 3
0Lovl.png
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lets take for example, Obelisk and The Commonwealth. 2 Alliances that could literally have went anywhere, chose to ally into OO. Then Consolidate even more by allying each other. Then the Cornerstone-BoC MDP, along with the tTO-BK MDP do the same. Then Rose signed Obelisk with their only MD treaty outside Syndisphere is Lordaeron. I mean, there's nothing anyone outside Syndisphere can do except wait to get rolled.

 

TBF to Obelisk it was born of a protectorate to OO, what motivation is there to leave it? Also, why would these alliances choose anyone else, when it seems that the popular opinion is that all that will happen is that you get rolled? Thinking that your making the game "better" is hardly a consolation when you are being rolled. Alliances have no duty to the game, just to their members. It would be honestly be bad FA to NOT join Syndi/OO if you had the option too.

 

Listen, if you are all dancing to the same tune, the lack of paper doesn't matter - This is something that gets thrown around a bunch it seems. In the Valyria war I actually worked together with Arrgh in an effort to quickly get peace. During the Silent War RW originally was not going to hit Pantheon until after hearing about it deciding that it'd be smarter to enter in through that path. Pre doesn't run RW nor Arrgh people, he isn't some autocratic (over us, he can run his alliance as he likes) superman who shoots thunder out his arse.

 

Get others - First in regards to paperless this talk of get others with treaties and such is hogwash talk so I'll just talk about the rest. Let me ask why are the hanger ons in this affair are even attacking right now? There was no threat to anyone on TKR's side. As they went on the offensive there still is no danger, they were going to win and not with all that much difficulty. Yet still the hanger ons prostrate themselves and attack aggressively. I know that a lot of those alliances wouldn't normally dream of going on the offensive for a reason like this and yet they do. Why? And once you give the answer then ask if their state is as such they'd do this, why would they break ties?

 

Two points in regards to this. The first is that the paperless sphere no longer has the Realpolitik vibe that it used to. Paperless used to be a freeing concept, but now in a way it has become a series of alliances between Test/RW/Arrgh that are merely not in paper, but stand anyways. This talk about Pantheon is an example. You had no obligation to that I am aware of, but did once your friends did, you did. AKA an alliance. VE was not targeted despite being paperless, and this is because they were not perceived as part of the sphere, which shouldn't even exist due to being paperless.

 

As for the hanger ons, they may get shit on, but they do it for a reason. People in this game have a long memory, and allies want to see effort on their allies part, even if it has little practical effect. If you appear to have no value and are using treaties as a shield, guess whos paper might get burned when push comes to shove.

 

The other issue, and the part you are correct in, is that the most of the non t$-OO alliances are just frankly, really shit. So the remaining alliances that aren't shit have to deal with shit alliances. NPO is a prime example, even if most of t$-oo refuses to admit it, they are a pretty strong, solid alliance with a decent amount of potential. What would you propose they do exactly? Magically make all their allies not shit?

 

NPO is in an interesting catch 22. They themselves have potential, but are weighed down by their allies and cant reach it while tied to them. Drop the allies and they leave themselves exposed. No-one in BK thinks NPO is shit, and we respect them for what they achieved last war, but they are in an FA predicament for the future.

 

The alliances won't sign you, it's not just me. They, across the board won't sign any alliances that aren't in Syndisphere. It's literally impossible.

 

For example, Lordaeron approached one alliance in Syndisphere of good standing, it's in the top 20, and was told for us to sign them we'd have to drop Acadia and NPO because they didn't want treaty issues down the road. This has happened on more than one occasion.

 

Well why would they sign a treaty they know won't work? Muddying the water only works till there is a war, when people will fall into what they are expected to do. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On top of that, we can't pull alliances away from you either. No alliance will sign an outside treaty with someone in the opposite sphere. 

 

You do realize that's exactly what happened with SK right? There's a few alliances that I think could be pulled away with some effort.

☾☆


High Priest of Dio

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You forgot hypocrite. 

 

Look at you trying to humble-grab about RL aspects when the only thing talked about was ingame aspects. Attempt to redirect your failings as a leader in game with "I'm totes a good guy irl", way to try and bring it outside the realm of the game, because man, that would end badly for you. 

 

As for the spies, I only brought them up because I did complain about that being an exploit, thus I did complain about an aspect of the war. Considering I was talking about complaining it was relevant. Sorry that reading comprehension failed you. But like you said, you are trash. 

The !@#$? You literally said yesterday and just now that I'm shit and TEst threw me out. Don't get uppity because someone fired back for your ooc nonsense about things you have no idea about.

 

Listen dude. I know this might be a hard concept, but just go back to whatever back room you have and just shitpost there. Do yourself at least that much.

 

Edit: lol, screw it. Its a game dude. You need to relax. I've said what I needed here with the op. Enjoy the show everyone.

Edited by Jodo

q8nfyvc.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The !@#$? You literally said yesterday and just now that I'm shit and TEst threw me out. Don't get uppity because someone fired back for your ooc nonsense about things you have no idea about.

 

Listen dude. I know this might be a hard concept, but just go back to whatever back room you have and just shitpost there. Do yourself at least that much.

 

I said they threw you out because of inept leadership yesterday. Today I said you don't get to tell TEst what to do because you were horrid, thus you were horrid at leading. Reading is important.

 

giphy-facebook_s.jpg

 

You seem to have a problem differentiating between being told your a bad leader and thinking that it means you're a bad person IRL. Insecurities man. 

 

Edit: I think you should actually listen to your own edit advice there. I've been talking about the game the whole time.

Edited by Prefontaine
  • Upvote 1

scSqPGJ.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Within two weeks every alliance that could possible oppose the Sydnisphere will be in rebuilding. Meanwhile tS and friends are coming off an econ project that significantly bolstered their alliances.

 

>You think this war will end in two weeks.

 

Oh boy, do I have some news for you.

☾☆


High Priest of Dio

Link to comment
Share on other sites

TBF to Obelisk it was born of a protectorate to OO, what motivation is there to leave it? Also, why would these alliances choose anyone else, when it seems that the popular opinion is that all that will happen is that you get rolled? Thinking that your making the game "better" is hardly a consolation when you are being rolled. Alliances have no duty to the game, just to their members. It would be honestly be bad FA to NOT join Syndi/OO if you had the option too.

 

 

Two points in regards to this. The first is that the paperless sphere no longer has the Realpolitik vibe that it used to. Paperless used to be a freeing concept, but now in a way it has become a series of alliances between Test/RW/Arrgh that are merely not in paper, but stand anyways. This talk about Pantheon is an example. You had no obligation to that I am aware of, but did once your friends did, you did. AKA an alliance. VE was not targeted despite being paperless, and this is because they were not perceived as part of the sphere, which shouldn't even exist due to being paperless.

 

As for the hanger ons, they may get shit on, but they do it for a reason. People in this game have a long memory, and allies want to see effort on their allies part, even if it has little practical effect. If you appear to have no value and are using treaties as a shield, guess whos paper might get burned when push comes to shove.

 

 

NPO is in an interesting catch 22. They themselves have potential, but are weighed down by their allies and cant reach it while tied to them. Drop the allies and they leave themselves exposed. No-one in BK thinks NPO is shit, and we respect them for what they achieved last war, but they are in an FA predicament for the future.

 

 

Well why would they sign a treaty they know won't work? Muddying the water only works till there is a war, when people will fall into what they are expected to do. 

1. I guess, just using them as an example but to get to your point, that's what I'm saying. The game is dead because of Syndisphere. Case and point. You can try to say all these things and all these ideas to other alliances but you have realize that we've tried and they're not doing it. Then you get to the point where most alliances aren't strong enough to protect syndisphere alliances because they've been rolled so much. There's no reason to not join you guys, so why would anyone not? If you think about it, in the last 2-3 months, Lordaeron and Polaris are the only alliances in Orbis to not sign a treaty with Syndisphere. Everyone else was a protectorate.

 

2. You're forgetting Paperless ties are more like secret treaties. You just don't know its there.

 

3. kk Agreed.

 

4.Only, but lets be honest, if that was the case then NPO would just end up joining Syndisphere and that wouldn't do anything. BK isn't leaving OO to hang with Syndisphere. On top of that, there's no significant advantage for BK to ally NPO. I mean, it pretty much confirms the lower tier for you but in any war BK would want Mid-tier/High Tier help.

 

5. Then we're back to just joining Syndisphere, which isn't an answer.

  • Upvote 1

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The alliances won't sign you, it's not just me. They, across the board won't sign any alliances that aren't in Syndisphere. It's literally impossible.

 

For example, Lordaeron approached one alliance in Syndisphere of good standing, it's in the top 20, and was told for us to sign them we'd have to drop Acadia and NPO because they didn't want treaty issues down the road. This has happened on more than one occasion.

 

 

First, Mensa and Rose signed a treaty.  And trust me, there were some issues with that we had to work through, but we did.

 

Second, Syndicate attempted to sign a treaty with UPN - UPN threw it away.

 

Also, BoC and Cornerstone were not previously Syndi/OOsphere - yet they developed relations with OO just fine despite being initial enemies.

 

We also worked with TLF briefly, but unfortunately there was no follow through with that.

 

 

There's also other examples, but those are the ones on the top of my head.  Syndi/OOsphere is completely willing to work with others or help give some advice (There's plenty given).  However, we're not going to split because our usual rivals keep crying about it.  You guys are doing a fine job splitting up yourselves, when you should be working to amend things instead.  I've seen logs of some ParaCov leaders in the past bickering about each other because of some dumb issue, and some of them got hung up because of such drama.

 

Congrats, you're learning our FA by posting out of your ass.

 

Lastly, no one takes you serious with signing Syndi/OOsphere.  It has nothing to do with people in your alliance, it has everything to do with you and your reputation.  We'd be stupid to trust you, that's why you were probably told to drop Acadia/NPO to see how serious you were.

  • Downvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You do realize that's exactly what happened with SK right? There's a few alliances that I think could be pulled away with some effort.

Yeah, there's a few, but not enough to make a legitimate difference, and you guys are rolling everything that breathes, so they'd just get rolled if they did it. You can say they won't but, well, actions speak louder than words.

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, Mensa and Rose signed a treaty.  And trust me, there were some issues with that we had to work through, but we did.

 

Second, Syndicate attempted to sign a treaty with UPN - UPN threw it away.

 

Also, BoC and Cornerstone were not previously Syndi/OOsphere - yet they developed relations with OO just fine despite being initial enemies.

 

We also worked with TLF briefly, but unfortunately there was no follow through with that.

 

 

There's also other examples, but those are the ones on the top of my head.  Syndi/OOsphere is completely willing to work with others or help give some advice (There's plenty given).  However, we're not going to split because our usual rivals keep crying about it.  You guys are doing a fine job splitting up yourselves, when you should be working to amend things instead.  I've seen logs of some ParaCov leaders in the past bickering about each other because of some dumb issue, and some of them got hung up because of such drama.

 

Congrats, you're learning our FA by posting out of your ass.

 

Lastly, no one takes you serious with signing Syndi/OOsphere.  It has nothing to do with people in your alliance, it has everything to do with you and your reputation.  We'd be stupid to trust you, that's why you were probably told to drop Acadia/NPO to see how serious you were.

1. Congrats on signing Rose. 10/10. It effectively pulled them into Syndisphere.

2. That ODP with UPN was going to be used against them, lets not pretend like it wasn't.

3. They were never really enemies, they just fought against each other. Cornerstone wasn't really big into politics back then and BoC was more or less just a third of TC and did what they said/wanted. There was no bad blood between them. 

4. Never heard about TLF, congrats if you did.

5. You're willing to work with others provided that they join Syndisphere. There are more than enough cases throughout history of this. 

6. I'm not posting out of my ass, you just refuse to listen because that would require you to take away from the "Kastor is a troll" narrative for 5 minutes. But oh well.

7. I disagree, and there is nothing to back you up here. Literally nothing.

  • Upvote 2

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. Congrats on signing Rose. 10/10. It effectively pulled them into Syndisphere.

2. That ODP with UPN was going to be used against them, lets not pretend like it wasn't.

3. They were never really enemies, they just fought against each other. Cornerstone wasn't really big into politics back then and BoC was more or less just a third of TC and did what they said/wanted. There was no bad blood between them. 

4. Never heard about TLF, congrats if you did.

5. You're willing to work with others provided that they join Syndisphere. There are more than enough cases throughout history of this. 

6. I'm not posting out of my ass, you just refuse to listen because that would require you to take away from the "Kastor is a troll" narrative for 5 minutes. But oh well.

7. I disagree, and there is nothing to back you up here. Literally nothing.

 

1. Thanks

2. Exactly how?

3. >"They, across the board won't sign any alliances that aren't in Syndisphere. It's literally impossible."

4. Thanks

5. No.  Did TLF join Syndisphere?

6. You're posting out of your ass.

7. You can disagree all you want.

  • Upvote 1
  • Downvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1. Thanks

2. Exactly how?

3. >"They, across the board won't sign any alliances that aren't in Syndisphere. It's literally impossible."

4. Thanks

5. No.  Did TLF join Syndisphere?

6. You're posting out of your ass.

7. You can disagree all you want.

3. Both BoC and Cornerstone dropped their treaties BEFORE or DURING their transition into Syndisphere. So yet again, my point stands.

5, TLF has been in Syndisphere for awhile(OO branch) but I have no idea when you reached out to them. 

6. You're posting out of your ass.

7. You have no evidence to back it up. I've been a leader for 2 months and Roz Wei helped its "allies" when I was in gov there so I'm not really seeing what you're saying here, and I didn't cross anyone then so why would I now?

IMG_2989.png?ex=65e9efa9&is=65d77aa9&hm=

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Looks like we're getting a lesson taught by Kastor on politics guys.

 

DEIC and NA Confeds were already small alliances, but they packed a decent punch. They merged. They did something.

 

NPO remains small due to either their dumb growth program or their own decision, depending on who you talk to about it (They always give a different answer).  But apparently the community loves each other very much, so they're ok with it.

 

UPN got shafted because of Hans. They refused to listen to their members base, they turned down a treaty with Syndicate which could've potentially altered something, and due to being absolutely shit and stubborn with leadership - they lost a good chunk of their active memberbase.

 

NPO and UPN are not Syndi/OOsphere's fault. It's their own. They dug this hole, not us.

 

Atleast Acadia did something. Granted it's small, but they did something.

 

 

 

In regards to TKR, just look at their alliance page.  They delegated their powers like crazy, giving people roles that make them feel important.  I've talked to multiple gov members of TKR for various reasons, even players in roles that I don't even know (Well, I know most of them now).  They encourage their community to be active along with their allies.  It's fantastic.  Definitely a top alliance.

 

NPO could easily match TKR if they even followed half the footsteps that TKR does.  They have numbers, they have the strong community feeling, but they're seemingly reclusive away from the Orbis community.  TKR is not.

 

This is so far off. You're comparing apples and oranges. TKR is an alliance that has always been on the winning side from its inception. It is a lot easier to play as a winning side alliance than otherwise in every aspect of the game, both mechanical and FA-wise.

 

Most of their FA groundwork was actually laid when they were using slack and everyone else was using IRC, so they weren't particularly  out there in the public aside from some posters.  It's not comparable in the slightest.  Your attributing their success to their recent gov expansion is really far off. I'm not taking away from what they've done, but attributing what amounts to a years long process to these recent developments is inaccurate. They got powerful and then expanded their presence, not the other way around.

 

Orbis "community" is mostly on one side, which usually results in open hostility, which is why we get sick of the interaction and why it appears we're reclusive.  The atmosphere on these forums and on discord is often pretty toxic. You can call it whining, but posts like this are exactly the reason. We've been perfectly willing to have serious discussions with everyone even if we pointedly disagree.

 

Paperless interacts with the community all the time, but you managed to start multiple wars against them at this point.

 

---

 

On the general topic,  it's a usual progression for games to consolidate into one megasphere, just the pace at which has happened has been fast and the relations haven't frayed like they would in other hegemoney situations, so we're in a situation where everyone is comfortable with their position and no one wants to change things. Wars are frequent and relationships take much longer to fall apart in comfortable situations. The govs have largely remained the same in the ruling bloc, so they're used to working with each other and for many that have come up through the system it's all they know. It's just always been kind of ironic given all the talk about how this was such a politically dynamic game and how Paracov were stagnating it for signing the treaties or that import alliances were stagnaters and this was some sort of utopia that didn't replicate the same patterns and people did things to keep it fresh.

Edited by Roquentin
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and the Guidelines of the game and community.