The alt-right

[Clarke]

Its almost like you're forgetting you were defending a genocide. 

[LordRahl2]

Its almost like you're forgetting you were defending a genocide.

A perfect example of your "logic". Most of what Kemal did was to provide a logical proof that if a=b and a=c then c=b. It is about the most basic proof availible (this is why roz fled in terror from the argument). The fact that you cannot recognize it is telling.

 

But then your argument about why you are the logic master is pretty strong. "Because I said so" is very convincing.

[Clarke]

A perfect example of your "logic". Most of what Kemal did was to provide a logical proof that if a=b and a=c then c=b. It is about the most basic proof availible (this is why roz fled in terror from the argument). The fact that you cannot recognize it is telling.

 

But then your argument about why you are the logic master is pretty strong. "Because I said so" is very convincing.

Deflecting in situations about issues such as those equates defending, a certain degree of it anyway but its clear he has no love for Armenians. His "logical proof" wasn't very logical. 

[LordRahl2]

Deflecting in situations about issues such as those equates defending, a certain degree of it anyway but its clear he has no love for Armenians. His "logical proof" wasn't very logical. 

 

No, it was.  You just cannot identify a basic logic argument.

 

I do agree that Roz deflects as much as he can but I do not equate that to a "defense".

[Moreau]

ROZALIA IS NOT A RATIONAL HUMAN BEING. QUITE WASTING YOUR TIME.

 

[Rozalia]

ROZALIA IS NOT A RATIONAL HUMAN BEING. QUITE WASTING YOUR TIME.

 

 

Unlike your other one I actually saw that one and liked it (though maybe they were the same?). You got more spirit than the soulless globalists and I like that. The "encourage bestiality" bit at the end made made it all the more special thought it's obviously all lies. Next time put "encourages Polyandry" at the end instead as that would be factual. Polyandry because you can't put Polygamy or Polyamory as you support Polygamy yourself so I'd find it odd if you were to put encouraging Polygamy as an attack, but Polyandry would work.  

 

Edit: Use something that doesn't delete what you upload mate.

Edited September 3, 2016 by Rozalia

[SoS]

Whatever, it doesn't discredit anything I've said about sources. At the end of the day, news networks, state funded or not are not good to gather unbiased information, as all news networks have ulterior motives about each piece of news they deliver, whether it be in the format for which they deliver it in, or if they choose to cover a story at all.

The reason for cable news bias is the nature of the market in its early days. Most of their customers were urban/liberal. That bias became entrenched in their culture, despite the fact cable news now has a thriving right bias market and a moderate market.

[MrsPigeon]

None of you are rational. Being alt-right is the equivalent of being influenced by a society that has leveraged fear and paranoia after 9/11 to its political advantage. Now they've gained enough influence to elect a president. They ruin it and show the world exactly how crazy they are. Being against globalization could be rational, but when the rest of your beliefs are based on xenophobic American exceptionalism, I can't take you seriously. I'm a fan of bringing manufacturing jobs back to the USA, even protectionist policies. But I'm definitely not going to blame Mexicans and the Chinese for our failures as a nation.

 

No matter where this country goes, we're not going to be prepared with the unpredictable future that lies ahead due to climate change. The alt-right blatantly deny climate change. This would mean denying scientific evidence. It's an illogical and dangerous trend in American conservatism.

Edited October 2, 2016 by RoboMonkey

[Sketchy]

Being alt-right is the equivalent of being influenced by a society that has leveraged fear and paranoia after 9/11 to its political advantage. Now they've gained enough influence to elect a president.

 

Except not all people who are alt-right hold the same views, and alt-right covers a lot more than just views on immigration.

 

That is like when people say, well all Trump supporters are white nationalists. Or even "all alt-right people are racists, homophobic, misognyist bigots".

[Beatrix]

So what is the definition of this "globalism" you're rejecting?

[Frederick]

The alt right is like nazis and white supremacists man.

[Sketchy]

The alt right is like nazis and white supremacists man.

Omg he said a bad word.

[Beatrix]

Planning both foreign and economic policy based on the needs of other nations, rather than the needs of the domestic. Globalism is responsible for the stagnation of the American economy (and to a further extent, the economy of the west), as it throws away jobs that are labour intensive to poorer nations, and creates an overpopulation of scholars and doctors. Service based economies stagnate without some sort of labour to export goods to other nations, and to a lesser extent, selling raw product to other nations, which is what we're seeing now.

 

The job market for labour intensive work is huge in America, but it is not being tapped into because there is some sort of preconceived notion that you can't be successful without a college degree so people are pissing away money that could otherwise be reinvested more wisely. This overpopulates the job market as people with Ivy League degrees are climbing over eachother to get a single job whilst there are labour jobs, estimated 5 million, (that are quickly disappearing due to the fact no one wants to work in these jobs, such as steel working or coal mining) that aren't being touched.

 

That is the globalism we reject.

 

So, you basically want an isolationist, N.Korea style economy? Could you name one instance where this has worked? I think the global trade market is actually the main reason the first world looks like the first world.

[Kemal Ergenekon]

Manufacturing jobs suck. You don't want to bring them back. You want more high-skilled jobs and better education. You want to become the white-collared workers of the world, not bring back the shitty blue collar jobs that pay a pittance when competition is a destitute guy near starvation in a third world hellhole.

[Beatrix]

Manufacturing jobs suck. You don't want to bring them back. You want more high-skilled jobs and better education. You want to become the white-collared workers of the world, not bring back the shitty blue collar jobs that pay a pittance when competition is a destitute guy near starvation in a third world hellhole.

 

God damn globalist propaganda right there.

[Sailor Jerry]

Manufacturing jobs suck. You don't want to bring them back. You want more high-skilled jobs and better education. You want to become the white-collared workers of the world, not bring back the shitty blue collar jobs that pay a pittance when competition is a destitute guy near starvation in a third world hellhole.

So what the !@#$ is wrong with "Blue Collar" jobs?  I did electronics in the U.S. Navy for just over 20 years and I'm now an "Instrument/Controls & Electrical" (IC&E) technician at 2 different natural-gas fired power plants.  With a fair bit of overtime, I clear 6 digits (to the left of the decimal for you wise asses) a year easy.  Is it hard work.....yes.  The problem with todays younger generation is that they feel they are entitled to everything and have to do nothing to get it.  So how old are you and what kind of job do you have?  God forbid any of the younger folks get their hands dirty with real work like turning wrenches and working in the fields.  Hell, it was good enough for your great grandparent, grandparents and parents, but you........no thank you....someone else should do those jobs and I'll sit in an office and manage them.  How did you earn the right to ever manage people, do you even know the job of those you want to manage?  I just spent the last two days working on "shaft voltages and grounding currents for turbine generators:  http://gaussbusters.com/images/uploads/Understanding_Shaft_Voltage_and_Grounding_Currents_of_Turbine_Generators_1.pdf

 

So would a cushy office job be nice.....depends on the person, but if younger Americans don't get off their lazy asses......and I mean soon, this country will for sure go to shit and it won't be because who we've elected and that old song and dance, its because people are starting to get too god damned lazy to do the work that needs to be done.  So shape up you young folks, because people like me won't be around forever to do the shitty "Blue-Collar" jobs that you despise so much......then what will you do?

[LordRahl2]

So what the !@#$ is wrong with "Blue Collar" jobs?  I did electronics in the U.S. Navy for just over 20 years and I'm now an "Instrument/Controls & Electrical" (IC&E) technician at 2 different natural-gas fired power plants.  With a fair bit of overtime, I clear 6 digits (to the left of the decimal for you wise asses) a year easy.  Is it hard work.....yes.  The problem with todays younger generation is that they feel they are entitled to everything and have to do nothing to get it.  So how old are you and what kind of job do you have?  God forbid any of the younger folks get their hands dirty with real work like turning wrenches and working in the fields.  Hell, it was good enough for your great grandparent, grandparents and parents, but you........no thank you....someone else should do those jobs and I'll sit in an office and manage them.  How did you earn the right to ever manage people, do you even know the job of those you want to manage?  I just spent the last two days working on "shaft voltages and grounding currents for turbine generators:  http://gaussbusters.com/images/uploads/Understanding_Shaft_Voltage_and_Grounding_Currents_of_Turbine_Generators_1.pdf

 

So would a cushy office job be nice.....depends on the person, but if younger Americans don't get off their lazy asses......and I mean soon, this country will for sure go to shit and it won't be because who we've elected and that old song and dance, its because people are starting to get too god damned lazy to do the work that needs to be done.  So shape up you young folks, because people like me won't be around forever to do the shitty "Blue-Collar" jobs that you despise so much......then what will you do?

 

So the Federal government provided you 20 years of experience and multiple training opportunities.  "Kids these days" would love to get their hands dirty for 6 figures.  But they cannot. 

 

The "old blue collar jobs" that Kemal is talking about are things like manually conducting riveting on the floor of an auto factory or manually caning food at a plant.  However, those jobs are gone gone.  Even if Trump jacked up tariffs to 100% they would be gone.  Companies would build auto plants, sure.  They would be manned by robots conducting that riveting.  Would that "create" jobs?  Sorta.  People with 20 years of experience and/or technical degrees/skills would get jobs working with and fixing robots.  However, those people can already find jobs in today's economy (for example they could be Instrument/Controls & Electrical (IC&E) technicians at natural-gas fired power plants).

 

Low skill, low education jobs are not and will never be (no matter how bigly Trump thinks about it) readily available in the numbers they used to be.

 

You do sorta have a point that many people will not travel to and work certain jobs such as picking strawberries in my old hometown (work I recommend that you avoid).  That being said such work in no way raises people into the 'middle class' (using a strictly economic definition of that).

[Kemal Ergenekon]

So what the !@#$ is wrong with "Blue Collar" jobs?  I did electronics in the U.S. Navy for just over 20 years and I'm now an "Instrument/Controls & Electrical" (IC&E) technician at 2 different natural-gas fired power plants.  With a fair bit of overtime, I clear 6 digits (to the left of the decimal for you wise asses) a year easy.  Is it hard work.....yes.  The problem with todays younger generation is that they feel they are entitled to everything and have to do nothing to get it.  So how old are you and what kind of job do you have?  God forbid any of the younger folks get their hands dirty with real work like turning wrenches and working in the fields.  Hell, it was good enough for your great grandparent, grandparents and parents, but you........no thank you....someone else should do those jobs and I'll sit in an office and manage them.  How did you earn the right to ever manage people, do you even know the job of those you want to manage?  I just spent the last two days working on "shaft voltages and grounding currents for turbine generators:  http://gaussbusters.com/images/uploads/Understanding_Shaft_Voltage_and_Grounding_Currents_of_Turbine_Generators_1.pdf

 

So would a cushy office job be nice.....depends on the person, but if younger Americans don't get off their lazy asses......and I mean soon, this country will for sure go to shit and it won't be because who we've elected and that old song and dance, its because people are starting to get too god damned lazy to do the work that needs to be done.  So shape up you young folks, because people like me won't be around forever to do the shitty "Blue-Collar" jobs that you despise so much......then what will you do?

 

Rahl already partially answered you.

 

I know very well the jobs that have gone to the third world. I come from the third world. They suck. They don't pay half of what a part-time worker in McDonalds earns and !@#$ up your health. Do you know how those blue jeans look old? Through a process called sandblasting that causes silicosis and lung cancer within a year or two of working. Yeah, real people die so that you can buy those cool blue jeans. Those jobs went to the third world. They were in Turkey for quite a bit, but then Turkey became a little bit better off, and the industry moved on to Egypt. Now it's the Egyptians dying for your cool jeans.

 

Me? I make those six figures in my ivory tower. But you can bet your ass I worked damn hard to get where I am at. Unfortunately I wasn't born with a citizenship which would allow me to work at one of the cushy US jobs even if I were uneducated. I sort of clawed my way to the top. But, nah, I don't do anything physical, and do not feel like less of a person for using my brains over my muscles.

[LordRahl2]

So, you basically want an isolationist, N.Korea style economy? Could you name one instance where this has worked? I think the global trade market is actually the main reason the first world looks like the first world.

 

The underlying anger has some justification.  Many members of the middle and lower classes in the "1st world" have seen their real income stagnate (at best) for a long time.  The only winners they see are the ultra rich.  The rich are not the only winners.  Conditions in the so called "third world" have improved massively. 

 

However, the fact that Billions of people have been lifted out of abject poverty that kept them constantly at the edge of death, that infant mortality (dead babies) has plunged globally, and life expectancy is WAY up globally does not matter if you or your cousin is out of work.  This is true because we see and experience things we are connected to as more "real" than what seems like just a statistic for extreme poverty in Bangladesh.

 

I can tell you that there are real people in Bangladesh (who would kill to be your cousin) however, your cousin and his inability to find a decent job is real to you.

[Kemal Ergenekon]

The underlying anger has some justification.  Many members of the middle and lower classes in the "1st world" have seen their real income stagnate (at best) for a long time.  The only winners they see are the ultra rich.  The rich are not the only winners.  Conditions in the so called "third world" have improved massively. 

 

However, the fact that Billions of people have been lifted out of abject poverty that kept them constantly at the edge of death, that infant mortality (dead babies) has plunged globally, and life expectancy is WAY up globally does not matter if you or your cousin is out of work.  This is true because we see and experience things we are connected to as more "real" than what seems like just a statistic for extreme poverty in Bangladesh.

 

I can tell you that there are real people in Bangladesh (who would kill to be your cousin) however, your cousin and his inability to find a decent job is real to you.

 

That's exactly true. And that's why the guys at the bottom of the pyramid who got the short end of the stick should ask for more redistribution, free or heavily subsidized education, and universal healthcare. Free trade increases total surplus, but winners do not compensate the losers. The losers have to show some teeth.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Kemal Ergenekon

[Thalmor]

The alt right is like nazis and white supremacists man.

 

There's also libertarians and people who are just against liberalism in general. We're a big tent of sorts.

[Doktor Avalanche]

There's also libertarians and people who are just against liberalism in general. We're a big tent of sorts.

Egads! Please do not associate any libertarian ideology to the Alt-Right because it does not exist. Sure, saying you want freedom and a free market sounds libertarian, but how the plan to achieve it is by no means libertarian at all.

[LordRahl2]

That's exactly true. And that's why the guys at the bottom of the pyramid who got the short end of the stick should ask for more redistribution, free or heavily subsidized education, and universal healthcare. Free trade increases total surplus, but winners do not compensate the losers. The losers have to show some teeth.

 

Yeah.  That is SOCIALISM.gif though and, for various reasons, Americans (particularly a subset of 'Muricans) have been habituated to react negatively to that word and the concept.  It is not crazy really.  Consider that the American Dream, which is a fundamental more for the US, is predicated that any man may move up the socioeconomic ladder via their own sweat.  The American Dream does not guarantee that mobility but the possibility must exist.  The concept is baked into our vision of ourselves.

Redistribution does not "fit" into that model.

 

Another group, who I would generally categorize as impressionable, find themselves facing little to no sociology-economic mobility.  They also come from a background that is often mono-culture - typically rural homogeneous settings.  Many are far from unintelligent but lack the opportunity that many rural citizens can find (and hence fulfill their American Dream).  A small subset are actually fundamentally racist and bigots.  The true bigots present a hypothesis that the "they" is the cause of "our" (this group's) troubles.  Such a convenient excuse offered with zero real science but lots of fake science persuades the impressionable youth.  This narrative describes the rise of subgroups that are allowed a voice in the public square.  Most reasonable people avoid the corner of the square they are speaking on.  Stormfront, 4chan /pol/, some of reddit are examples of this.  The movement talks to itself and invents its own norms and mores.  This is the alt-right.  Not every member is a racist bigot however the norms of the group became a platform for racism and bigotry.

 

Enter Trump.  Trump gained traction among the alt-right for forwarding the idiocy of birtherism that the early alt-right embraced.  Birtherism did not require open racism - it was enough to be accepted by the group as a champion.  Having gained a foothold there he expanded his base steadily over time until we reach our current state.  The fundamental underlying problem is a lack of the promised American Dream.  Your solution may be technically correct but is an anathema to the alt-right and unacceptable to the 30ish% that they can, ultimately, influence.

[Sketchy]

Egads! Please do not associate any libertarian ideology to the Alt-Right because it does not exist. Sure, saying you want freedom and a free market sounds libertarian, but how the plan to achieve it is by no means libertarian at all.

 

 

Except not all people who are alt-right hold the same views, and alt-right covers a lot more than just views on immigration.

 

That is like when people say, well all Trump supporters are white nationalists. Or even "all alt-right people are racists, homophobic, misognyist bigots".

[Kemal Ergenekon]

Yeah.  That is SOCIALISM.gif though and, for various reasons, Americans (particularly a subset of 'Muricans) have been habituated to react negatively to that word and the concept.  It is not crazy really.  Consider that the American Dream, which is a fundamental more for the US, is predicated that any man may move up the socioeconomic ladder via their own sweat.  The American Dream does not guarantee that mobility but the possibility must exist.  The concept is baked into our vision of ourselves.

Redistribution does not "fit" into that model.

 

"Redistribution does not fit into that model" sounds hollow when the golden age of the American Dream happened between 1945-1970 when the policies were much more socialist even though they weren't called as such.